I’ve been learning to post and I’ve improved greatly. I can feel the difference in my riding and Chey’s reactions. The weekend before last I learned about diagonals. Tonight I realized that while I can’t tell you without looking which diagonal I’m on I can pretty much tell when I’m on the wrong one. What am I feeling that let’s me know I’m on the wrong diagonal? Is it something in my hip movement? I took notice last week that when she walks my hip moved forward as her leg goes forward. I’m trying to understand what I’m feeling.
Watch a dog walk. As their hind foot moves forward, their barrel moves to the other side to make room, so to speak. You feel the motion of the horse’s barrel, which isn’t as extreme as a dog’s of course but exists. So as the left hind comes forward, the barrel moves to the right and your seat displaces to the right, and vice versa.
Dressage lessons focus on this sort of thing, and good flatwork in H/J will incorporate it as well. The art of timing will depend on where the horses legs are in any cycle of gait, so for an example if you want to canter from a trot it is best to ask when the outside hind, the strikeoff foot, is just getting ready to come down so it can begin it’s cycle in the new pattern of footfalls.
We did exercises when I was a kid where we had to call out where our horses hind feet were. Some people get it without thinking and others have to put a LOT of thought into it. I was one of the dummies, probably still am.
Well the trot strides should feel the same, whether you are sitting, posting, going left or right. Unless your horse is lame or does not have even trot strides, her shoulders should move the same each direction. So if you can feel when you on the wrong diagonal, you should be able to feel when you are on the right diagonal. A lot of horses are smoother one direction than the other, so their movement changes each direction which may make your diagonals feel different. And usually riders sit more on one seat bone than the other (I sit slightly more on the right seat bone, evident on the amount of dirt on the underside of a saddle pad). But I don’t know how you can feel the wrong diagonal but can’t feel the correct (outside) diagonal.
Don’t feel bad if you can’t feel your diagonals right away. There are A LOT of experienced riders (or those who have been riding a long time) who still look down for their diagonals.
[QUOTE=Equitational;8192976]
But I don’t know how you can feel the wrong diagonal but can’t feel the correct (outside) diagonal. [/QUOTE]
Because when we are learning things - especially about things as elusive as a “feeling” - it doesn’t always happen in a logical, symmetrical, or linear fashion. [Also, there is an actual difference in how the diagonals feel, at least if the horse is turning. Otherwise, there wouldn’t be a “correct” one]. I was exactly the same as the OP when I learned my diagonals. I think it’s because it felt awkward when it was wrong, so I “knew”, but because I didn’t feel anything special when it was right, I was just never sure. Maybe deep down I “knew” but I just didn’t know it yet 
OP, look at it this way. You are basically halfway there…if you know when you are wrong, just fix it, and eventually the correct feeling will be automatic. Don’t stress yourself out about “getting them”. Worst case scenario - you don’t and sit an extra beat, and all is well again.
Well, one we reason post on diagonals is help keep our horse balanced. When you are posting on the correct diagonal, your horse should go around feeling fine. When you’re on the wrong one, it can feel like your horse has a “flat tire,” especially around turns. To me, when I’m on the wrong diagonal, they feel short because they’re scrambling a little bit to stay balanced.
But like someone said above, kudos for being able to feel that! It’s different for every horse, but the fact that you’re developing feel is awesome! Keep trying to learn and get it right and soon you’ll be posting on the correct diagonal without checking at all!
[QUOTE=Equitational;8192976]
Well the trot strides should feel the same, whether you are sitting, posting, going left or right. Unless your horse is lame or does not have even trot strides, her shoulders should move the same each direction. [/QUOTE]
^^This^^
If the horse is moving correctly and evenly from behind, they shouldn’t feel “like they have a flat tire” when you’re posting on the inside shoulder. While most times it is more appropriate to post on the outside diagonal (especially on a circle or other bending exercise), there are times when doing the opposite (posting on the inside diagonal) is a better plan. Thirty plus years ago when I first started riding in an organized lesson program, the language was “inside” and “outside” shoulder (and yes, we posted mostly on the outside shoulder)–when did the world decide that posting on the inside shoulder was “wrong” versus just another option to use when circumstances dictate?? (It certainly isn’t in the rule book, and even DQ’s aren’t penalized for posting on the inside leg so long as the horse’s movement is correct.)
Long story short, learn to feel which leg is going forward (right/left) and rise with the one that will most benefit the exercise you’re doing.
Long story short, learn to feel which leg is going forward (right/left) and rise with the one that will most benefit the exercise you’re doing.
So let’s see if I’m understanding you correctly; when I feel I’m on the “correct diagonal” aka the outside diagonal subconsciously I’m feeling the outside leg go forward. But when I’m feeling the “wrong diagonal” aka inside diagonal, subconsciously I’m feeling the inside leg go forward. Which direction I’m going is irrelevant as I feel the “right” or “wrong” diagonal in either direction. So while in my conscious mind I’m not able to readily identify which is which whether it’s the inside or outside leg going forward simply by feel, subconsciously I’m starting to pick it up. And since I was taught the outside leg going forward is the “correct diagonal” when I’m not feeling that is when I’m feeling it as the “wrong” diagonal because it feels different than the feeling I’ve identified as the “correct” diagonal. Am I correct in this assumption? Which leads to wonder how am I feeling that leg go forward? Does her body shift down in the right front corner when her outside leg goes forward and vice versa? Is it a twist of some sort I’m feeling? A combination of sorts?
My next question is this; When I transition to the canter I’ve been taught to use my outside leg to start her which then puts the inside leg forward. I can see this as a tool from the physics aspect for her to be able to pull herself around the inside corners at speed. So why would the outside leg be the proper leg at a trot? Is it to give her the extra step to transition in to the canter? Or is it something else? She’ll lead with whichever leg depending upon which leg I use to start her (found that out with an accidental bump then played with it a little).
[QUOTE=Horseman15;8196318]
Am I correct in this assumption? Which leads to wonder how am I feeling that leg go forward? Does her body shift down in the right front corner when her outside leg goes forward and vice versa? Is it a twist of some sort I’m feeling? A combination of sorts? [/QUOTE]
Biomechanically, the action of the horse’s legs at the trot mimics what people do at the walk (i.e. diagonal pairs move together). In humans, the arm swing that happens opposite to the leg swing serves to reduce oscillations or shifts in the center of gravity–think of it as the hips rotating slightly one direction ® to allow the opposite leg (L) to step through and the shoulders rotating the opposite way to create balance or stability (equal and opposite actions). As for the “right” and “wrong” of the feeling your experiencing, without seeing you and your horse together, my guess is that the horse is slightly crooked in it’s movement (not lame, just not 100% straight). If a horse is 100% straight and moving from behind on 2 tracks (for plain trot), there will be no “wrong” feeling when posting on either shoulder. If you feel like you have a flat tire, work on straightness.
When I first learned how to feel my trot diagonals without looking, I did LOTS of sitting trot without stirrups–if you’re steady and not gripping like a fiend, you can begin to feel the horse’s front legs move away from your calf as the contour of the barrel just behind the shoulder changes ever so slightly. Think about allowing your legs to match that swing (don’t really swing your legs! but find the rhythm).
When trotting a horse on a bending line, the outside legs will travel a bit further than the inside (to see this on paper, draw a big circle with a medium sized one inside it–if you imagine the inside legs following the circumference of the medium circle and the outside legs the larger one, you can almost see how posting with that outside leg as it goes forward will “help” the horse maintain the curve). To help the horse (and rider) learn to travel more straightly as a unit (even on curved lines), a great exercise is to change your posting diagonal often–stay on a 20m or so circle and change your diagonal every 3-4 strides–at first, if the horse is crooked, posting on the inside shoulder will feel terrible! When that gets easy, switch every 2 strides or even every stride. I had an old instructor who would make us go up/down…5-4-3-2-1-2-3-4-5…to prevent both the horse and rider from magnifying the other’s crookedness. 
You signal the canter depart with your outside leg as the inside foreleg is coming forward so the horse can lift itself into that lead and around your inside leg (but it’s not really about turning). Unlike the trot which is a 2-beat gait, the canter has 3 beats, with the inside fore and outside hind traveling alone and the remaining diagonal pair together. Good timing will allow the horse to pick up the canter from the hind end while simultaneously elevating the front. In fact, it can be helpful for green horses to be asked for canter as you post on the inside shoulder when first learning (versus bending them to the outside)!
Again, there are no right or wrong diagonals or leads (depending on the exercise you’re doing!) The trot is naturally a very stable and straight gait, so diagonals should be used to enhance or correct that straightness. For example, if you’re tracking to the left and posting on the right/outside shoulder, beginning a leg yield to the left will be more difficult on that diagonal than if you swap it to the left/inside shoulder (the direction of travel). With the canter, the leading leg will be carried slightly forward to the other foreleg, which you can distinctly feel when riding without stirrups as your inside leg wants to be at the girth and the outside leg slightly behind (Again, your legs are mimicking the positioning of the horse’s front legs.) FWIW, horses don’t instinctively canter the lead opposite of the leg you use–they were taught that cue.
If you have the option/ability to take a few lunge lesson, they’d go a long way to helping you pick up on the “feel” aspects of what you’re asking–not having to worry about pace or direction and being able to keep your shoulders still really lets you concentrate on YOU.
Working off of a lunge would be nice. I’m still trying to figure out how to control her so she maintains a constant speed at the trot and canter. She loves to run. From what I understand she has always rushed everything and isn’t necessarily the best to learn on. Last night I made some progress with that by intermittently running her in figure 8s at the trot and S-turns around jumps when cantering. Tuesday that’s one of the things I want address with my trainer. I want to make sure I’m not unconsciously giving her cues. The barn owner thinks most of my problem is in Chey’s head but I’m having her feet done Tuesday and the vet is coming out on the 27th I think it is to give her stifle injections. She had them done the end of July last year from what I was told.
OK, got off topic with that. The way you explain it makes sense. I just need to train myself to recognize what I’m feeling consciously I’m sure that’ll come with time. I try to ride most every night but I usually end up only riding 4 - 5 times a week. Working 12 hour days it’s not a problem but when I work 14 hours and then ride I end up with very little sleep so that doesn’t usually happen.
Thanks everyone! I honestly appreciate the input
