Unlimited access >

UPDATE now it’s hoof/suspensory/stifles. Holy kissing spine Batman!

If you dig it up could you share the study? I would be curious to see the info :slight_smile:

3 Likes

Sadly with KS its case by case.

As many other have not had success with Mesotherapy, I was hesitant to do it myself. My guy is turning 19 this year, I’ve known about his for about 7-ish years and have managed until last year. We had an uncharacteristic change in behavior last March which sent me down the spiraling hole of diagnostics.

Turns out it was still his KS, where I thought we had it managed and all was good. I was given the option of surgery, but with him being in his 18th year, I opted to see my other options and did some of my own research. I reached out to a few vets for opinions and guidance.

I am big on massage/cranial sacral for him, Chiro is not his thing and absolutely hates it, so I don’t do it anymore. He has the best response with cranial sacral massage, she’s been with us since 2018 and he’s his best with her in our team. He gets his hocks injected every spring, which started when we found the KS. Its been enough to manage, with obviously proper saddle fit, raised poles. He is worked long and low first, over his back, to build core and top line.

Last year, with all the ups and downs of the unknown, I chose not to do surgery as he is older and didn’t seem like the right option, yet. I took the Cortisone injection route, we injected 4 spots. Along with Mesotherapy. I have read Meso can last days, months, years, depending on the horse. Mesotherapy was the game changer for us. The relaxation in his back to allow the muscles to loosen and rebuild without tension. His muscle has never been more malleable. Its insane. We are officially at a year of one time Mesotherapy/Cortisone shots.

We recently moved barns, we boarded at a lovely facility before, but he wore his turnout blankets over winter 24/7 as the barn never warmed up enough to lose layers. New barn is heated, not my thing, but just the situation we were in, we moved to what was going to work best. As I do not like heated barns for respiratory reasons, my horse has never felt softer in his body. I used to have to warm up 20 minutes before I could actually work him and begin to ask him more. This barn, he comes out extremely supple and loose all the time. Between losing layers of heavy blankets over night and his back being warm, it’s been a game changer.

Just my experience and wanted to share. Its such a personal journey, but so many of us have been on it or are on it. I find its truly case by case and every horse responds so differently.

9 Likes

Here’s a link!

3 Likes

I’ve also heard tail pulling is great for the back muscles. Here is a good video on it;

8 Likes

Interesting. I do lateral tail pulls for his stifles, and when I do the straight back pull he REALLY leans into it. I bet it feels good. I’ll probably add those to our routine more regularly instead of just sporadically

3 Likes

I used a clicker to teach my KS horse to target my hand for carrot stretches. My hand is flat and there’s never any food there, so she knows to keep her mouth shut while she stretches. :smile: Treat delivery happens when she’s in default/neutral position (which I did train before adding the targeting).

3 Likes

So, updates.
He’s been on the robaxin and stuff for a week, and the outdoor finally dried enough to lunge a bit out there (can actually do some bigger circles). I’ve been hand walking mostly in the EquiCore with a little lunging at the trot - if I try to trot in hand more than what they’d ask for a lameness check he gets WILD. I also bought some back on track hock boots and started putting those on while grooming.

Got hind shoes on last week, and my trainer said he walked off IMMEDIATELY more comfortable. I can tell he’s happier to putter around the farm and is tracking up at the walk most of the time - albeit with his haunches shifted ever so slightly to the right (his bad hock). Hard for me to correct that on the ground as I’m not quite adept at long lining, but the EquiCore helps and I try my best.

For the first time in a WHILE he let me really groom him - he was super dirty but too cold to bathe without unpacking the coolers. He basically fell asleep in the crossties wearing his hock boots, even while I was scrubbing his belly with the tiger tongue. Which used to be impossible if you wanted to live to see another day. I expect the muscle relaxer and pain killers + shoes have really helped. Oh, and the BoT :laughing:

Vet was out Monday and flexed him again (3/5 on right, 1-2/5 on left) xrayed the other hock - mild changes according to him (waiting to get those rads, I was at work and not there).

So I went ahead and injected both hocks. Apparently the fluid in this right hock was super cloudy, and that indicates inflammation? I’m assuming a bunch of WBC or something like that in the joint. The other hock was clear.

He’s on turnout rest until tomorrow, and I plan to get on him and start tack walking - I want to see what was the hock and what is residual or back soreness. I don’t think the lunging is doing him a ton of favors with his joints and I am just not good enough to get him straight from the ground. Plan to get on him so I can straighten him out and get a better feel for what’s what. Fingers crossed :crossed_fingers:t3:

4 Likes

I don’t wanna derail the thread but does anyone have good videos that show you how to do these?? For some reason I was hoping the study link would also contain instructions :joy:

1 Like

We also reinforced static behaviors, for treats to keep head slightly away from people until acknowledged and then turn slowly to gently accept a treat, no mugging.

Once were walking out to look at four geldings with a friend and he was laughing, the horses came to us and stood there politely, heads averted, waiting for their turn to be called and given a treat and some attention.
He thought that was so funny, said his were alligators, he would not dare give treats out loose in the pasture, he would get run over.

1 Like

This link isn’t bad for the forward and side bends

5 Likes

So, as it is with horses, I had planned to get on pony yesterday. Which of course means he decided to crash through a fence in turnout, take out the POST and a rail, and come up to the barn to socialize. He scraped up his front leg but thankfully it looks quite superficial and on the front of his cannon bone for the most part. He was an absolute dragon while I tried to hose him off, so I ended up putting him on the line in the round pen for a bit since he felt like he was going to spontaneously combust in the wash rack.
I don’t usually let him be an idiot on the line (at least not on purpose) but he got a few good walk-to-buck transitions out each way before calmly trotting around. Suddenly I had a semi-sane horse again, like flipping a switch :roll_eyes:.

Since he was completely sound during all these shenanigans I decided to hop on him and walk around just to see where we were after the hocks. This is the first time I’d been on him since Dec/Jan, so course he was a perfect chill little angel (which had the barn staff and trainers who saw the whole thing a bit bemused but glad I wasn’t dead I’m sure :joy:).

We just worked on going forward at the walk and a little moving his hindquarters and shoulders in and out (trying to get him straighter, but he barely can hold it for a step or two so it was a bit drunken looking). I did a lap of trot each way as well, since he’s always felt sound at the walk, and trainer said he was a little off at first going right, but her words were “definitely serviceable”. Then we went on a ‘cool out’ trail ride around the property which always gets him marching forward and tracking up at the walk. All total, maybe 35 minutes of saddle and hand walking time.

I cold hosed the front leg after, and we put him on some SMZ’s in addition to the previcox he’s already on so fingers crossed those scrapes heal up nicely.
I plan to keep doing lots of walking in the EquiCore, poles, baby lateral work, and only lunging on days I don’t have time to ride in an interest of preserving his joints.
I’m going to hold off on the shockwave/meso for now, going the robaxin route, at least until I get his feet more the way I want them.
Horses y’all. Fingers crossed.

5 Likes

Since I’m using this as a journal apparently- congratulations y’all get more updates!

Pony has still been off and not quite right, though he’s not standing camped under anymore and the “off” looks like classic stifle to me. Mainly the left. Which conformationally is an issue with him. He’s dropped some weight as well, which I’m wondering if it’s ulcers flaring up again due to the injections and NSAIDs.

He’s also rubbing his tail like mad, though it’s not dandruff like usual (and usually I wash it and the rubbing stops - not this time). His hock sores have gone away though! So that’s something.

I did take him to a new farrier who I so far am absolutely THRILLED with. She saw a lot of the same issues I see with his feet, we did pour ins with frog support and by golly she took his toes back! Finally, a farrier who I feel like listened to what I was saying.

Pony went from not tracking up at all (usually a full hoofs length behind his front print, or just barely landing in the print), to a good 6”+ on the straightaway. I’m still seeing some hip shifting to the right but I haven’t gotten on him. He’s also still a little short strided and hesitant to heel land with his fronts, so we may do hoof pack instead of pour ins for the next cycle and see how that goes.

I will have the vet out for another lameness evaluation with the stifles in mind, and eventually I want to look at his neck (call it a hunch). Most likely going to treat the kissing spine as the “least” of the worries - ie I will get everything else sorted before deciding if I’m going to address it or just do whatever he can handle comfortably.

3 Likes

Yay, there’s nothing as wonderful as a good farrier!! Another thing to consider instead of pour-ins is frog pads with dental impression material underneath. We switched my thin-soled NPA horse from leather pads to pour-in pads to frog pads, and they have worked really well for him. X-rays showed that his hind feet tripled in sole depth from one year to the next. For the first time, he was able to go barefoot behind over the winter with zero uncomfortable transition period and complete comfort in all his work, including trail riding and jumping up to about 3’6". They are also so much less of a pain than pour-in pads, especially in cold weather, and can be reused a few times. My farrier has used them on quite a few horses now with better success than pour-ins. YMMV of course, just something to consider!

I’ve heard anecdotally that tail rubbing, without any other obvious cause like dry skin, dirty sheath, worms, etc. can be a sign of tight/sore hamstrings. It’s just something I heard/read on the interwebs, so take that as you will…

3 Likes

I had good luck with a light beveling, just taking the square edge off back a bit, of the inside of the shoe where it meets the hoof.
Seemed to help horses with way too thin soles grow thicker ones faster.

And because no two horses are ever the same, my mare HATED these pads with the dental impression material under them. As in, made her lame bad. Swapped them for leather pads and she was back to normal.

Wish there were a better method than trial-and-error . . .

2 Likes

The pads with dental impression material are in the running as well - farrier was thinking hoof pack (I’m assuming magic cushion) as a first option. A leather pad with some unknown as of yet packing is the last resort idea as he seems to really need frog support if he can tolerate it!

Edited to add: here’s some very basic hoof pics from today, about a weeks and a half out from getting him done by the new farrier.

1 Like

Those are rather alarming looking feet. Underrun heals and the toe looks like it didn’t have much of anything taken off, and it’s already going over the shoe.

6 Likes

Plus the bit of the leg column that can be seen doesn’t seem to quite fit the angle of the hoof?

Wondering what x-rays would show.

Guess the proof is in how the horse fares, if he is traveling well, or getting odd strided or sore after working, or … ?

I find myself, watching hoof pictures, with my hands itching to get some tools and go to working on some of those hooves some post some times, even after now decades since I shod horses.
Then, I would embarrass myself today if I tried it, is not as easy as it looks to get it right, every time, every horse.

2 Likes

My understanding is the heels were crushed and underrun (his feet are indeed very run forward) from previous farrier work. The new farrier took as much toe as his little sole depth would allow, and pulled the heels back as much as possible. Then set the shoe back on the foot to move breakover back and give the heels somewhere to grow down rather than forward?
At least that’s my understanding. We were indeed working with xrays, and I hope to get rads of his stifles, and feet again as soon as money allows.

2 Likes