Update: post #13: Helping a horse balance itself in a triple combination

[SnicklefritzG]

My horse is a careful jumper with good jumping style. He always has his knees up nice, tight, and even. One thing he could use improvement on though is balancing in triple combinations. As an event rider who just started in the sport, I won’t need to do these at my current level in horse trials, but they do come up at jumper shows.

We do gridwork periodically in lessons which helps a lot. However, if we are already jumping at height once per week doing something other than gymnastics, I don’t necessarily want to jump him at height too much by doing another session of gymnastics the same week.

He is young (8 yrs), sound, and is a quick learner.

What are some exercises I could do to minimize the impact on his legs, but still provide benefit for triple combinations?

[tinah]

Trot poles, lots of self carriage. Transitions from shortening to lengthening and back again, first at the trot, then as he becomes stronger, collections and Extension at the trot and finally walk. Controlled walk/halt canter transitions. Hill work. Anything you would do to strengthen a topline is going to help him be able to rock back and not get strung out over fences.

[Ponyclubrocks]

You can work on triple combinations, bounces, etc without using jumps. You can get most of the benefits of these exercises using poles and cavaletti. This saves a lot of wear and tear on the horse and also lets you work on yourself while minimizing the consequences of making mistakes. You just have to adjust your spacing to make up for the fact that you are using poles versus jumps.

[supershorty628]

Ditto the suggestion for cavalettis.

Also, IME, a lot of balancing in the triple combinations comes from what you do with your weight and shoulders. I’m tiny, but a subtle shift back with my shoulders - or even slightly opening my hip angle without snapping back or sitting down too early - in the combinations makes a world of difference, even though you’d think that I’m small enough that it wouldn’t make a big change.

[SnicklefritzG]

Thanks for the suggestions thus far. It sounds like there are plenty of things I can do to help without pounding my horse’s legs too much.

I had my trainer school my horse through a triple combination last week and would be interested in seeing if that would suggest any other exercises.

The combination consisted of three oxers each set on a long two strides. All were set at about 3’3" high. My horse finds this height easy. The first jump was a narrow oxer, the second was a wide one set somewhere between 3’6" and 4’ wide and the third was another narrow oxer. My trainer said my horse was very straight and honest through the combination, was great with his knees over the jumps, but was a bit strung out and lazy with his feet between the jumps. This didn’t cause too much of a problem between the first two oxers but would cause him to occasionally have the top rail down on the third oxer. She added some canter poles between the jumps to encourage him to pick up his feet which made a huge improvement.

She says that the challenge was not losing the “forward” when she would ride him more “up” in order to not have him get long and strung out. She says he sometimes tends to revert to “racehorse” mode in combinations by getting long which makes him not as balanced as he needs to be.

She also said that the height and spreads are no problem for him generally. She says it feels very easy. It’s just in the combinations that things get a bit challenging.

Any additional thoughts/comments?

[SnicklefritzG]

bumping to get more ideas on low gridwork or other exercises to try…

[bluebuckets]

This is most likely going to be solved through lots of flatwork. I’m going to give you an idea of where to start, and then you’ll need to develop a flat program with your trainer.

Flatwork is NOT what most hunter/jumper/eq (and heck, even some event) riders do: pull horsey out, w/t/c around the ring on the rail, reverse, done. Repeat until jump day.

Flatwork IS working your horse in a manner to develop strength, suppleness, adjustability, and something I’ve heard best described as “Broke-ness” (this concept is one I heard from an old cowboy about cutters and reiners, but definitely applies to the English disciplines: it’s getting the horse to the point where with your feet, seat, and hands, you can move each part of the horse independently: put their feet where you want them, keep the head where you want it, lift the back and/or the wither without changing much else, adjust where the poll sits, etc. all quietly without a battle between you and the horse).

This does NOT get done with laps around the arena, and resist the temptation to jump straight to “fun” stuff like advanced lateral work, half pass, and pirhouette. Some of the most difficult lessons I’ve ever had happened with dressage trainers (and my jumper trainer, with an extensive dressage background) at the trot on 30m circles- and you guessed it, they focused on the idea of “broke-ness” explained above. Learning pirouette-once I had a firm grip on the basics-was WAY easier.

What this will do for you is give you a horse that is strong enough to hold together through jump courses and combinations in addition to a horse who is trained enough to really listen while on course- and you will know what to ask your (listening) horse what to do. Instead of half-halt no response, you’ll get half-halt horse lifts front end, lowers hind end, engages back, shortens stride just a little, pats the ground and lightly jumps over the jump.

It is seriously all in the flatwork. If you already have an athletic horse who likes jumping and is careful, you will not solve this by jumping him into the ground.

[SnicklefritzG]

@BB: I totally get what you are saying. I see a lot of other people just doing w/t/c over the winter with not a lot of technicality.

In my flat sessions, I spend a lot of time on transitions, both within the gaits and between them. I’ll do things like: start off in working trot, lengthen down the long side, collect in the corner and down the short side, then lengthen on the corner. Along the way, I might also mix in a downward transition to a walk then back to trot. I will also work on similar things in the canter and then throw in random downward transitions to a trot and then sometimes back to trot for a while, but sometimes right back up to canter. A lot of this is about making sure he is moving off my leg and listening and doesn’t fall onto his forehand. I also mix up the patterns, so sometimes I am lengthening on the diagonal, or on the short side, just so my horse has to listen and not anticipate.

We also do some shoulder-in and haunches in to work on strengthen my horse’s inside hind legs and then to help me learn to position different parts of my horse’s body correctly.

Is that some of the stuff you are talking about?

[Lady_Eboshi]

[QUOTE=SnicklefritzG;7351986]
Thanks for the suggestions thus far. It sounds like there are plenty of things I can do to help without pounding my horse’s legs too much.

I had my trainer school my horse through a triple combination last week and would be interested in seeing if that would suggest any other exercises.

The combination consisted of three oxers each set on a long two strides. All were set at about 3’3" high. My horse finds this height easy. The first jump was a narrow oxer, the second was a wide one set somewhere between 3’6" and 4’ wide and the third was another narrow oxer. My trainer said my horse was very straight and honest through the combination, was great with his knees over the jumps, but was a bit strung out and lazy with his feet between the jumps. This didn’t cause too much of a problem between the first two oxers but would cause him to occasionally have the top rail down on the third oxer. She added some canter poles between the jumps to encourage him to pick up his feet which made a huge improvement.

She says that the challenge was not losing the “forward” when she would ride him more “up” in order to not have him get long and strung out. She says he sometimes tends to revert to “racehorse” mode in combinations by getting long which makes him not as balanced as he needs to be.

She also said that the height and spreads are no problem for him generally. She says it feels very easy. It’s just in the combinations that things get a bit challenging.

Any additional thoughts/comments?[/QUOTE]

Stephen Bradley has a great image for the right feeling : “Round & Bouncy!”

He needs to be always in front of your leg, always “up” in the bridle, and you should always feel like the “engine is revving” more than you even need. If you don’t have that feeling, then he’s more or less behind your leg and possibly even behind the bridle a little, especially if he’s lowering his withers to string out and get flat and quick. Use half-halts with lifted hands to pick up his front end and spell it out for him where he belongs.

I would use a few “bogies” in those gymnastics to get him a little more interested; drape a cooler over a vertical, add a fake “Liverpool,” or use Swedish oxers. Carry a stick and let him know it’s there if he doesn’t respect your leg!

[jaysjmpr]

Getting thru a triple or any combination is a whole lot about the rider. You have to be able to analyse the jumps and distance carefully. First don’t rush it. It sounds like you have a talented young horse.
Second, basics, basics flat work, lots of it. Depending on what the combination is you may need to shorten or add power in the combination. Third, grids. Once you jump in, you always jump out of any grid.
The stronger your basics are the more likely your horse will think he can jump whatever is in front of him.

[KateKat]

I too sometimes ride a horse who instead of pushing more from behind, likes to get long and a little strung out when I ask for more forward. It doesn’t help that he has a naturally gigantic stride and is athletic, so the rider sometimes doesn’t even realize he’s not using himself properly until its too late and he either knocks rails, or flops himself over a fence like a fish.

Flatwork (circles, spirals, lateral work like haunches/shoulder in, walking ground poles, walking cavaletti, transitions, etc) has helped a lot. In fact, we’ve done very little with actual fences because the flat work has been effective enough. The other thing that has made a difference is me. This horse requires A LOT of core strength and stability from the rider in order to jump well! So I definitely agree that where your body is through the combos could also be contributing to the way he’s jumping.

[Paddles10]

You might want to review the Anne Kursinski segment of this year’s GMH clinic? The work she does with the mare is pretty much where you need to be. As Katekat and others have pointed out, quality flatwork will go a long way to improving your horses performance.

[SnicklefritzG]

Update: Thanks for all the great suggestions everyone! I’ve focused mostly on flatwork since the original post, maybe jumping once per week. With the suggestions people have made, I’ve been able to make my flatwork much more focused and consequently more fun. It hasn’t been easy, keeping myself and my horse balanced through some of the exercises is a lot of work, but I’m beginning to see the benefit of it.

I took my horse to a BNT clinic very recently and felt like the flatwork prep made a huge difference in our ability to do the challenging exercises. In fact, the BNT, who is known for being very tough on people, made a point of coming over between sessions to compliment us. One of the specific things they commented on was how steady and consistent we were in our riding. They also thought my horse was a “very talented jumper”, which I was particularly happy about considering how little we have jumped in the past two months.

The really dedicated flatwork practice helped set us up much better I think then if I would have just jumped more.

Thanks everyone!!

[faraway46]

Ground poles in between the jumps…

What I do when I have a horse that won’t stride accordingly in a triple combination is set ground poles to show them what I want.

I set a ground pole aprox 3m on the landing side of the first jump, then 3m from that one (if it’s a two stride) and then put the last ground pole at the base of the jump if he tends to be lazy to get there, or separate it from the jump if they speed up and go deep. Place the same ground poles on the other part of the combination.

These ground poles are used as markers to teach your horse how you want the strides done in the combination and where take off should be (it lengthens the horse that jumps short in the combo or slows/paces the horse that speeds through it).

Start low so he is not worried with everything he sees at landing and then gradually move up once he gets the rhythm of things.

I have found this is good for horses that speed through them, horses who are distracted with the second element (helps them focus things one step at a time) and balances horses who jump lazily through it, too.

Good luck.