Weird scabby lump things near coronet?

[dungrulla]

My horse has had, since last January, these little scabby lumpy weird things just above his coronet band, only on his hind feet. They almost look like little round ergots except they are all around his foot. They’re not tender and they don’t hurt, and pulling on them does not remove them. They seem to wax and wane and move around with witchcraft.

We are 100% positive it’s not mud fever/scratches. Neither the vet nor the farrier has ever commented on them and he gives not one shit about people messing with them.

Could they possibly be warts? Because idk right now man I’m at a loss.

[Highflyer]

My horse has developed what appeared to be warts on one foot (they look pretty much exactly like the warts young horses get on their faces)-- the vet is supposed to biopsy them next time she comes out.

[Eventer13]

Picture?

[PNWjumper]

My TB has something that sounds like it could be similar. You can pick his off, but it’s tough and it obviously bothers him when you actually rip them off. And then they kind of “weep” (not enough that you notice, but I think that’s what builds them back up). He’s had them for the 8 years that I’ve had him and through the numerous vets and farriers who have worked on him in that time not a single one of them has known what they are…nor have any of the vets been concerned enough to culture or pick around at them. I posted on a thread about something like this a while back and got a suggestion to look up/treat for vasculitis. I got sidetracked with other horse issues, so I haven’t done anything about them, but may take another look.

[SportingSun]

My gelding has them too! No clue what they are. He is fine with me touching them as long as I don’t try to pick them off. I have tried everything to get rid of them with no luck. Vet/farrier don’t know either. Biopsy was inconclusive.

[IPEsq]

Sarcoid?

[whitney159]

My mare has the same thing. I’m trying to treat them with BANIXX. sp?

I picked one off last year, she ended up with cellulitis, which abcessed, got proud flesh and took 6 months to heal, and NOT something I want to ever deal with again. I will never pick at something on a foot as long as I live.

[WNT]

Mine has them too. I’ve noticed that sometimes they will cause a weak spot in the hoof wall as the spot grows out, too. I can keep them at bay if I clean them literally every day, but it realistically doesn’t happen. I’m currently trying a sample size bottle of Banixx, might try Krudzapper next. Tea tree ointment helped, but not much. I have also considered Cleantrax or White Lightning, since those are supposed to work on bacteria and fungus, I just really don’t want to soak/gas hind legs on a horse with shivers.

[Groom_amp_Taxi]

Another long-standing case here - as in the entire eight+ years the horse has been in the family - except our scabby things are not limited to right above the coronet band, they are also on the heel bulbs, both sides of the pasterns, and there are a few on the fetlocks as well.

I typically call them “scratches”, but they are NOT the same as the scratches most people deal with and are able to eventually cure. These are hard to get off, and hair grows through them. When the crusts/scabs do come off, the underlying lesions don’t typically bleed, and the scabs come back in the exact same spot. I really should stop calling them “scratches” because they’re not, and when I do call them that, people tell me how they cleared up their horse’s case with their own special concoction. Yeah right.

I have tried many, many, many, many things over the years. Nothing has worked. Some things seem to be working initially, but then the effect seems to lessen, and the crud makes a comeback. Systemic antibiotics in consultation with vet. Vetericyn. Double dosing with ivermectin every two weeks for three cycles. Yada yada yada. Recently tried a homeopathic remedy - tellurium metallica - and I am not a homeopathic remedy type person.

Horse was seen by a veterinary dermatologist (not primarily a horse guy, but horses definitely a part of his practice) and we did systemic antifungals for several months, RX topical sprays, as well as a long-term low dose of dex. Again, might have seen a little initial improvement with this regime, but no cure.

I have wondered if they might be some variant of a sarcoids and have considered asking the vet about maybe trying a topical sarcoid treatment on just one or two of them.

Over the years, some of the things I have found that really did seem to be helpful:

• to soften the crusts/scabs/lesions - Udder Balm. Apply twice a day if possible. Watch carefully in the summer because it is very attractive to flies.
• to clean - Ag Silver Shampoo. When I can wash daily with this, the stuff looks better than it ever does otherwise.
• the spray that I really thought was going to finally clear the stuff up - seemed to be working for about a month - EquiTech Mud Stop (imported from the UK).

This winter, I have been going with the less is better treatment philosophy - maybe spraying with whatever I have “in stock” every other day. So far, the crud doesn’t seem much better or much worse than any other winter, and it’s less hassle for me and the horse.

Happy to at least feel some solidarity with others in this thread!

[CC1]

Same here. My TB has had them the entire 11 years I have owned him. PNWjumper described them to a tee. I’ve tried a few remedies but now just do benign neglect. If they get largish and seem loose I’ll pick them off otherwise he sometimes hits it with another foot and they bleed.

[rcloisonne]

I have the same issue with my TB mare. Everything under the sun has been tried (including the highly touted Equiderma and Well Horse). At times it looks like the things are getting somewhat better but then come back as bad as before (they never totally go away). My vet has no idea what they are and various prescription ointments and systemic antibiotics have had little to no effect. No leg swelling involved (knock on wood).

They’re not really visible on black rear legs unless you’re looking or feeling for it, although the first one, the largest, right above the coronet, has left a small hairless scar right were it meets the hoof wall. It’s not scratches or cannon crud. These things are small hard, scabby/crusty nodules that are difficult to pull off, even after applying vasoline for a few days. They weep a very small amount when they do come off but re-scab over quickly. I’ve never seen anything like this.

It sounds like this condition is not so rare based on the number of posts here. Have any vets reading encountered this?

[Ibex]

I used to lease a mare with this on one leg! The vet thought they were some sort of systemic scratches related to an auto immune disorder??

[Ambitious_Kate]

I’d be leaning towards warts/virus. Fungus and Bacteria respond to anti-stuff. Very wierd. I wonder why so many vets “have no idea”.

[Groom_amp_Taxi]

[QUOTE=rcloisonne;7969254]
I have the same issue with my TB mare. Everything under the sun has been tried (including the highly touted Equiderma and Well Horse). At times it looks like the things are getting somewhat better but then come back as bad as before (they never totally go away). My vet has no idea what they are and various prescription ointments and systemic antibiotics have had little to no effect. No leg swelling involved (knock on wood).

They’re not really visible on black rear legs unless you’re looking or feeling for it, although the first one, the largest, right above the coronet, has left a small hairless scar right were it meets the hoof wall. It’s not scratches or cannon crud. These things are small hard, scabby/crusty nodules that are difficult to pull off, even after applying vasoline for a few days. They weep a very small amount when they do come off but re-scab over quickly. I’ve never seen anything like this.

It sounds like this condition is not so rare based on the number of posts here. Have any vets reading encountered this?[/QUOTE]

Yes, yes, I feel like I have found my people!

We need a clique - “Owners of horses with incurable pastern crud that is NOT scratches.”

This thread did call to mind the following article from The Horse last year - which I had forgotten about, but it gave me some validation at the time.
http://www.thehorse.com/articles/33608/equine-pastern-vasculitis-still-puzzling-researchers

[IvyHall]

My horse had pastern dermatitis for months. I became obsessive about leg care. His legs were kept as clean and dry as possible and I applied the medicated cream prescribed by the vet. His legs didn’t get worse but they really didn’t get better. He was sound and didn’t seem too bothered with them so I kept up with the obsessive care.

Then, in late December of 2014 they all of a sudden became much worse. Very clearly infected, swollen and sore. I also noticed weird thickening of the skin/scabs where the top of the hoof/coronet ends and his leg begins. It was something I had never seen before. Vet came out and horse got 8 days of naxcel, 17 days of prednisolone and is still (1/20/15) on TMS which he started after the 8 days of naxcel. He was not biopsied initially bc he was already so sore. He has greatly improved and is sound but he still has the odd thickening of skin right at the coronet. I literally peel “them” off, and then apply the new medicated cream which has been prescribed (and which I believe helps a great deal).

Vet that hasn’t seen his legs at their worst (in person) but who manages his care/medication for his lymphoma is concerned this could be autoimmune related. In my non professional opinion I am inclined to think, that sadly, she is right.

[whitney159]

[QUOTE=Groom&Taxi;7969452]
Yes, yes, I feel like I have found my people!

We need a clique - “Owners of horses with incurable pastern crud that is NOT scratches.”

This thread did call to mind the following article from The Horse last year - which I had forgotten about, but it gave me some validation at the time.
http://www.thehorse.com/articles/33608/equine-pastern-vasculitis-still-puzzling-researchers[/QUOTE]

Amen, I thought I was the only one! this is not “scratches”. Mine are hard, like the oozy yellow stuff has formed a rock hard crust over the skin.

Mine also aren’t on the heel, but on the front of her pastern.

[DMK]

My 23 year old TB is still surviving quite well with them, whatever they are.

They act a lot like keratosis - skin just going into hyperdrive and laying on more and more layers. Not surprising, this horse also gets some pretty wicked cannon keratosis (and face keratosis in the summer). I’ve found when I get very dedicated and treat it like it is a keratosis (looks like a duck, swims and quacks like a duck, maybe it is a duck?) it subsides for as long as I actively treat it. And then when I am tired of treating it, or it is not visible and I stop treating it, it comes right back.

But, see above - 23 years, still doing just fine in spite of my treatment (or lack thereof) efforts.

When I do get motivated to treat it, I use dermabenss shampoo - contains sulfur, vitamin E, salicylic acid and benzoyl peroxide. Pretty much the only things that help with that seborrheic response that seems to be at the heart of this condition (WTF it may be).

Here’s the description from one website that manufactures it:

Indications
Designed for use on oily and scaly skin (seborrhea oleosa), superficial and deep pyodermas, crusty pyodermas, and can also be used as adjunctive therapy for generalized demodicosis and Schnauzer comedo syndrome or other causes of folliculitis. Studies have indicated that benzoyl peroxide may also be effective when topically treating methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus infections.
Benzoyl Peroxide may bleach fabrics and other absorbent materials. Use carefully (gloves are recommended), and avoid contact with clothing and furnishings.
Active Ingredients
• 2.5% Benzoyl Peroxide provides antimicrobial (especially antibacterial),
keratolytic, comedolytic (follicular flushing), and degreasing actions.
• 1% Sodium Thiosulfate (Sulfur) provides keratoplastic, keratolytic,
antibacterial, antifungal, and antiparasitic benefits.
• 1% Salicylic Acid provides mild antipruritic, antibacterial, keratoplastic,
and keratolytic actions; lowers the skin pH and increases corneocyte
hydration. Salicylic acid and sulfur have shown to be synergistic in their
keratolytic actions.
• Ceramides aid in moisturizing, repairing, and restoring dry damaged skin.

[HorseLoverJana]

Wow! I really thought I was alone on this… My 22yo TB gelding gets these, too. Nothing I’ve tried (and, like many of you, I’ve tried everything) seems to do much of anything to help.

Seems strange that this many of our horses display the same symptom, but nobody has any sort of definitive diagnosis… Wait, now that I think about it, that’s pretty much par for the course in the horse world, isn’t it?

[Underthebridge]

Someone needs to make a list, color and breed?

[3dazey]

My OTTB developed this when I retired him and pulled his shoes. They annoyed me, so I unwisely went very aggressive on them and left the poor horse with a wicked case of cellulitis. The vet suspected an auto-immune issue and I do agree with this. Also, he told me since the horse was no longer showing and the scabs didn’t seem to bother him, that they were best left alone. What did seem to keep them to a minimum (though they never went away) was a stronger mixture of Nolvasan solution and water sprayed on two or three times a week.