Sorry, should have put the rule number. I meant polos when jackets are waived. (120 2.1)
But many years ago, I would wear a polo under my jacket, with the collar flipped up and the stock tie around it, so in case jackets were waived, I wouldn’t have to change my shirt. Couldn’t tell it was a polo under there!
I have done this a lot… in an area of the country where jackets tend to get waived, but not always. With a stock tie over the buttoned up & collar turned up polo we looked fine.I’m about to listen to the podcast right now.
I con’t understand why a dressage (or any other horse) podcast would start out with the sound of a horse being ridden at such speed across such a hard surface. Weird. If these are the people setting the styles, I think they should look to their horses’ shoeing before their own breechES and shirts.
Oh, and just FYI? “Breech” is a person’s buttocks, not the garment into which one’s breech goes. The garment is called breechES.
For waived jackets…the rule reads…
2. Weather Conditions. In locations with high average heat and humidity on the date of a competition,
competition management may publish in its prize list that jackets will be waived for the duration of the competition.
Alternatively, management may announce prior to or during a competition that competitors may show without
jackets when extreme heat and/or humidity is forecasted. This waiver applies to national classes at a USEF
licensed-USDF recognized dressage competition.
2.1 Competitors must wear protective headgear and shirt with sleeves and collar, without neckwear. T-shirts are
not permitted.
2.1 so to ME it sounds like a ‘shirt with sleeves and collar, without neckwear’ could very well be a polo shirt.
Ok well before you bash it, The Horse Radio Network hosts the Dressage Radio show. They produce it for them. So that intro is the Horse Radio Networks intro.
There are a lot of different dialects in the equestrian world. Not everyone is from the US
When you read rules, you cannot mash them all together.
All the parts under section 1 (such as 1.5) refer to normal, with jacket, situations.
All the parts under section 2 (such as 2.1) refer to special conditions (jackets waived, weather rules).
That makes sense, Lorilu.
Annoying that the USDF sanctioned podcast is so inaccurate. You’d think they might check if they were correct before they pontificated about rules.
I agree, to a certain extent. If we’re speaking specifically of section 2 (weather conditions) when jackets are waived, however, you don’t completely disregard all the previous rules. For instance, sections 1.4-1.7 don’t go out the door - they still apply. You don’t get to wear jeans in inclement weather just because it didn’t specify breeches in Section 2. So I think you do have to consider them all together. Section 2.1 doesn’t exist in isolation. My interpretation is that the collar rules for a show shirt still apply in section 2.1. I don’t think it’s reasonable to assume that you now magically get to wear a polo with a flat collar (but you can wear one if you starch the collar and flip it up!). But I can see how one could interpret it that way. (Though, like I said earlier, I think a polo would be a reasonable option.)
Total tangent. I giggled at the starch comment. You must not have been around in the early 80s when the collar of a polo was worn up, no starch required they stand up just fine on their own.
On topic - I am not sure I understand how the rule as written then allows men to wear a dress shirt with a tie. That is not a stand up collar.
Ah, today’s polos must be too floppy 
And the collar only has to stand up if don’t wear neck wear; if you wear neck wear, then you can have a floppy collar
It seems that a polo with a tie would be legal when a jacket is worn (shirt with collar + neckwear). Why must this be so confusing? A white polo with a well-structured collar would be hard to tell apart from a dress shirt under a jacket.
And unlike breeches, shirts apparently CAN be bright, as long as they are not a bold pattern? Not that I want to wear it with my chestnut horses, but I have a bright coral sun shirt with white cuffs and stand up collar. It seems that would be legal.
I think it must be Izod or RL to really rock the popped collar look. 
I don think this is true. I’ve always pulled my stock tie and turned my collar down on my show shirt (which is a FITS show shirt) when coats are wavied.
All the rule requires is that the shirt have a collar, nothing about it standing up or folded down. They don’t want you to have it zipped/buttoned all the way to the top like you do when you put a stock tie one. That defeats part of the purpose of waiving coats and removing ties and decreasing the risk of overheating. I’ve heard this directly from a judge.
You’re right, I should have clarified “when coats are required.” I think I’ve done as you state when coats are waived - no neckwear and a normal, flat collar. Though I have stopped wearing neckwear altogether so maybe I left the collar up at times.
Someone else had mentioned stand up versus floppy collar when wearing a coat - It depends on the neckwear. A stock tie takes a stand up collar. A men’s tie does not. If no neck wear at all, then the collar needs to be integrated and stand up per the rules.
The whole thing really is ridiculous. And unclear lol.
@Feathered_Feet your clarification makes a lot more sense now. However, I have seen people with the full pre-tied stock ties with the wide collar that velcros in the back and underneath their jacket and stock, they have a v-neck sleeveless shirt on. As long as your stock tie has a wide enough collar, you can hide a lot.
People wearing men’s ties usually wear a regular dress shirt with the collar folded down over the tie. I’ve seen both men and women showing in this set up without issue.
Can you give me an idea of where ‘near the end’ = the discussion on the rules because I tried to listen to the last 20 minutes of it and I must have missed where the rules came up.
The podcast was a bit confusing. The best policy regarding the Rulebook is to read it for yourself. If you still have a question, call or email the USEF or check with the TD at the show before you mount up. The salient pages in the Rulebook are easy to download from the USEF website. (Note, that is USEF, not USDF. USEF writes the rules, not USDF.) As a good plan, print out DR 120-124, read them before you start to show this year, and stash them in your show kit for quick reference at a show. (You can also quickly access the USEF Rulebook on your cell phone at a show, if need be.) This is especially true this year since there are so many new rules, which are highlighted in red.
DR 120.2.1 is simple and clear. Yes, polos are fine and should be open with the collar in the usual place. (Keep an appropriate polo in your show kit.) A rule change further down in the “elimination” section may have greater impact. Judges used to have some discretion in eliminating someone for a dress violation, but that is no longer the case. The reasoning is that riders who weren’t eliminated earlier in the year for a dress violation then maybe made the same mistake later (ie in Championships) and were eliminated at a costlier show. Bottom line: Remove your stock tie if you remove your jacket.
It’s at about 25:00 minutes in, sorry not at the end.
Agree. “must have collar and sleeves” - as long as you’re in a polo that’s not sleeveless, this would certainly fit THAT requirement.
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