My horse started pinning his ears when he would see his saddle coming his way so I have been riding him bareback. I have noticed sparse hairs where my bum sits and some where the top inside legs are (a few inches down from spine on either side). Is it possible that those hairs are from riding bareback?? Or is it more likely the from the saddle. I do have it shimmed in front as it is a little wide.I weigh no more than 160 lbs. Thanks!
[QUOTE=garlicbunny;7287830]
My horse started pinning his ears when he would see his saddle coming his way so I have been riding him bareback![/QUOTE]
It’s good you listened to him…it sounds like the white hairs were caused from pressure points where the saddle was sitting.
The white hairs are most likely from the ill fitting saddle.
ok great…thank you both so much. I wonder if it is shimmed a little too much up front. I will take a shim or two out and see how that works. I am though looking into finding a saddle that actually fits him without shimming! That is good news as I love to ride bareback and he seems to like it as well!
White hairs under the saddle are often an indication of fitting problems. If possible, work with a good fitter to find a saddle that suits you and fits your horse without shims or corrective pads. If you don’t have a knowledgeable fitter in your area, I highly recommend working with Nancy Okun of The Owl and the Rose Distance Tack. She can work long-distance through the use of templates (video tutorial on taking a template at http://pantherrunsaddlery.com/?page_id=434) and photos. She’s a competitive trail rider and a great fitter. Her email is nancybokun@gmail.com.
I have the same thing happening, and I am using a Bob Marshall saddle and a Dixie Midnight pad. I am not sure if the pad is too rough for her back, or if it is the saddle which is treeless- I weigh 120. Any advice would be great!
sbwinde, white hairs are usually the result of excess pressure. Have a reputable treeless fitter check your saddle, or work with a good treed-saddle fitter to find something new.
Sbwinde, you need a pad for treeless saddles, such as Skito. They have the material in them to keep the saddle off the spine and help distribute weight. I have a Bob Marshall and weigh about 120. I also use a Dixie Midnight under the Skito pad to keep it clean. And make sure you have the correct side of the DM towards your horse.
[QUOTE=sbwinde;7294194]
I have the same thing happening, and I am using a Bob Marshall saddle and a Dixie Midnight pad. I am not sure if the pad is too rough for her back, or if it is the saddle which is treeless- I weigh 120. Any advice would be great![/QUOTE]
When using treeless saddles the pad under the saddle is often as important as the saddle and should be considered as part of your saddling system as it is often the pad that provides spinal relief. Do you use any other pad besides the DM?
The “treeless saddle” has a design flaw: it does not effectively distribute weight. Adding in a pad, unless the pad is a functional rigid tree, will not solve the problem. If, indeed, the issue is a saddle that’s too small it will make the problem worse. Just like if you have a pair of shoes that are too tight you don’t make your feet feel better by adding another pair of socks.
You will shortly get lots of repsonses telling you I’m completely wrong as regards treeless saddles. As you consider them consider, too, that the Laws of Physics apply to all of us (whether or not we’ve ever studied Law or Physics). Then try this simple experiment: Find a small board (12" x 12" or so). Put on your Muck boots. Now find a muddy spot (one that’s nice and gooey). Step in it and note how deep your boot goes. Now smooth out the mud, put down the board, and step on the board. Note how deep your boot goes. This will graphically demonstrate that the treeless saddle does not distribute weight and permits the creation of two, small areas of intense pressure under your buttocks. Hence, the white hairs.
Ditch the treeless item and go get a real saddle that’s correctly fitted. Your horse’s back will thank you for it.
G.
[QUOTE=Guilherme;7295493]
The “treeless saddle” has a design flaw: it does not effectively distribute weight. Adding in a pad, unless the pad is a functional rigid tree, will not solve the problem. If, indeed, the issue is a saddle that’s too small it will make the problem worse. Just like if you have a pair of shoes that are too tight you don’t make your feet feel better by adding another pair of socks.
You will shortly get lots of repsonses telling you I’m completely wrong as regards treeless saddles. As you consider them consider, too, that the Laws of Physics apply to all of us (whether or not we’ve ever studied Law or Physics). Then try this simple experiment: Find a small board (12" x 12" or so). Put on your Muck boots. Now find a muddy spot (one that’s nice and gooey). Step in it and note how deep your boot goes. Now smooth out the mud, put down the board, and step on the board. Note how deep your boot goes. This will graphically demonstrate that the treeless saddle does not distribute weight and permits the creation of two, small areas of intense pressure under your buttocks. Hence, the white hairs.
Ditch the treeless item and go get a real saddle that’s correctly fitted. Your horse’s back will thank you for it.
G.[/QUOTE]
Sigh…
[QUOTE=cloudy18;7295049]
Sbwinde, you need a pad for treeless saddles, such as Skito. They have the material in them to keep the saddle off the spine and help distribute weight. I have a Bob Marshall and weigh about 120. I also use a Dixie Midnight under the Skito pad to keep it clean. And make sure you have the correct side of the DM towards your horse.[/QUOTE]
Thanks! I guess I should have mentioned that I use a Skito, but have the dixie midnight below that to help protect the Skito and keep her cool.
[QUOTE=Guilherme;7295493]
The “treeless saddle” has a design flaw: it does not effectively distribute weight. Adding in a pad, unless the pad is a functional rigid tree, will not solve the problem. If, indeed, the issue is a saddle that’s too small it will make the problem worse. Just like if you have a pair of shoes that are too tight you don’t make your feet feel better by adding another pair of socks.
You will shortly get lots of repsonses telling you I’m completely wrong as regards treeless saddles. As you consider them consider, too, that the Laws of Physics apply to all of us (whether or not we’ve ever studied Law or Physics). Then try this simple experiment: Find a small board (12" x 12" or so). Put on your Muck boots. Now find a muddy spot (one that’s nice and gooey). Step in it and note how deep your boot goes. Now smooth out the mud, put down the board, and step on the board. Note how deep your boot goes. This will graphically demonstrate that the treeless saddle does not distribute weight and permits the creation of two, small areas of intense pressure under your buttocks. Hence, the white hairs.
Ditch the treeless item and go get a real saddle that’s correctly fitted. Your horse’s back will thank you for it.
G.[/QUOTE]
Your analogy is deeply flawed. Have you seen or used a quality, properly fitted treeless saddle lately? They aren’t what they used to be 20 years ago. You keep ignoring the fact that top endurance riders who are competing in one of the few sports where the horses have to pass vet exams throughout the competition use treeless saddles very successfully. People who compete in these sports are hyper aware of their horses’ condition at all times. I doubt seriously that treeless saddles would have gotten any traction in the sport if they were inherently bad and were crippling horses. A properly fitted and padded treeless saddle can give excellent back protection. A poorly fitted and poorly padded treeless saddle can be just as disastrous as a poorly fitted treed saddle.
Guilherme, that’s a great analogy, and makes perfect sense - the tree does distribute the rider’s weight, and if that’s not done, problems can arise. But … and speaking as someone who fits treed saddles … I agree with PRS - treeless saddles are FAR better than they used to be, and they can be a good solution for some horses and riders. I think one of the issues with them is that many people have a misconception that they’re a “one size fits all, will work for any conformation” type of thing, and aren’t aware that they need to be properly fitted, same as a treed saddle does. I’ve seen ill-fitted saddles of both types do major damage to horses’ backs.
I’m satisfied that my analogy is “spot on.” Perhaps the treeless units are better than they used to be but that’s a terribly ambiguous statement. Saying that something is “more effective than it used to be” does not say it’s “effective enough.”
Folks are free to accept or reject my opinion as they will. Everyone is entitle to their own opinion; no one is entitled to their own facts. My experiment demonstrates a physical fact. Accept or reject its applicability as you will. After all, there is no consequence to me. The only consequence will be to your horse’s back.
G.
G.
[QUOTE=Guilherme;7295493]
Then try this simple experiment: Find a small board (12" x 12" or so). Put on your Muck boots. Now find a muddy spot (one that’s nice and gooey). Step in it and note how deep your boot goes. G.[/QUOTE]
I assume in your analogy that the muck boot represents my butt pressure on my horses back sinking into the mud with NO protection. Where are the layers of foam, leather and felt that represent my treeless saddle? Where is the structure that holds that all together to help spread the weight of said muck boot (butt)?
[QUOTE=Guilherme;7295493]
Now smooth out the mud, put down the board, and step on the board. Note how deep your boot goes. This will graphically demonstrate that the treeless saddle does not distribute weight and permits the creation of two, small areas of intense pressure under your buttocks. Hence, the white hairs. [/QUOTE]
Sure this is going to spread out the pressure better than “NOTHING”! I propose that you quit offering your uninformed opinion about something that you have no first hand knowledge of and put your hands on and BUTT in a well fitted quality treeless saddle and THEN offer your opinion on whether it works or not. Not all treeless saddles are created equal, some can and do cause pressure points, especially if not properly padded or fitted but there are certainly enough of them in use successfully to convince me that they are here to stay. The winners of the TEVIS cup for the last several years have been using them, that should tell you something right there.
