Hi-
im trying to understand the relative prestige/value of the different registration options for warmblood/sport horses in the US.
For example:
KWPN vs Westfalen vs Weser/Elms vs American Warmblood Society…
Which of these many organizations carry weight with knowledgeable breeders and which are secondary in importance?
I realize there are way more registries than in my example- is there an honest ranking somewhere of which ones are more respected or worth pursuing for young stock?
Thanks!
As far as I can gather, the prestige registries are the European-based registries, and their North American offshoots may or may not water down the registration requirements a bit.
As far as the European registries, they are regional/national rather than strict bloodline registries. So you could have foals from the same stallion in different registries. That means the bloodline of the horses matters as much as the registry when people are looking for prospects.
Honestly my impression is that the strictly North American registries exist primarily to find a home base for horses that can’t make it into one of the registries with a German or Dutch name 
If you want to evaluate the quality of the registry, look at what the registration requirements are. What is required of the parents? Is there an inspection process?
In Canada, there is the Canadian Warmblood which carries less name value than the German registries, and then Canadian Sporthorse which has even looser requirements. I think similar in the USA.
That said, being registered somewhere is still preferable for sporthorses to being just a grade horse of unknown parentage. At least a being a Canadian Sporthorse will give you a pedigree, even if it’s mostly OTTB.
First off there are two kinds of registries - breed and sport. And to further distinguish some by specialty of disciplines.
The World Breeding Federation for Sport Horses would be a start… http://www.wbfsh.org/GB/WBFSH.aspx
and they have rankings http://www.wbfsh.org/GB/Rankings/Bre…ings/2019.aspx
This is an interesting discussion of breedings and the registries.
That’s really interesting! I assume the rankings are done by evaluating the quality of the foals of the stallions in that registry? Would this list show all the studs in that registry or just the top ones? i notice that there are only one or two studs in the Canadian and American WBS, and those are towards the end of the listings. And if you search, there are definitely studs from the same sire in different registries.
I’d say though it depends on why OP is asking. If you are horse shopping in North America (or indeed anywhere) you really want to have an eye on the horse that’s in front of you, because it’s certainly possible to have a mediocre horse out of a reputable registry, or to have a horse with a Big Name several generations back that isn’t that special.
Sire rankings are by the get’s performance points
http://www.wbfsh.org/GB/Rankings/Sir…ings/2018.aspx
I realize OP asked about U.S. registries but these are the bloodlines that carry the most weight and that was part of the question is there a roadmap and this federation looks at all the disciplines/and the major registries.
Thanks for the info… as always COTH cones through.
I’m asking because I have a couple mares and I’m wondering how worth it it is to try to have them inspected for other groups, and I’m not sure who’s who.
There is (as usual) some social media squabbling about relative value or maybe accuracy of different registries inspecting young horses and I’m trying to understand the lay of the land, as it were.
Back in the day, I knew which of the which stock breed registries had weight vs some kind of vanity registries… but the warmblood scene is a whole new world to me.
OP what discipline? And if you already have the mares, their bloodlines.
IMO only:
As a shopper, I pay attention to the relative looseness/strictness of inspection requirements. It has resulted in an opinion of This order:
KWPN
AHS
TRAK
GOV
these seem to register anything:
ISR
American Warmblood
Canadian anything
Thanks everyone. I have two sport type Haflinger mares- inspected and classified with that registry- but really just wondering what any of the other possible organizations’ inspections would add any potential value to their purebred foals in the future. Not even sure if I’d ever breed either of them, but… they are a nice modern type and quite useful.Ride/drive/jump/traditional and western dressage shows, all quite low level but it’s affordable fun with sound, charming horses.
There have been a few horses from our registry that have picked up other classifications and scored well- but I am just not sure what that actually means! Are these additional classifications of value, and respected by traditional sport horse breeders? These comments are really helpful.
i am trying to figure out all these sport horse inspections and registries, how they work, how horses move through the studbooks over time or with accomplishments- and which registries carry weight with buyers…and in general so I am not so ignorant about the greater world of sport horse breeding!
Many thanks.
If you want to get a foal registered in a reputable registry then his parents needs to be already accepted into that registry. I doubt that Halflingers are accepted breeding stock in any of the European warmblood registries because they aren’t warmbloods.
If you wanted to get a horse approved for a given registry, it’s likely a case of either a horse from another warmblood registry, or a TB that meets the standards. The inspections are rigorous, and they are looking for horses that will improve the breeding of top horses in that registry going forward into the future. They are looking for horse with high level potential, not nice all-rounders or low level horses.
As far as registries like Canadian or American Sport Horse, however, I have no idea what they would accept. Perhaps they would accept a Halflinger/TB or Halflinger/WB foal.
But my larger question is, why do you want to seek different registries for your horses? Halflingers are a recognized breed, they are very distinctive, there is a market for them, as you say nice all around horses/ponies at the lower levels. Anyone who looks at a Halflinger knows exactly what it is, and someone who wants a Halflinger wants one, someone who doesn’t, not so much. I mean even if you found or founded The Random NorthAmerican Sport Horse Association, and got papers of some sort for your horses, everyone who looked at them would just say, but aren’t they really Halflingers? It doesn’t automatically make your horses 17 hands and dark bay to cook up some warmblood-sounding papers for them. I mean why not embrace what you have and be a Halflinger breeder?
Haflingers, I didn’t see this one coming. I think Scribblers right, where are you going with this???
i’m puzzled, this isn’t even a WB registry question. It’s like asking can I drive my VW bug in the Indy 500.
Thanks for the info- I’m happy with my girls and their evaluations within our breed- but again, trying to understand all the options I see some others pursuing in the collecting of different breed inspection certifications.
The info here helps me understand the different registries and the hierarchy and legitimacy/value of their inspections.
Heres another Q: what IS a Warmblood?
This question can be answered in a lot of different ways. The most generic answer is that what we conventionally think of as warmbloods are in fact, just registries.
Historically these registries were very regional in nature. Before the era of frozen semen and easy equine transport, the registries could have very unique bloodlines that were largely isolated. In the modern era however, some of those historic (and largely geographic) registries have coalesced into a bigger one, the bloodlines are typically very dispersed between them and not so registry unique any longer. A few specific registries comprise a majority of the warmbloods horse population due to sheer size (KWPN, Hannoveraner, Holsteiner, Oldenburg and then probably maybe Westfalen - there are other registries that still exist but they are much smaller and less common to come across, the ones listed are to my knowledge the largest - though the size between KWPN and Westfalen is extreme in its own right).
I do not include the sport horse registries when I mention the above, for the record. Performance based registries are another thing entirely from the conventional “warmblood” registry.
In general, the European warmblood registries developed over the course of the 20th century to breed very high quality sport horses (show jumping, dressage, eventing) from mixing Thoroughbred blood with the local breeds of cavalry and harness horse. The aim was to get a horse with TB speed and heart, but more height, bone substance and in some cases much flashier gaits.
Breeding these horses was and is supported and regulated by governments as a national industry in a way that doesn’t happen in North America. Many of the registries reflect the German town or region that the foundation stock came from such as Oldenburg, Hanover, Holstein, Westfalen, Trahkener, which were principalities with their own high end cavalry and coach horses before the unification of Germany. There are also WB registries in the Netherlands and Belgium, and of course now in many other countries but using horses from these Northern European breeding programs
The breeding program has been very successful, such that these countries tend to dominate in international equestrian competition and also that warmbloods have become pretty much the required kind of horse for high level jumping and dressage. I understand some riders still prefer TB for eventing because of sheer speed.
The registries remain open so that excellent horses of other registries and also some TB and even AngloArab horses (in the Selle Francais) can be included as it seems useful to develop the breed. I understand too that even if you have a foal from two registered parents, it needs to pass inspection before it can be registered itself.
However, while WB dominate at the highest levels of horse sport, it’s also true there are a lot of mediocre WB, especially in North America where breeding is not regulated. However, even a mediocre WB commands a price premium over say a TB of equal quality, and it is also true that even a mediocre WB probably has more talent for competitive dressage than other breeds, since the rules of dressage have to an extent evolved alongside the horse: the emphasis on big gaits is an example of this. Take two equally well trained horses, and the one with the larger gaits will score higher on the same test, meaning that people will pay a premium for even a mediocre WB (mediocre compared to top WB).
In North America, the term “WB” can get diluted alot. People will call a TB/draft a WB, or a TB/WB when the TB parent is not accepted into any of the European registries. And of course NA has various WB and Sport Horse registries that do not have very strict entry requirements, compared to the European registries.
Yes, Haflinger have their own registries plus Haflo-Arab. No way to get a Haflinger accepted in the Warmblood registries.
I know a breeder who has bred some Halflingers to German Riding Pony stallions and gotten really nice, athletic ponies. She’s also bred one F1 cross mare to another GRP and gotten another great pony. I don’t know if they are registered with any of the warmblood pony registries. You can PM me and I could give you her name if you want to follow-up.
Haflingers are covered under the Weser-Ems umbrella in Germany (Pferedestammbuch Weser Ems). Oldenburg Horse Breeders Society used to inspect Haflinger breeding stock here in NA for Weser-Ems approval but I have been out of the breeding world for a while so I don’t know if that is still the case. You might want to reach out to them for more info. Try Sebastian Rohde - rohde.sebastian@oldenburger-pferde.com .
Actually, selective breeding for riding lines in Europe goes back to the 1700s.
This book is the best way to learn, IMHO.
Great book and I’ll second the recommendation. If you look at the history of the state studs, Celle was established in 1735 which may have been among the earliest. Westfalen’s Warendorf wasn’t until about a century later. The breeding direction of horses in Europe obviously has had some diametric changes (cavalry horses, farm horses, carriage horses, and then of course more recently high performance sport horses). The history of the various state studs is quite interesting and generally worth looking at if anyone has a passing interest. Some of the figures behind the formation and direction of them are really intriguing to read about.
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