[QUOTE=MysticOakRanch;8117481]
As to doubling the price when importing - the cost of importing alone can double the price, so I don’t see a huge issue with a pro who triples the price? And if they put 30 to 60 days on the horse, then the price goes up even more. Seems like a normal business model?
Many pros might look at the breeder and say - but your stud fee was only $2,000. Why do you think you can sell the foal for $10,000? Same concept. There are many other costs and risks that go on behind the scenes (and believe me, I know most breeders are not making much money).
As for buying from overseas - I have seen a lot of problem horses come out of this model. I think if you don’t have a good agent helping you, you are taking a big risk. When I think of all the acquaintances I know who ended up with imported horses (whether they went over and bought themselves OR bought a recently imported horse), there is just a huge incidence of lameness and neuro issues. I just sold a young horse, and the vet who did the pre-purchase exam said he sees a lot of neck injuries in imported young horses. I don’t know if this is just coincidence, but if I WAS to consider importing a horse (I am NOT thinking of doing that), I’d probably talk to someone who does it regularly and ask for their help.
I think there are unscrupulous sellers everywhere in ever industry - but when you buy overseas, you do lose some legal protections you might have buying in the US.
OTOH - there are wonderful sellers and buyers everywhere - I do think the vast majority of horse deals go smooth and well, we just don’t HEAR about those so often. And when things go wrong with a horse sale/purchase - well it is a living creature (and probably and expensive one), so there is additional emotions involved, not like buying/selling a car, or a stack of hay, or a piece of art.[/QUOTE]
This whole topic has been discussed by COTH so many times, but I’m still surprised at some folks’ reaction.
Like breeders (American or otherwise) have a obligation to sell for what the BUYER deems a fair price.
Retail fashion/make-up and even toys are routinely marked up 100-200%.
Sounds like a rip-off to me, but no one is having a fit over that.
ALOT of pros are going back to Europe again now because of the nice exchange rate. I know 3 pros who have purchased between 2-8 horses each at the riding horse auctions and have imported them for re-sale.
While the $$ was weak, this wasn’t happening as much, but now…
As a breeder and ONLY a breeder it kind of ticks me off, especially since one of those people is a pro who bought her dressage prospect from me!! But the fact is horse business people need to make a living just like any other business person.
Some of those “horse people” (both Americans & Europeans) are basically honest, but still want to make a good profit. Some (obviously) just want the $$.
No different than any other kind of profit driven enterprise.
And I would like to suggest that a pro rider who really knows the market and has the connections can actually select the appropriate mounts for the market far better than most amateur individuals, who tend to choose horses way beyond their ability to ride. This happens alot at the European auctions, because those auction riders are SO good at making a horse look good.
But, like any other business model, this one is not without a ton of risk.
In the case of one horse pro who dipped her toe into the “import for profit routine”, the horse had been approved by the auction committee (rads & all). Meaning the auction VET approved the rads.
Horse’s actual import costs were MORE than it’s purchase price (which is actually quite common if the horse is anything but a gelding or a horse under 2 yrs old). A firm buyer showed up within 2 wks, because the horse truly was lovely and it looked like done deal…$$$$$, right?
Nope. The PPE vet for the buyer happened to be the former head of orthopedic surgery for a major vet school and he noticed right away, a problem. Looked like an old suspensory injury, long healed.
The horse was sound, lovely mover. But the FACT is, for the average American ammie rider, that horse is now anathema, because American horse buyers expect total perfect during a PPE – they think that is a guarantee the horse will always be sound.
So did the auction vet actually MISS this problem on the rad? The PPE vet did say that, given the angle of the x-ray the issue is difficult to see. A rip-off? Just a simple mistake?
None of that really matters, since the horse is now in America. But the buyer (the business person) is the one who takes the hit.
So this particular business person needs to make a good profit on 5 of the horses, because #6 is either going to be a loss or a break-even. These guys have to pay the rent just like anyone else, so I can’t fault them.
And I happen to know that unless things are WAAAAY more cheap in Europe, those breeders aren’t making a fortune by & large. In the case of 3 o/o 4 of the horses imported, the transport/import fees were MORE than the purchase price. One example: 6 yr old with virtually no show record, had one foal, but that’s it: $14,000 knock-down price. And then the breeder had to pay fees to the auction house. I don’t care HOW reasonable prices are over there, you can’t breed a horse, get it started u/s, raise till it’s 6yrs old and make a profit when they only sell for $14,000.
But the thing that REALLY bothers me, and will, in the end probably make me close down the modest breeding program I have, is that I really don’t think American breeders will ever be able to compete with the Europeans – not in terms of quality – I think we’ve done that many time already.
But in terms of a business/selling model that seems to suit our American consumer.
I keep hearing the argument that you can go to Europe and see a zillion horses in 30 mins or whatever. But where is the savings when you pay $14,000 for the horse and $15,000 for import and quarantine (door to door)?
I mean, you can do ALOT of travelling the in US for $15K. And if American buyers would actually SUPPORT a US auction of pre-selected riding horses, they could travel to CA or PA or OH for a heck of alot less than they could fly to Europe AND they could get their pony home for 1 10th of the amount.
But those auctions have been tried and they just go bust.
Honestly, sometimes it almost seems like US sporthorse breeders and buyers aren’t helping each other at all. It’s sort of depressing…
