lets see what he will say about his material… There is eco friendly leather already and I think his idea is a step in the right direction!
Well, I think it is a great thing…because it is very hard for vegans who have horses to find quality tack. I am not a vegan myself but huge for my vegan friends. What is “most important” depends on your beliefs, I am sure.
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I am vegan so I look forward to this…,
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So those of you vegan people would rather spend $500+ on a plastic bridle than a used one that will at least not further harm an animal and the environment?
honest question.
you know the price point on this is not going to be wintec level, right? Something has to pay for launch parties in Wellington.
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I love the idea of a line of typically leather products being vegan.
OTOH, I also have deep concerns about the chemical processes and byproducts that are typically involved in synthetics, and then the mass crop consumerism agriculture habits that can lead to things like deforestation, deterioration of soil, application of commercial grade (chemical) pesticides and fertilizers that produce chemical runoff into the water systems. (None of which excuse the current environmental concerns of large scale livestock management, commercial leather production, etc, to be fair - our current system is not free of significant environmental drains and deteriorations.)
Large scale production always comes at a cost. I would love more details on this and hope that as someone mentioned above, we get more information as it launches. If someone can start a responsibly produced vegan product that would be fabulous - and hopefully act as framework for future entrepreneurs looking to produce things in an ethical and environmentally responsible manner!
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In addition to the environmental impact, I’m curious about the strength and performance characteristics of these materials.I know the endurance crowd uses synthetics a lot more than other disciplines, so they probably have some good information but much will depend on the exact material used.
- Will halters and bridles be strong enough to use safely but still give way in an emergency? Will stitching be more likely to tear the synthetics?
- Will they be easy to clean and disinfect, or prone to mold in humid weather (this is more a concern for items made from things like cork or pineapple)
- Will boots stretch and conform to your foot/leg the way leather will or will they not need a break in period, coming out of the box soft and comfortable. Can you get them in a range of stiffness - see the thread on first time boots and stiffness preferences?
- Will saddles be grippy like my beloved buffalo leather? Will they be hot and sweaty for me to sit in or my horse to wear?
As an inveterate bargain hunter, I love getting a second-hand deal on good quality goods. More and more I am also motivated by the desire to keep things out of the landfills as well. There will be no one solution to our environmental issues, and every small step in the right direction moves us closer to a fix.
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Not vegan, but vegetarian. So I do use leather products occasionally, though dressage sure does greatly increase my use. This is great. Can’t wait to find more.
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Not sure about the intention of your post? I will of course be very critical about the product line. If this is only an expensive plastic product I am out. But I do support new ideas and so at this point I will stay open minded until I have further information!
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I dunno, do you never buy new tack because of the environmental issues? I am not a vegan but enjoy (and use) beautiful tack. Vegans ought to be able to splurge on nice tack too if they want! Plus, I have heard people criticize them (unfairly) for using leather horse tack without knowing its provenance, and the current options like Tekna, Wintec, biothane are not what I would call a luxury product line at all. Or even quality.
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If I were vegan, and therefore opposed to the use of animal products at least partially on the basis of environmental cost associated with factory farming, I would also be opposed to this because it’s horribly damaging to the environment to use non-biodegradable materials. I just take issue with the high and mighty position of being vegan while ignoring the environmental cost of “green” materials because they are not animal based.
The actual green and animal friendly thing to do would be to buy used and keep a leather product out of a landfill, not contribute even more textile waste to protect a cow. That’s all.
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@soloudinhere i know several vegans who choose that because of ethics/morality of the treatment of animals and while they care about the environment, that is not why they are vegans. The primary motivation is the suffering of animals, done.
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I don’t think any of us are truly in a position to weigh the costs and impacts of leather vs. synthetic, in terms of environmental externalities, given so little information about this line of products. At this moment in time there are no perfect tack choices for an ethically exacting consumer, and I certainly have no problem with anyone who is trying to make a wider array of better options possible, even if those options are only slightly better, or are better in only some regards.
I try to stay conscious of the environmental impacts of my choices and the animal suffering that I contribute to. I can’t blame anyone for buying a synthetic saddle while I’m driving a car to my barn, living in a (rental) home with synthetic carpeting and siding, flying around the world a few times a year for work, and typing a frivolous forum post on a computer that will some day be e-waste. There are tradeoffs in so many of the decisions we all make every day – just by living in modern society I feel I’m in too much of a glass house to cast stones at a project like this.
I ride in a used leather saddle, but bought other leather items (e.g. bridle, girth) new. Those tack choices were the best ones I felt able to make when I purchased those items, and I take good care of my things so that I can get the most use out of them possible. I can live with some ethical compromise in my tack choices because I’m currently able to make choices in other areas of my life that limit my impact on animal suffering and the environment – CSA produce and buying eggs from a nearby chicken owner whose birds are treated like family, minimizing my consumption of animal products in general (vegetarian, not vegan, for various reasons), commuting to work by bike most days, avoiding disposable products as much as possible. If quality, eco-friendly vegan tack exists next time I’m saddle shopping I will consider buying it. The world is imperfect and we as consumers are forced to make mostly imperfect choices, but I agree with @MissAriel that any little step in a better direction is valuable.
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BTW he stated on his FB Page today that he did not use Plastic or PVC…
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Maybe I’m confused but aren’t veganism and eco-conciousness two different things? I’m quite sure I know people who are vegan simply because they oppose the use of animals for human consumption, not because of environmental concerns. I’m not convinced that being vegan means one also has to be “green.”
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This is absolutely true. People who think eating or using only plant material doesn’t hurt animals are sadly deluding themselves. I became a conservation biologist because I love animals, but in the process I learned that it isn’t possible to live without costing something else its life. We all have to find a balance, but it should entail keeping eyes wide open. Native wildlife around the world have been decimated by poorly managed agriculture/silviculture, water supplies degraded, which affects us all. Consumers should certainly endorse ethical treatment, but that goes for all species of birds and mammals, amphibians, fish, etc, that used to live in these massive tracts of land converted to crop cover, more are killed by machine strikes during harvests or spraying, not to mention the transport & manufacturing impacts of all products. If a cow has already been slaughtered for meat, it doesn’t care where its hide goes & that byproduct now has a use.
The most “friendly” solution is to buy a used saddle, although I suspect it’s been a long time since Robert Dover has done that (I could be wrong, which would be a pleasant surprise). Life is complex & full of nuance, no black & white answers.
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Yes, I suppose none of us can have it all. I’m not vegan but do try my best to be “eco-freindly”. All we can do is to try our best to somehow make a difference, however it is very complicated.
An example is the recycling of plastics. Great not to have them in the landfill, right? Well, pick your poison.
When you recycle plastics they are, the great majority of them, sold to China. There, they are manufactured into various items, the production of which, due to China’s lax environmental laws, is responsible for some horrible air pollution in China which of course effects the entire planet.
The resulting goods that are manufactured by China from our plastic waste are then sold back to us in the form of tennis shoes and many other goods. So, are plastics better in the landfill or is their ground pollution potential better shifted into air pollution? 
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I enjoy when non-_____ impose other people’s belief systems on other people.
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Well another thing I just got tickets for the product launch :). I am excited!!!
Honestly, I think it depends on the person. Each person chooses to be vegan or vegetarian for their own set of reasons.
I initially stopped eating meat 20 years ago because it was wasteful to me, … ie for sustainability reasons. But since then my reasons have evolved and changed a little.
Some people might go vegan for environmental concerns, others for animal welfare, others for health reasons. That’s why it’s a little silly for people to just assume reason A is the reason all ___ go ___.
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My question will go unanswered for a while–how long does this tack last?
Recently I sold on my 48 year old Stubben Siegfried saddle to one of my riding teacher’s students. I had to replace a grand total of 2 billet straps in those 48 years. I figure that this saddle may still have a decade or two of life left in it, though a seat saver must be used now because the seat “sling” stretched out.
Will a vegan saddle last almost 50 years? Of course we will not know until some of these saddles have decades of use.
I will be long dead by then, but when that time comes I fancy that my remaining Crosby leather saddles will still be useful and rideable, with proper care, even though right now one is 40 years old.
Right now I use a Pegasus Butterfly Claudia jumping saddle. This saddle has synthetic billets. Hopefully these billets will last as long as the Stubben ones did. Since I will probably be dead it will be someone else who finds out if they, the synthetic billets, last almost forever.
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