Ventral Edema

[SoShootMe]

Ok, so I’m a long-time-lurker but first-time-poster. I am going through a difficult situation. My 18 1/2 year old Arabian mare presented with pitting ventral edema on Saturday the 13th. Vet did an exam. Slight tachycardia and a murmur was heard on auscultation. Lungs fine. Jugular pulse visible at rest. No fever. She is eating/drinking/urinating/defecating normally. Weight is good. Has never presented with any health problems over the course of her entire life. I’ve had her since she was 3 1/2 and she was my first horse. This mare is everything to me.

Blood was drawn. CBC is as follows: (I’ll list the abnormal findings, everything else was normal)

WBC 5.34
HCT 30.04
MCH 20.3
MCHC 48.5

Diagnostic flags - Leukopenia

We are waiting on the panel results to come back tomorrow.

Right now diagnosis is heart failure. Possibly a tumour or also liver/kidney failure (waiting on the panel to see if that’s the case).

ANY other ideas folks? Salix is on backorder and the vet clinic can’t get their hands on any. I’ve gone ahead and ordered some through ValleyVet so just waiting on that to be delivered.

[Bluey]

A whole different case and decades ago, when there was not much that could be done.
My 9 year old half paint, half arabian perfectly happy and healthy gelding was depressed, vet came out and his heart was racing clear out of range.
He was developing ventral edema also and, after work and every other the vet could think of, they determined he had leptospirosis.
They never could get his heart back to normal and had to euthanize him before he collapsed.

This falls into the zebra’s classification, but telling you so, if they have not thought about this yet, horses are not very susceptible to lepto, vets don’t think to look for it, you may want to mention it?

I hope they can find something to help her.

[gumshoe]

Right dorsal colitis would be a possibility both with the edema and leukopenia, wouldn’t it?

[SoShootMe]

Thanks guys. I’ll read up on the Lepto but her heart rate wasn’t anything scary. It was slightly elevated. As for the right dorsal colitis, reading up on the clinical signs - she has no evidence of colic, diarrhea, poor appetite or weight loss.

I will also add that she is fed straight grass hay and nothing else. She isn’t on any supplements or grain. She’s always been a very easy keeper. Attitude and energy level also are normal.

[AKB]

What about tick related disease? Any fevers?

[Lynnwood]

Does she present any other symptoms for any of the metabolic disorders ?

I cared for a pony that was both IR and Cushings he would develop central edema when his numbers were not regulated. Not so dissimilar to how a diabetic often struggles with edema

[China_Doll]

[QUOTE=gumshoe;7910065]
Right dorsal colitis would be a possibility both with the edema and leukopenia, wouldn’t it?[/QUOTE]thats what I thought. What was rbc, protein, and albumin?

[TrueColours]

Is she in foal by any chance?

A former broodmare got massive pitting edema every pregnancy at about 300-310 days and then once she foaled, it went away

the new owner has had 3-4 foals and same thing - fine until about a month away from foaling and then it grows in size each day until she foals

[SoShootMe]

No fevers. Definitely not pregnant. No other symptoms.

RBC was normal. Chem panel should be back tomorrow so we’ll find out then about liver/kidney function.

[dotneko]

We had a twenty yo with pitting edema. Vet ultrasounded and heard a murmur and thought there was fluid on the lungs. No real symptoms - he had done a small show the week before. Just the swelling on his belly and sheath.
Took him to Tufts - they did a tap and drained 5 liters of bloody not pus filled fluid from him. Ultrasound showed tumor around his heart. Fluid returned quickly- the tumor was affecting his lymphatic system. He was euthanized within the week before his breathing became too labored.
Hope it is not this in your case. Lots of tick stuff going on now.

[SoShootMe]

[QUOTE=dotneko;7910212]
We had a twenty yo with pitting edema. Vet ultrasounded and heard a murmur and thought there was fluid on the lungs. No real symptoms - he had done a small show the week before. Just the swelling on his belly and sheath.
Took him to Tufts - they did a tap and drained 5 liters of bloody not pus filled fluid from him. Ultrasound showed tumor around his heart. Fluid returned quickly- the tumor was affecting his lymphatic system. He was euthanized within the week before his breathing became too labored.
Hope it is not this in your case. Lots of tick stuff going on now.[/QUOTE]

We are concerned if it’s a tumour around her heart. I am 8 hours away (one-way) from a clinic that can do ultrasound or other diagnostics, and I would have to cross the border to go to one of them. I am weighing the pros and cons of that. If it’s her heart, what are the chances I make things worse hauling her that far? She by no means flips out in the trailer, but her anxiety does increase. I’ve never had to deal with such an issue.

[dotneko]

Shoot - It was a boarder’s horse, so I really don’t remember what the bloodwork showed, if anything. Tough situation being so far from a clinic. I guess you really need to rely on your vet’s expertise.
There are a few things it could be other than the bad ones - we have another gelding whose belly and sheath regularly become swollen with no cause. It goes down by itself.
Is salix like Lasix?

[Kolsh]

Interesting. My 19yo gelding presented with something similar this fall. Pitting ventral edema, no history of trauma, no pain, no fever, no diarrhea, appetite fine, heart sounds normal, chem panel normal, slight anemia, leukopenia and clumping platelets. We guessed anaplasmosis, but due to the fact he was improving when all the bloodwork came back and had never showed any sign of lethargy, etc, we opted to not treat or do further testing. Within two weeks all was fine. Mine is the third in my area that I know of with similar symptoms.

[SoShootMe]

[QUOTE=dotneko;7910252]
Shoot - It was a boarder’s horse, so I really don’t remember what the bloodwork showed, if anything. Tough situation being so far from a clinic. I guess you really need to rely on your vet’s expertise.
There are a few things it could be other than the bad ones - we have another gelding whose belly and sheath regularly become swollen with no cause. It goes down by itself.
Is salix like Lasix?[/QUOTE]

Yeah Salix is Lasix (brand names). Generic term is Furosemide.

[SoShootMe]

[QUOTE=Kolsh;7910292]
Interesting. My 19yo gelding presented with something similar this fall. Pitting ventral edema, no history of trauma, no pain, no fever, no diarrhea, appetite fine, heart sounds normal, chem panel normal, slight anemia, leukopenia and clumping platelets. We guessed anaplasmosis, but due to the fact he was improving when all the bloodwork came back and had never showed any sign of lethargy, etc, we opted to not treat or do further testing. Within two weeks all was fine. Mine is the third in my area that I know of with similar symptoms.[/QUOTE]

Wow, eerily similar. I hope this is the case. If you don’t mind, what area are you from?

[CrowneDragon]

I have seen horses present with ventral edema as part of an allergic response (usually with limb edema, IIRC). Any chance that is the case here?

[SoShootMe]

[QUOTE=CrowneDragon;7910333]
I have seen horses present with ventral edema as part of an allergic response (usually with limb edema, IIRC). Any chance that is the case here?[/QUOTE]

I don’t know what she would’ve been in contact with that would cause an allergic reaction. Nothing has changed in terms of her living space or feed. She’s never had any allergic reaction in the past. No limb edema right now (thankfully).

[CrowneDragon]

Is there any focus to it (possible insect bite?).
What does her udder look like? Any chance of an odd mastitis?
Do you have Pigeon Fever there?

[China_Doll]

[QUOTE=SoShootMe;7910233]
We are concerned if it’s a tumour around her heart. I am 8 hours away (one-way) from a clinic that can do ultrasound or other diagnostics, and I would have to cross the border to go to one of them. I am weighing the pros and cons of that. If it’s her heart, what are the chances I make things worse hauling her that far? She by no means flips out in the trailer, but her anxiety does increase. I’ve never had to deal with such an issue.[/QUOTE]ultra sound is normal vet equipment. Where do you live?

[poltroon]

[QUOTE=SoShootMe;7910233]
We are concerned if it’s a tumour around her heart. I am 8 hours away (one-way) from a clinic that can do ultrasound or other diagnostics, and I would have to cross the border to go to one of them. I am weighing the pros and cons of that. If it’s her heart, what are the chances I make things worse hauling her that far? She by no means flips out in the trailer, but her anxiety does increase. I’ve never had to deal with such an issue.[/QUOTE]

So the question I would ask is: what are the possibilities if you take her to the clinic?

IE, if there’s a tumor around her heart, this isn’t fixable. For me, I would not want to subject my horse to a trip to a veterinary hospital unless there was a probability of finding something fixable that only they can fix.

So for example if the possibilities are say, it’s an infection that will clear up with antibiotics, or it’s a tumor around her heart, and we have to take her to the hospital to know which it is, I’d give the horse the antibiotics and hope she gets better.

Fingers crossed for you that whatever it is resolves or is fixable.