When do you bit up your strong young jumper horses?

[bornfreenowexpensive]

I should be clear…I would not expect ALL horses to go in a snaffle. When I worked for a top jumper, we flatted all the horses in snaffles…but for competitions, then went in MUCH stronger bits.

I do think that “bitting up” can actually let a rider be more soft and subtle with their aids. But you want to be careful and not look for a quick fix with a bit change…and for some really strong horses, you want to save your stronger bit for competing not training. Also, if I’m jumping gymnastics or schooling indoor rather than outside…I may use less bit.

I do hate it when people put every horse in a 3 ring leverage bit or bit up without really understanding WHAT sort of new bit or new hardware would be most effective and help progress the training of a horse.

[french_fry]

[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;8068220]
I should be clear…I would not expect ALL horses to go in a snaffle. When I worked for a top jumper, we flatted all the horses in snaffles…but for competitions, then went in MUCH stronger bits.

I do think that “bitting up” can actually let a rider be more soft and subtle with their aids. But you want to be careful and not look for a quick fix with a bit change…and for some really strong horses, you want to save your stronger bit for competing not training. Also, if I’m jumping gymnastics or schooling indoor rather than outside…I may use less bit.

I do hate it when people put every horse in a 3 ring leverage bit or bit up without really understanding WHAT sort of new bit or new hardware would be most effective and help progress the training of a horse.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this, I was largely being facetious in my first post. I do hate seeing half the horses in the puddle jumpers going around on the bottom ring of a 3-ring with the riders sawing all the way around. No one wants that.

There is, however, a large COTH contingent that is vocally opposed to jumping in anything but a snaffle, insisting that it exposes “holes” in the horse’s or rider’s training. Many of these people do not ride at a level where I’d take their opinion on this matter seriously (not pointing fingers at anyone on this thread - I was just pre-empting the eventual path I expected this thread to take.)

Full disclosure: I certainly do not ride at a level where I should be using anything other than a snaffle unless my trainer has a specific purpose in mind, so I’m not humble-bragging.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Definitely some horses need more than a snaffle. Most of mine DO go in snaffles but that is because I prefer to ride sensitive types of horses so that is what I own.

But regardless…To me it is a good question as to when to try a new bit. And since I literally just changed the bit on my one horse, I was trying to describe my thought process.

In his canter/walk transitions on the flat…he was starting to pull more, requiring me to give him a harder half halt. Switched him to the metal bit on the flat partly because the new FEI rules were looking like his mullen mouth HS Duo wasn’t legal any way (rule changed back so it is–eventing come under FEI rule very early). Tried the metal snaffle and he was good and accepting in it. Jumping…same thing. He was getting a bit strong (squealing and bucking aside)…I could control him but it required a stronger ride by me. I jumped him in the metal bit and unlike how he was a year ago…he went well in it and I got a quicker but still soft response.

So for me…I look to up the bit when I want or need a quicker response…but I make sure that they are still comfortable with the bit and jumping in good form.

[PoohLP]

To be clear, I know exactly why I use the bit I use on my horse. It was chosen by my trainer (who knows her stuff backwards and forwards) and her trainer (who is a former GP rider and trains and works with many current GP riders) because it provides exactly what my horse needs, when he needs it and allows me to use softer and more subtle aids when he doesn’t. We only started working in it after extensive work in a snaffle. He likes the action of the mouthpiece, loves how much play he gets from the snaffle ring, which is a big loose ring, and when I need it, respects and reacts appropriately to the leverage action from the lower ring. It is actually a two ring (so I mispoke on that). And when we do hunters, we do use a snaffle - and a real snaffle at that, not something that looks normal until you drop the bit and see it is actually a twitted, ported, monstrosity)

Not all horses can or should go in snaffles all the time. There is a reason you see double bridles on upper level dressage horses and all sorts of bits on upper level jumpers and it certainly isn’t a lack of training or rider expertise. It is because the bit is deemed appropriate for the job being performed and the horse performing it. Even at the lower levels, what you ask and require from a horse doing a 3ft jumper course vs a 3ft hunter course can be different (and not because they are going “faster.” A jumper needs to be more up, more adjustable and more rateable. Some horses will do this fine in a snaffle. Others could do it in a snaffle, but it would not be a fun experience for horse or rider.

So again, I’ll say that the point to look at other bits is when everything has been working, you find something that isn’t, you know why it isn’t and that it isn’t simply a training issue, and you identify that part of addressing the problem may be either a temporary or permanent bit change and you know why you are trying the bit you are trying.

[PoohLP]

[QUOTE=JustJump;8068128]
Or…you could stop doing the exercise he isn’t properly educated and mature enough to perform.

You could provide him with an alternative exercise designed to encourage him to balance up and remain attentive to the job at hand.

Instead of cantering into lines and doing courses, providing him with bounces and one stride gymnastics, for instance:

A cavaletti to a crossrail, followed by 18’ to a 9’bounce (steep X rails), followed by 20’ to a vertical-vertical one stride with a groundline set well out from the last element (see Linda Allen’s 101 Exercises and/or EquestrianCoach.com for ideas on this). Repeat a few times, then half circle right and left to another exercise you can canter to.

More physically and mentally demanding than “cantering more jumps and doing courses” and resorting to harsher bitting if the horse isn’t capable of remaining focused on the job and attentive to the rider.[/QUOTE]

I have done many, many gymnastics on my horse. Many single fences to a halt. Many rollback turns off of fences. My horse can totally stay focused for an entire course. He can and has done all of these exercises and more. His education has been steady and unrushed. But, occasionally, he needs a little bit of help to remind him where he needs to be (normally when he has surprised himself by really powering over a jump) and when he does, I can do it more effectively and yes, more subtly in his two ring.

[RugBug]

@bornfreenowexpensive;8068220

I do think that “bitting up” can actually let a rider be more soft and subtle with their aids. But you want to be careful and not look for a quick fix with a bit change…and for some really strong horses, you want to save your stronger bit for competing not training. Also, if I’m jumping gymnastics or schooling indoor rather than outside…I may use less bit.

This.

If you are looking for a quick fix and any holes are not being addressed, then you should rethink more bit. If you are seeing consistent areas crop up and another bit can address those areas while allowing the rider to remain soft, then maybe a bit change is in order.

And despite what everyone is telling you, not every horse will go in a plain snaffle. You need to 1)be safe, 2) use only as much bit as you need and 3) use the softest bit you can. Not enough bit is a quick way to train your horse to be disrespectful.

[foursocks]

It’s a tool and as others have said, should be used knowledgeably and judiciously. I do think less bit and better flatwork is a good first default choice, but I’ve used just about every type of bit there is out there on some of my more difficult rides, and sometimes more bit is better!

I am hesitant to bit up a young horse due to worries about diminishing returns over the long run, but every situation is different and sometimes it is appropriate. My jumper is young and large and can get heavy in front. We messed around with the idea of bitting him up in the short term but he got so upset with everything we tried that we just kept going with our program of intensive dressage work and that turned out to be the right choice. I ride him in a loose ring French link and I hope that as we go up the levels I can keep him in it, but if I can’t I’ll do what I need to solve whatever issue we are having.

[greysfordays]

frenchfry…i could try, but really, I just couldn’t love you more.

I think it really depends on the horse. Mine in particularly is super unhappy when we put him in loose ring, very thick snaffle. He doesn’t like the nutcracker action and when i watched video of him, I got the sense he just didn’t have enough space to be comfortable. His palette is pretty low. For him too, he prefers stability. So while the much thinner snaffle d-ring he works in now is technically a harsher bit, he seems much more relaxed and comfortable. He’s coming 6 now and still pretty green, but I think bitting is something that takes a bit of work and especially with a green bean, can change over time.

This assumes you’re in capable hands, focusing on flatwork, which I get the sense is the case.

[Hawks_Nest]

I see nothing wrong with bitting up a younger horse to jump when you are a knowledgeable and capable rider when the conditions are right.

If the horse is well schooled on the flat (in a snaffle) and can jump single fences in a relaxed and quiet manner (and sometimes even small courses, this depends on the horse) also in a snaffle but when the jumps go up or the speed goes up, there are problems, it is perfectly okay to bit up. As my trainer told me (and I felt) while in the process of finding the right jump bit for my young horse (just turned 7), you can’t ride a proper half halt front to back if your horse is running through the bridle, instead if you do not have a strong enough bit for the situation you are in, you ride a backwards half halt, which makes things worse.

My boy goes beautifully on the flat in a snaffle, is schooling 1st/2nd level dressage, has a very adjustable canter. I can trot him over fences in the snaffle on a good day but rarely can I canter him over them. Instead I ride him in a mickmar combination bit with two reins (snaffle and nose rope) and he goes amazingly. He can’t jump with a curb chain (head flipper), elevators have too much motion, and anything sharp in the mouth backs him off. He’ll push too the mickmar but I can shorten his stride and still remain soft. Maybe one day I won’t need it but I’d rather be safe and have an adjustable horse than have him running through my aids and putting us in dangerous situations.

[iJump]

Love all the responses and feedback! Especially about riding with the spaghetti noodle to get the softest feel… Ha ha!

Someone mentioned about flatting in a snaffle and using something stronger while competing/jumping (which is what I prefer) but I often see pros flatting in much stronger bits and jumping GP’s in a snaffle. Whatever works.

[PoohLP]

[QUOTE=iJump;8069764]

Someone mentioned about flatting in a snaffle and using something stronger while competing/jumping (which is what I prefer) but I often see pros flatting in much stronger bits and jumping GP’s in a snaffle. Whatever works.[/QUOTE]

I know several pros who have the normal bit they use on their horse for a given task (whatever it may be), who occasionally will work in a stronger bit for a “tune up”. Basically, the bit becomes a training aid to remind the horse to respect the aid and listen to the signals coming from the ride. In addition, a pro who is riding for a student might also work occasionally in a stronger bit for training purposes, but might not want the student to use the same bit because they do not feel the student has forgiving enough feel. So, basically, you get all sorts of fluid arrangements for bitting. So long as everyone knows and understands why certain choices are being made and what their implications are, this can be perfectly acceptable.

[4THEHORSES]

OP, to answer your actual question, sounds like your horse enjoys jumping and just gets excited over fences. In the beginning at least, I’m fine with that. Let them just enjoy some small fences before getting more technical.

I wouldn’t blame you for wanting some additional “brakes”. If that’s what you want, I think the key is to finding a bit that’s got that extra strength when you need it but learn how that specific bit is used and use the extra strength sparingly.

I would also try exercises like jumping the horse on a circle or close to a corner so that don’t have time to tank off after.

[BeeHoney]

I think it is appropriate to start all young horses in a very mild bit, some type of mild snaffle. Then, as they progress, if something else is needed you can make a change. There is no “recipe” for when to “bit up.” I would say that a rule of thumb is that you want to use the mildest, simplest bit that works well. Of course it is silly to think that there is something inherently better about snaffles, as a rider on a jumper course you need to have control. But, if a horse is afraid of the bit or uncomfortable in it’s mouth or worried about rein pressure, it isn’t going to jump as well. So, more important than knowing when to “bit up” is knowing that most problems need to be solved with practice and training, and bit changes are just a small piece of the whole situation.