What rides like a Palm Beach, but fits horse like a Mademoiselle?

[BroncoMo]

Full disclosure, I’m in the middle of an all out melt down over this saddle situation.

You may have read my post from last month asking about saddle fitters. Readers digest version: horse has massive wither that saddles slide back on and severe kissing spines. We only discovered the kissing spines because of a melt down at a show… in which I was primarily riding him in my Palm Beach. He is happy in my trainer’s Mademoiselle. Had the Voltaire rep out and he suggested building the panel up for the horse. I knew in my gut that it wouldn’t work, but in a last ditch effort to salvage the saddle, I did it. And now it looks like it fits worse……

The independent saddle fitter is still on the table. So I’m absolutely not crossing off any of those saddle brands recommended to me in my previous post. At this moment, I’m triaging in my mind and just trying to get some answers to questions that are floating around.

Does anyone know of a saddle that has the rider balance of a Palm Beach, but fits the horse like a Mademoiselle? Since my saddle has been out getting worked on, I’ve been riding in a friends (I think) Mademoiselle. I hate it for me (forward flap, and I need a straight) but it sits so nicely on his back. And he jumped around today for the first time in a month like an absolute pro. So I may need to recreate the tree/fit situation, but I’m more than a little skeptical of my available brand reps. Not that they can’t be knowledgeable, but I need to know these things on my own, independently, and stop hemorrhaging money at a situation that’s likely not going to be salvaged.

[LazyA1]

I’m having a difficult time fitting one of mine also. He has a high wither and when I fit the wither, so far the saddles have been pommel high and put me in a chair seat.

My fitter suggested a CWD with a 2G tree (mademoiselle) but I hate the clunkiness of that saddle. Thus, I’d also be interested in what saddles have a tree similar to CWD 2G tree.

For what it’s worth, a used saddle dealer who has been great at helping me fit my other horses suggested an Antares AF1 tree. I do not know which Antares have that tree, but will be finding out. ETA: the Antares AF1 tree is the Connexion. I will be looking into that one.

[pnwstomp]

You could try the hunter mademoiselle. The CH flaps on the hunter version didn’t feel quite as forward to me as the C flaps on the non-hunter one. The non-hunter one also put me in a terrible chair seat.

[LazyA1]

Oh thanks! I did not know there were different mademoiselles. But that ugly plastic on the panel, ick.

[pnwstomp]

Yes, the best part about the hunter mademoiselle is none of the tacky plastic look. It’s really a beautiful saddle!

[LazyA1]

Yes, thanks for the tip on the hunter mademoiselle. Going to try to find a used one, hopefully in grain leather.

[Belmont]

The hunter version on the 2Gs & Madem don’t have plastic. You can always get it leather covered on any 2G you order. At least, you could when I worked for them.

The 2G & Madem are different.
The Madem comes in a hunter version (less padding on the flap, tone stitching, and some other changes that clients gave feedback on) and the original version. They are a flatter saddle with a narrower twist than a traditional 2Gs and a U shaped pommel for the “womens” pelvis. I say “women” because a lot of men also ride in them. The padding in the seat is different than the gel in the 2G. They are lighter & more sleek than the 2G’s.

The 2Gs comes in flat & semi-deep. They also come in a hunter version where the kevlar is covered.
Example: https://north-america.cwdsellier.com/en/pre-owned-saddles/27489-SE26092753.html

@BroncoMo As for a “fit” like the Madem, you’re looking for a tree that isn’t made of wood as well as the wider, flatter panels. I’d be interested to know the paneling on your trainers saddle. Is there anyway you can find out?

I would absolutely look for a independent fitter brand suggest you try all the brand fitters that will come out. My old co-worker (that I thought would die with CWD) just moved to Arion and says their saddles are sensational.

[pnwstomp]

Lol this is much more informed and informative than my suggestion. Also, the Arion saddles are seriously beautiful!

[Annie10]

There’s a consignment store in Ocala called Good Apple. I would check their website and see what they have. You can also call them and ask them to watch for what you want

[Ponyplusaninch]

Sorry the repanneling didn’t work out!

Like I said on the last thread, I’d explore Amerigo or Equipe, both of which are significantly cheaper than CWDs when new (and sometimes cheaper than used CWDs I’ve seen on FB). Both have the balance and comfort of French saddles but with more fit options for the horse. Both brands have special considerations for high withers.

You could also look at Harry Dabbs which is even less expensive than the three bands above. They also take wither clearance into consideration. Heck, they are in general very amenable to a high level of customization and fit.

I hope you’re able to got the route of the independent saddle fitter which, at the very least, will help you better pinpoint what you need, new or used, so you can save some time and $$$.

[IPEsq]

There are so many used Mademoiselle saddles out there I bet you can find something reasonably priced with a straight flap. Look at the stamp on the saddle he likes to see what the panel is. You want either an L or H (hunter) flap.

I don’t really know what else fits the horse just like that saddle (it doesn’t fit either of my horses at all even when they were ok with a slightly stretched out older 2Gs tree). It tends to be a bit tight next to the withers IMO (perhaps helping you get the clearance you need) and is a pretty straight tree.

There is a newer CWD (I forget the model in the dynamic line) that is supposed to have a closer contact feel that might be what you are looking for in your position, but if you don’t trust your reps, go with used in what you know he likes.

[Bristol_Bay]

I’ve had good luck with High Line Tack. Email them and tell them what you’re looking for.

Also, maybe pick your battles regarding the plastic on the cantle. You can’t see it while your horse is jumping around like an absolute pro.

[BroncoMo]

This is my trainers saddle. I just set it on his back and it’s not quite perfect but far better than my Voltaire. And he does not oppose this saddle.

This is my friends saddle that sits beautifully on him. I don’t know what some of these codes mean (RG+ RT+). Also, 710 means 10 mm added? Or shaved? From the shoulder?

The main issue is getting wither clearance. Everything slides back off his withers to the point that the pommel nearly touches.

[NaturallyHappy]

I’m going to try the Arion w the shoulder free panel for that exact reason. There was quite a bit of positive information posted here a while ago. It looks like a genius idea to me.

[IPEsq]

The trainer’s saddle is a standard panel with extra shoulder room. The other saddle has -10mm in the entire front part of the panel and shoulder and withers room. The tree on the second saddle is probably a little narrower allowing for this panel to work.

You might look for a SE01 for a more forward rider balance for you with friend’s panel codes. Tree should be the same as friend’s saddle.

[LazyA1]

Tree on SE01 is flatter than SE02

[BroncoMo]

The 10 mm of panel removed is what I thought. What does SE01/2/3 indicate?

[BroncoMo]

Tree being flatter indicating the seat being flatter? Or the actual contact with the back being flatter? It appears the horse needs a flatter fit and the Voltaire seems to have a very curvy fit on his back.

[BroncoMo]

Also any idea what RG+ and RT+ indicates?

[BroncoMo]

What part of the stamp indicates shoulder room in the trainers stamp?