Value of nicks

[Lamb_Chop]

[QUOTE=camohn;7500843]
its off topic…but long time no see SportArab!
pic of the list leader at present…
http://www.northviewstallions.com/index.php/stallions/pa-sires/medallist
In the big picture I see a nicely balanced looking horse, nick aside.Physically I am looking for a nicer set on neck for my mare, and I do like his neck…[/QUOTE]
I saw Medallist when he was at Three Chimneys. A good -looking horse, not physically imposing but quite well put together, nicely balanced and with a good hip. And he was a total sweetheart and very fond of peppermints.

Sorry on the loss of your mother, that is always a hard time.

[SEPowell]

[QUOTE=camohn;7500553]
wow that is a super nice offer!! mare i am looking for is from USFlag/ Roanoke/
Rock Point
lines. She is short (15.1) and can be temperamental. she could use a higher set on neck and height, need a stallion with good temperament/ trainability for what i am trying to fix in her. She has a short dam, everything on her sire side is big/ over 16H …so is more size in her pedigree.PM you a little later.[/QUOTE]

Camohn, look at the stallions at Diamond B. Mad Flatter has the neck set you’re describing. He’s about 6.1 and a nicely balanced horse. http://www.diamondbfarmpa.com/mad_flatter.html

Doubles Partner also has size and goes back to Roberto through Kris S.

Both of these horses raced until they were 6 and retired sound.

Medallist is a beautiful well balanced horse. Good luck if you go with him.

[gumtree]

[QUOTE=LaurieB;7498594]
We have foals due this year by Arch, Blame, Ghostzapper, Broken Vow, and Creative Cause.

For 2015 we’re breeding to More Than Ready, Animal Kingdom, Congrats, and Colonel John.

How about you? Who are you breeding to?[/QUOTE]

Very nice! You’re sitting at a higher “stake” poker table then I can afford right now. We got gutted in the market crash. Like a lot of people in the TB business. Had to fire sale most of our best mares.
Only sending 3 mares to KY this season. Breeding to Uncle Mo (hate the name) to a Gulch mare, Cape Blanco to a Dayur mare and thinking about English Chanel for the third who hasn’t foaled yet. Thinking of Animal Kingdom also.

Bred to Broken Vow when he stood for $15,000 but paid $10,000. He turned out to be a “talking” Derby prospect trained by Barclay Tagg but got hurt. Bred to More then Ready when he was $15,000 and did very well with the yearling. I was the agent who put the deal together to bring his sire Southern Halo back to this country from Argentina. I did a lot of work for the owner down there. One of my very favorite clients.

Congrats I have always like starting in Florida but he is a bit too pricy IMO. Don’t want you to second guest yourself but IMO Colonel John maybe a bit on the bubble. I don’t like what Winstar did to my very good friend Doug Cauthen so I don’t look too close at their horses unless I have too.
Good luck!

[gumtree]

[QUOTE=SportArab;7500813]
It’s been my experience in nearly 30 years of breeding, that you see the grandparents much more often than you see the parents in the foal.

There is the occasional prepotent mare or stallion that throws baby after baby in their own image.[/QUOTE]

I’ll have to get your book. John Veitch has been a good friend for may years. IMO the only other “match races” that I saw were between Sunday Silence and Easy Goer

[camohn]

[QUOTE=SEPowell;7501214]
Camohn, look at the stallions at Diamond B. Mad Flatter has the neck set you’re describing. He’s about 6.1 and a nicely balanced horse. http://www.diamondbfarmpa.com/mad_flatter.html

Doubles Partner also has size and goes back to Roberto through Kris S.

Both of these horses raced until they were 6 and retired sound.

Medallist is a beautiful well balanced horse. Good luck if you go with him.[/QUOTE]
Flatter does have a nice neck. I like the pedigree on DP though I wish they had a confo photo of him. I remember Rock Hard Ten was a good looking horse.
I too sold my best mare when I had to cut back. I can’t say I fire saled her, I got a good price , but she was sold because she was the most marketable one.She had flawless confo. Sigh. ( by Well Decorated) . There are a couple WD stallions here in PA…but she looked better than they do.

[camohn]

[QUOTE=SEPowell;7501214]
Camohn, look at the stallions at Diamond B. Mad Flatter has the neck set you’re describing. He’s about 6.1 and a nicely balanced horse. http://www.diamondbfarmpa.com/mad_flatter.html

Doubles Partner also has size and goes back to Roberto through Kris S.

Both of these horses raced until they were 6 and retired sound.

Medallist is a beautiful well balanced horse. Good luck if you go with him.[/QUOTE]
Flatter does have a nice neck. I like the pedigree on DP though I wish they had a confo photo of him. I remember Rock Hard Ten was a good looking horse.
I too sold my best mare when I had to cut back. I can’t say I fire saled her, I got a good price , but she was sold because she was the most marketable one.She had flawless confo. Sigh. ( by Well Decorated) . There are a couple WD stallions here in PA…but she looked better than they do.

[LaurieB]

[QUOTE=gumtree;7501326]
Very nice! You’re sitting at a higher “stake” poker table then I can afford right now. We got gutted in the market crash. Like a lot of people in the TB business. Had to fire sale most of our best mares.
Only sending 3 mares to KY this season. Breeding to Uncle Mo (hate the name) to a Gulch mare, Cape Blanco to a Dayur mare and thinking about English Chanel for the third who hasn’t foaled yet. Thinking of Animal Kingdom also.

Bred to Broken Vow when he stood for $15,000 but paid $10,000. He turned out to be a “talking” Derby prospect trained by Barclay Tagg but got hurt. Bred to More then Ready when he was $15,000 and did very well with the yearling. I was the agent who put the deal together to bring his sire Southern Halo back to this country from Argentina. I did a lot of work for the owner down there. One of my very favorite clients.

Congrats I have always like starting in Florida but he is a bit too pricy IMO. Don’t want you to second guest yourself but IMO Colonel John maybe a bit on the bubble. I don’t like what Winstar did to my very good friend Doug Cauthen so I don’t look too close at their horses unless I have too.
Good luck![/QUOTE]

We’ve had good luck with both More Than Ready and Broken Vow before. This is our third time breeding to each of them. I’ve seen some really good looking offspring by Uncle Mo. Hopefully he’s a stallion with a bright future. And I love everything about Animal Kingdom (except of course the fact that he’s not proven.)

Sure Colonel John is on the bubble (as is Uncle Mo–it looks like we can both tolerate a bit of risk). But Colonel John is a great fit for the mare. Plus, like his sire, he did better with his first crop 2yos than I was expecting him to do. And I’m hoping (guessing?) that they will improve with age. If I’m wrong, we’ll race. The mare has 3 winners and 1 placed (and still running) from 4 foals of racing age, so it’s not a hardship.

Congrats interests me. Obviously I’m betting on the hope that he can resurrect his early success when his first KY bred crop gets to the races this year. And again, he’s a very interesting match for the mare.

Best of luck to you, too! Maybe we should compare notes in a year or two.

[Flying_Fox]

A third popular system is that of “nicks,” a theory which claims that certain crosses produce more and better winners than equally good animals mated in other ways. One of the more famous ones is that of Fair Play sires with Rock Sand mares. Of course good horses came from these matings; but so did poor ones which are less easily remembered. Before long some bright light will probably start spouting off about the wonders of the cross of Heliopolis with Bull Dog mares. But before we accept this it is well to recall a few additional facts. Heliopolis is a great horse, the son of a famous sire. He has produced top colts from an assortment of good mares. Bull Dog was a good race horse and stands today at or near the top as a sire of winners and dams of winners. His mares were one of the finest collections in the world. In addition Bull Dog is the son of the immortal Teddy and the full brother of Sir Galahad III and of Quatre Bras II. Any stallion which would
fail to produce good horses from mares of this direct lineage should rightly be classed as a failure. There is no harm in trying nicks if other factors are not ignored. The best nick would be to mate a leading sire with a mare of proven producing worth.

[SportArab]

[QUOTE=gumtree;7501332]
I’ll have to get your book. John Veitch has been a good friend for may years. IMO the only other “match races” that I saw were between Sunday Silence and Easy Goer[/QUOTE]

One great thing about doing the book was spending time with John Veitch and Patrice Wolfson as they opened the window onto this great rivalry. They were both extraordinarily generous with their time.

[SportArab]

Sorry to hear about your mom. I, too, ended up cutting way back on breeding for several years because there wasn’t much market (not to mention time).

Have three mares in foal for this spring and will be breeding our first Thoroughbred mare (Tiznow daughter) to my stallion for a sport horse this year, but am looking around at possible racing stallions for future mates for her.

[QUOTE=camohn;7500945]
wasn’t doing much breeding for a couple years there…for a lot of reasons that overlapped. My day job got crazy busy, my mother was terminally ill and any free time was spent taking her to doctor/chemo appointments and the economy/horse sales were bad. so…took a hiatus for a bit. Now the economy/ horse sales have picked up, Mom passed away last August and things are slow at the day job. so…back to spending time on the ponies![/QUOTE]

[camohn]

[QUOTE=SportArab;7503491]
Sorry to hear about your mom. I, too, ended up cutting way back on breeding for several years because there wasn’t much market (not to mention time).

Have three mares in foal for this spring and will be breeding our first Thoroughbred mare (Tiznow daughter) to my stallion for a sport horse this year, but am looking around at possible racing stallions for future mates for her.[/QUOTE]
I looked up your book. Its available for preorder on Amazon for a 4/22 release so I put in a pre order.
I have 2 yearlings (with folks interested in both), and none coming this year so looking to breed for next year.
Mare seeking date…hopefully SOs are not too freaked out about the white mare! Not quite as shocking as it once was, but still pretty rare. Xanthus Farm has their white colt at stud.
http://www.xanthus-farm.com/xanthus_farm.cgi?dsri=on&tt=44&hh=1293
Lily:
http://s82.photobucket.com/user/camohn03/media/DSCN5799_zps845ff115.jpg.html?sort=3&o=16

[SportArab]

Hope you enjoy it.

[Texarkana]

Bumping this back up with an honest question:

I’m curious what those who value nicking think of the Goldmine stallion matches over traditional nicking reports (TrueNicks, Enicks, etc.). Supposedly the Goldmine G1 matches consider the entire pedigree.

What spurred this question is that my mare is a very poor C/D nick with one intriguing stallion. However, the Goldmine G1 cross comes up quite strong: not a 20/20 match, but with top CSIs at 22, 19, and 2 18’s.

I need to stop shopping and just commit to someone! :lol: