What would you do? Plus suggestions on bits vs bitless

[acoustic]

My horse hated the cross over type bitless bridles. Hated them. He is a stoic horse and you can put anything else on him or in his mouth with no fuss but he was very angry with the crossover/under type of bridle. He slammed the brakes and tossed his head so hard the first time I touched the reins that he was nearly sitting down like a dog. The way he acted, you’d have thought I had just yanked as hard as I could on a long shank spade bit! I pulled that thing off him right then and I could see the relief in his eyes. Put his bit back in and everything was right as rain. I thought I was doing him a favor, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions :winkgrin:.

Just a heads up that some horses will not like them. The english hackamore and beetle hackamore are good options if your horse isn’t prone to getting strong. You can make any of the rope nose hacks gentler by wrapping it in vetrap and fleece or sheepskin covers.

[BEARCAT]

[QUOTE=Nariah01;7832301]
Out of the side pull options do you think I could get anything to add to one of her bridles to make it into a side pull?[/QUOTE]

Yes, the one Appsolute and I posted just goes on your regular bridle. You buy the hackamore part.

For example (can probably be found cheaper if you shop around.)
https://www.horseloverz.com/product/bridle-parts/190910-tory-leather-jumping-hackamore.html

[roseymare]

I had no idea about those crossover bitless bridles. It sure looks like you could cause quite a bit of discomfort with one on a young horse whose molars are in the process of erupting as it looks like they don’t sit in the chin groove but higher on the jaw. Maybe it is an optical illusion.

[Bogie]

My horse also hated the cross under style bridles. The poll pressure made him rear. I like this style sidepull attachment: www.orbitlessbridle.co.uk. I have an LG Bridle that is very similar but it’s no longer sold in the US and quite expensive. This is virtually the same and costs less. Nickers Saddlery sells one too.

[Jackie_Cochran]

Yes, I hear, some horses don’t like a cross-under. HOWEVER it often depends on the strength of the contact and the strength of the hand aids, if a rider is has heavy hands that do not release the rein aids it can be confusing and uncomfortable to the horse. If you ride with mostly loose reins (not on contact all the time), use gentle rein aids, and promptly release your rein aids the problems will be a lot less. Save all hard pulls or yanks for EMERGENCIES, not everyday riding.

Today I got up on the most sensitive mouthed AND most sensitive nosed horse I’ve ever ridden in 45 years of riding. I used my Dr. Cooks with the Spirit Bridle round leather cross-under parts and I had no more protests that I do using a JP eggbutt full cheek single jointed snaffle with bit loops (her selection of bit). Lets see, walk-both with and without contact–everything was fine. Trot–same, in fact she showed more impulse when I “fingered” the reins than usual. Turn on the hindquarters, backing up, turn on the forehand–everything was fine, she was light, responsive, and quite cheerful about the whole thing (I had not ridden her in over 5 weeks, 28 yr. old OPINIONATED Arab mare who always lets me know if something displeases her.)

My main protests against the side pull bridle is that it can be VERY easy to teach the horse to brace and pull against the rein aids. I have an ancient Jumping Cavesson bridle with the divided cheek pieces which works a little better that the regular side pulls, yes I can keep contact better than with a cross-under with it, but by golly when the horse decides to GO there is not much I can do about it without getting rough. The sensitive mare I referred to above likes either the Nurtural cross-under or the Dr. Cook with the Spirit round leather cross-unders bitless bridle to my Jumping cavesson, when I ride her in the Jumping Cavesson she slings her head around if I dare try to keep contact. She MUCH prefers a LIGHT HAND on the cross-under, especially with the Spirit Bridle round leather cross-unders. Yes, I did have to change my indirect rein in front of the withers, I just laid the rein against her neck without any pressure on the nose/cross-under straps, and she understood me just fine since I was also using my legs and seat to tell her what I wanted. In the Nurtural bitless bridle she will not accept much contact, but if I ride with sagging reins, use gentle, well timed hand aids, and release my aids promptly, she is fine with it.

One reason I recommend the Nurtural bitless over the Dr. Cook bitless the that the flat cross-under straps do not get twisted as much in the Nurtural, one thing the rider has to be religious about checking with the Dr. Cook’s. I do not have to worry about this with the rounded cross-under parts of the Spirit bridle reins. I had to get a different buckle on the Spirit Bridle reins so I could attach them to the Dr. Cook’s bitless bridle, but that was soooo worth it considering the mare’s response today, she was almost as responsive as she is with her favorite bit. When I tried the Dr. Cook’s on her with the original flat cross-under straps she did not like it anywhere as much.

This mare accepts the Light Rider bitless bridle fine, but does not want constant contact. She was sort of bleeh with the original Dr. Cook’s. She did.not.like. the LG bridle, and she HATED all three bitless options on the Miklem Multi-bridle. Very sensitive mare, very opinionated, elderly, creaky, and she actively protests any discomfort on her head or in her mouth.

Sorry for the long entry. I started riding bitless with my ancient Jumping Cavesson bridle over 40 years ago.

[Nariah01]

[QUOTE=Jackie Cochran;7833484]
Yes, I hear, some horses don’t like a cross-under. HOWEVER it often depends on the strength of the contact and the strength of the hand aids, if a rider is has heavy hands that do not release the rein aids it can be confusing and uncomfortable to the horse. If you ride with mostly loose reins (not on contact all the time), use gentle rein aids, and promptly release your rein aids the problems will be a lot less. Save all hard pulls or yanks for EMERGENCIES, not everyday riding.

Today I got up on the most sensitive mouthed AND most sensitive nosed horse I’ve ever ridden in 45 years of riding. I used my Dr. Cooks with the Spirit Bridle round leather cross-under parts and I had no more protests that I do using a JP eggbutt full cheek single jointed snaffle with bit loops (her selection of bit). Lets see, walk-both with and without contact–everything was fine. Trot–same, in fact she showed more impulse when I “fingered” the reins than usual. Turn on the hindquarters, backing up, turn on the forehand–everything was fine, she was light, responsive, and quite cheerful about the whole thing (I had not ridden her in over 5 weeks, 28 yr. old OPINIONATED Arab mare who always lets me know if something displeases her.)

My main protests against the side pull bridle is that it can be VERY easy to teach the horse to brace and pull against the rein aids. I have an ancient Jumping Cavesson bridle with the divided cheek pieces which works a little better that the regular side pulls, yes I can keep contact better than with a cross-under with it, but by golly when the horse decides to GO there is not much I can do about it without getting rough. The sensitive mare I referred to above likes either the Nurtural cross-under or the Dr. Cook with the Spirit round leather cross-unders bitless bridle to my Jumping cavesson, when I ride her in the Jumping Cavesson she slings her head around if I dare try to keep contact. She MUCH prefers a LIGHT HAND on the cross-under, especially with the Spirit Bridle round leather cross-unders. Yes, I did have to change my indirect rein in front of the withers, I just laid the rein against her neck without any pressure on the nose/cross-under straps, and she understood me just fine since I was also using my legs and seat to tell her what I wanted. In the Nurtural bitless bridle she will not accept much contact, but if I ride with sagging reins, use gentle, well timed hand aids, and release my aids promptly, she is fine with it.

One reason I recommend the Nurtural bitless over the Dr. Cook bitless the that the flat cross-under straps do not get twisted as much in the Nurtural, one thing the rider has to be religious about checking with the Dr. Cook’s. I do not have to worry about this with the rounded cross-under parts of the Spirit bridle reins. I had to get a different buckle on the Spirit Bridle reins so I could attach them to the Dr. Cook’s bitless bridle, but that was soooo worth it considering the mare’s response today, she was almost as responsive as she is with her favorite bit. When I tried the Dr. Cook’s on her with the original flat cross-under straps she did not like it anywhere as much.

This mare accepts the Light Rider bitless bridle fine, but does not want constant contact. She was sort of bleeh with the original Dr. Cook’s. She did.not.like. the LG bridle, and she HATED all three bitless options on the Miklem Multi-bridle. Very sensitive mare, very opinionated, elderly, creaky, and she actively protests any discomfort on her head or in her mouth.

Sorry for the long entry. I started riding bitless with my ancient Jumping Cavesson bridle over 40 years ago.[/QUOTE]

its alright I say post away! I like to see all sides of the story so to speak, and that can be hard to do when most people seem to dislike a particular product, in this case the cross-under type bridles. Which I can understand, as some horses really don’t do well with certain things. From my perspective I am trying to figure out what is going to work the best for Dolce without costing a whole lot because there is a very good chance it may not work and I have to get something else. I do have two bridles for her that it would be awesome to be able to adapt them to work, which something like the light rider has that option which is why I thought about trying those first.

However the whole bracing the neck thing with a side pull does concern me a bit. She has been known to have a very stiff neck, she often times counter bends on the lunge, and is very resistant and stiff in the neck, which we have been working on. I think a side pull may be the most similar to a halter, which is what she rode in before, but she would hang on the halter a bit when asked to first bend. There are just so many things to consider.

[Jackie_Cochran]

Yes, the Light Rider noseband looks great, I do wish it had been available when I got my Light Rider bridles. One feature of the Light Rider bitless bridle made with straps is that at a distance it looks just like a bitted bridle (as in the center of the riding ring, horse on rail.)

I hope the Light Rider is the one she decides to like!

[Nariah01]

[QUOTE=Jackie Cochran;7833798]
Yes, the Light Rider noseband looks great, I do wish it had been available when I got my Light Rider bridles. One feature of the Light Rider bitless bridle made with straps is that at a distance it looks just like a bitted bridle (as in the center of the riding ring, horse on rail.)

I hope the Light Rider is the one she decides to like![/QUOTE]

I hope so too, I hate the whole process of trying numerous things until you find the right one! I like the noseband idea because I can add it to either of her two bridles and if she doesn’t like the chinstrap I can use the regular rings on the noseband as a side pull. So I think it will work out ok in the long run. And if she doesn’t like either options then I will try the nurtural bridle, which I like, but I don’t know how she will respond to the whole face hug type feel.

[chicamux]

I also do not care for the confusing signals of the cross-under bitless bridles. However the “Indian” bitless bridle does seem to be a bit simpler. You can get just the nose pice which can be added to any type of bridle. The criss-cross is down low, about where a curb chain would be. You can lead the nose to the left or right in a manner more similar to the use of a snaffle bit.

Another bit option. I too love the Myler kimberwick bits. Just a moderate leverage bit, less mouth pressure, more curb chain. I had two Arabs who didn’t like tongue pressure from bits.

http://www.equestriancollections.com/product.asp?groupcode=TO80081

This ported mouth piece lifts the bit up higher in the mouth and gives great tongue relief. The other cool thing is you can attach your reins on the bottom rings for leverage affect or move the reins to the upper rings for snaffle affect. I have found that horses really are happier to work off of moderate chin pressure, moderate leverage, over typical snaffle bits, in the hands of the average rider. A well designed kimberwick, like the Mylers, are actually a pretty good choice for novice riders, depending on the mouth piece of course.

Chicamuxen

[Nariah01]

[QUOTE=chicamux;7834583]
I also do not care for the confusing signals of the cross-under bitless bridles. However the “Indian” bitless bridle does seem to be a bit simpler. You can get just the nose pice which can be added to any type of bridle. The criss-cross is down low, about where a curb chain would be. You can lead the nose to the left or right in a manner more similar to the use of a snaffle bit.

Another bit option. I too love the Myler kimberwick bits. Just a moderate leverage bit, less mouth pressure, more curb chain. I had two Arabs who didn’t like tongue pressure from bits.

http://www.equestriancollections.com/product.asp?groupcode=TO80081

This ported mouth piece lifts the bit up higher in the mouth and gives great tongue relief. The other cool thing is you can attach your reins on the bottom rings for leverage affect or move the reins to the upper rings for snaffle affect. I have found that horses really are happier to work off of moderate chin pressure, moderate leverage, over typical snaffle bits, in the hands of the average rider. A well designed kimberwick, like the Mylers, are actually a pretty good choice for novice riders, depending on the mouth piece of course.

Chicamuxen[/QUOTE]

Thanks I had forgotten about the Indian bosals/hackamores. I will keep that bit in mind as well. I have used a bit like that before on an arab I was riding at a show.