The Czantiago thread got me wondering.
Let’s say I wanted to breed my 3/4 Hanoverian, 1/4 Arabian mare. Assuming I would use a WB stallion with little to no Arabian blood in the past, say, 5-6 (or more) generations, would it be wise to test her for the various genetic diseases carried by Arabians? Or would such testing be an unnecessary expense?
For me it would depend on her Arabian blood. If there are any know carriers of SCID or CA in her pedigree I would test if I was breeding her to an Arabian to a WB stallion probably not unless there is Arabian blood in the pedigree. If you are breeding to an Arabian stallion that is a know carrier of CS or SCID, you will be required to test your mare by the stallion owner. Most Arabian stallion owners are very open about their stallion’s status and will require this - those that don’t… well I’d move on, there are a lot of Arabian stallions to choose from. Testing is not that expensive.
If you want to share her Arabian part of the pedigree I can tell you if it is suspect or not.
[QUOTE=stripes;8027854]
If you want to share her Arabian part of the pedigree I can tell you if it is suspect or not.[/QUOTE]
Ohhh, Pick Me! Pick Me!
Seriously, I have a half-bred Arab/WB mare I am breeding this year for the first time (to a WB with no TB or Arab blood). Until DownYonder said something, it never occured to me to think of testing.
For what it’s worth, her dam (the PB Arab) had four foals for me, all great animals, but none were PB Arabs. They were either Teke/Arab x or WB/Arab.
Here is the PB Arab’s pedigree:http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/jt+maja
I would just go ahead and test for all three (SCID, CA, and LFS) since just going based on known carrier lines overlooks all the unknown carriers. Seriously, I know of multiple cases where Arabian breeders thought their lines were clear of one or another of these genetic disorders only to discover that they DID have carriers in their herd. The problem with these recessive disorders is that they are only detected when affected foals are born or via test results. “Guessing” whether testing is “worthwhile” based on publicly known or suspected carriers is a gamble. The tests are definitive and are the only way to actually KNOW!
I think it’s always good to know what you’ve got in there. That said, I don’t think you’re running the risk of producing a foal inheriting two copies of any of these genes if there is no Arab blood in the stallion.
Here’s a list of tested horses and their results. The tests aren’t that expensive, I would test. That said if you’re not breeding to Arabians I think you’ll be ok.
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=54&Itemid=58
Thanks Stripes, SportArab, and Dawn JL.
I will peruse the list of tested horses, but meanwhile, here is the pedigree of the mare in question. http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/pflashpoint
Since her Arabian grandam was born in 1983 - would that have pre-dated these tests?
Bask* is the stallion of note that carried the CID gene and he was imported from Poland along with Witez 2 , Wirez and Star of Ofir, if I remember correctly. They were escaping the German invasion of Poland and the Polish Stud sent these horses to the US to save them from the Germans invading on one side and the Russians on the other.
These are the horses that I would look for in your pedigree.
And this is a cautionary tale about inbreeding, since Bask was so popular - just as Impressive was so popular for quarter horses and he carried the hypp gene.
[QUOTE=DownYonder;8029261]
Thanks Stripes, SportArab, and Dawn JL.
I will peruse the list of tested horses, but meanwhile, here is the pedigree of the mare in question. http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/pflashpoint
Since her Arabian grandam was born in 1983 - would that have pre-dated these tests?[/QUOTE]
Gai-Robert is a Bask son.
[QUOTE=Kyzteke;8027946]
Ohhh, Pick Me! Pick Me!
Seriously, I have a half-bred Arab/WB mare I am breeding this year for the first time (to a WB with no TB or Arab blood). Until DownYonder said something, it never occured to me to think of testing.
For what it’s worth, her dam (the PB Arab) had four foals for me, all great animals, but none were PB Arabs. They were either Teke/Arab x or WB/Arab.
Here is the PB Arab’s pedigree:http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/jt+maja[/QUOTE]
That horse definitely needs to be tested.
[QUOTE=DaniW;8029517]
Bask* is the stallion of note that carried the CID gene and he was imported from Poland along with Witez 2 , Wirez and Star of Ofir, if I remember correctly. They were escaping the German invasion of Poland and the Polish Stud sent these horses to the US to save them from the Germans invading on one side and the Russians on the other.
.[/QUOTE]
This is not correct. Bask was purchased at 3-4 yrs of age by Gene LaCroix in the '60’s and brought to America then.
Well, I suppose testing might be prudent, but the PB Arab in question is currently 22 yrs of age and never had a sick day (or lame day). So I’m guessing that worst case scenario she might be a carrier.
So her daughter (the WB/Arab I’m currently breeding) has a 25% chance of being a carrier, right? What are the odds of that daughter being bred to WB and producing a carrier?
And no chance of producing an actual horse with one of the conditions. Isn’t that correct?
[QUOTE=Kyzteke;8029594]
This is not correct. Bask was purchased at 3-4 yrs of age by Gene LaCroix in the '60’s and brought to America then.
Well, I suppose testing might be prudent, but the PB Arab in question is currently 22 yrs of age and never had a sick day (or lame day). So I’m guessing that worst case scenario she might be a carrier.
So her daughter (the WB/Arab I’m currently breeding) has a 25% chance of being a carrier, right? What are the odds of that daughter being bred to WB and producing a carrier?
And no chance of producing an actual horse with one of the conditions. Isn’t that correct?[/QUOTE]
That’s what I get for trying to write from memory. I read a book on witez 2 back when I was a kid and had a witez 2 grandson. Bask is a half brother to Witez 2 I think that’s why I remembered bask as being part of that shipment of 4 horses. At any rate, they all came from the same stud and are all suspect, with Bask being a known carrier.
Just to be very clear… *Bask was NOT at SCID carrier.
[QUOTE=DaniW;8029517]
Bask* is the stallion of note that carried the CID gene and he was imported from Poland along with Witez 2 , Wirez and Star of Ofir, if I remember correctly. They were escaping the German invasion of Poland and the Polish Stud sent these horses to the US to save them from the Germans invading on one side and the Russians on the other.
These are the horses that I would look for in your pedigree.
And this is a cautionary tale about inbreeding, since Bask was so popular - just as Impressive was so popular for quarter horses and he carried the hypp gene.[/QUOTE]
There is so much wrong with this post!!! Star of Ofir(sired by *Bask) was born in the states and *Bask was not even imported with these horses. CRAZY post and not true!
*Bask wasn’t even born until the mid 50’s and imported in '63.
Dani, Dani, Dani - whew! So many errors!
OP - the complete panel of tests for SCID, CA, and LFS is $216 for one horse. Put your mind at ease and have your mare tested. Then you don’t have to worry about hearsay, misinformation, speculation, and lord knows what else. I think your chances of finding anything are probably quite low, but why play the odds? Test and know for sure…
Sorry, duplicate post!
[QUOTE=DaniW;8029517]
Bask* is the stallion of note that carried the CID gene and he was imported from Poland along with Witez 2 , Wirez and Star of Ofir, if I remember correctly. They were escaping the German invasion of Poland and the Polish Stud sent these horses to the US to save them from the Germans invading on one side and the Russians on the other.
These are the horses that I would look for in your pedigree.
And this is a cautionary tale about inbreeding, since Bask was so popular - just as Impressive was so popular for quarter horses and he carried the hypp gene.[/QUOTE]
*Bask was not a SCID carrier. He was bred to many Crabbet American mares that were great nicks for him and some of those mares may have been carriers and some of the foals were subsequent carriers. Toronado, one of his very good sons was a SCID carrier having gotten the gene through his dam *Silwara a Crabbet import.
Star of Ofir was bred in 1970 by Lester Walton the breeder of Bey Shah.
[QUOTE=stripes;8029746]
Just to be very clear… *Bask was NOT at SCID carrier.[/QUOTE]
That is absolutely untrue. He definitely was a CID carrier.
[QUOTE=DaniW;8029800]
That is absolutely untrue. He definitely was a CID carrier.[/QUOTE]
NO HE WAS NOT. *Bask was not and a SCID carrier.
SCID was first reposted in Australia in 1973 and came out of Crabbet herd - *Bask was never a carrier.
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