When/if to go pro... thoughts wanted

[faultfree]

Hello everyone, first time poster here, but I have followed and read these forums for a while. I know there are a lot of great horse people on here so I figured it would be worth asking for some of your thoughts.

I am currently debating whether or not I want to declare as a professional. Some background on me: I am 21 (in my third year of college) I am fairly sure I do not want horses to be my sole source of income as a long term career plan, but I would love to make some money doing what I love, especially now since I am at the point where I no longer have the financial backing of my parents, and also don’t have the financial means to pursue this on my own. As a junior I was a working student and catch rode everything I could, ranging from ponies to OTTBs to warmbloods, that were from age 2 and up, sometimes getting the opportunity to show these horses as well. I have experience up to the 1.15m with my jumper, who was talented but a tough ride. He taught me how to stick to a naughty one During my last junior year, I was lucky enough to be loaned a very nice warmblood mare that I did the medal/maclay stuff on, and some jumper classes as well. Financial constraints prevented me from ever getting further than Zone finals, but I was lucky enough to experience quite a few different venues. I did EAP twice with Karen Healey and Joe Fargis, learned an enormous amount in those weeks and received valuable feedback in the form of a report card. I was getting paid to ride as a junior and now that I am an amateur and can no longer receive remuneration, I am missing it!

I would love to hear from some of you, especially those of you who are professionals, how did you know it was the right time to declare as a pro? I am tempted to declare simply because I don’t really have the financial means to pursue it myself right now as an amatuer, and I unless I hit the lottery, it seems unlikely that I will have much financial means in the next couple years either.

[Horsegirl_s_Mom]

What is your plan for making money as a pro? What opportunities are available to you?

[flexion]

I think with your circumstances and flexibility there is less risk to giving up your amateur card. So many people will say never go pro, it sucks, but you’re in a good position. You are giving up the ability to show on the weekend, which makes showing hard when you have classes or a 9-5 job. If funding your own showing endeavors isn’t in the cards for you right now and won’t be until you have an established income… then why not? You can always apply for reinstatement in the future (it’s easy).

If you pick up a working student, assistant trainer, or weekend lesson instructor gig… you get to ride, get teaching experience, and get paid. That route had so many benefits for me and many of my peers in our early 20s, and it certainly beat working a minimum wage campus job in college. I never would have been able to afford the time in the saddle I got after I went pro if I had been paying my way as an amateur and broke grad student. I’m 100x the rider and trainer I was before, due to those years of experience as a pro, even though it was never going to be my career.

[Midge]

I wouldn’t ‘declare’ pro until a money making opportunity arrives. It doesn’t sound like you are contemplating an instructor’s position. It sounds like you are hoping for some pro rides. As far as USEF goes,I assume you are amatuer. No need to change that mid stream, if you haven’t made any money. Are you thinking about advertising yourself as a pro? Go ahead. If you get a money making position, then change your status.

[faultfree]

@Midge

I wouldn’t ‘declare’ pro until a money making opportunity arrives. It doesn’t sound like you are contemplating an instructor’s position. It sounds like you are hoping for some pro rides. As far as USEF goes,I assume you are amatuer. No need to change that mid stream, if you haven’t made any money. Are you thinking about advertising yourself as a pro? Go ahead. If you get a money making position, then change your status.

Thanks for your thoughts! I’ve considered this but I’m worried that people won’t take me seriously if I start offering riding or teaching services while I’m still an amateur.

[Scribbler]

Ok, you are putting the cart before the horse.

You become a pro the moment you accept money for training or teaching riding.

At that point if you wish to show you need to declare yourself a pro.

If you don’t wish to show it doesn’t matter.

But obviously you don’t change your status until you need to, ie have an income from training.

[OnDeck]

@faultfree

Thanks for your thoughts! I’ve considered this but I’m worried that people won’t take me seriously if I start offering riding or teaching services while I’m still an amateur.

I think you’re going about this the wrong way. It is unlikely anyone will hire you based off a Facebook post or similar type of advertising regardless of if you are amateur or pro.

First, find a place to ride by reaching out to local barns/connections and see if anyone has anything that needs to be ridden. Do NOT expect to paid or they will turn you down. Opportunities will come from there if you ride well and you get your foot in the door at the right place. Any type of teaching or paid riding deal is not likely to come quickly. Maybe you’ll get lucky and they’ll have some type of situation available that allows you to ride affordably and keep your amateur status. You may even find opportunities that would only be available to an amateur, such as showing a sale horse in the amateurs after the professional shows him during the week. But this would require you having the funds available to pay your share of the show fees. (I’m sure someone will chime in with all the ways this should not be done but it absolutely can be done 100% legally.)

I would not consider going pro until you are tripping on opportunities you have to turn down or you are offered a teaching/riding position. You can reinstate your amateur status one time 12 months (maybe 6?) after you stop acting as a professional, so it’s not permanent but it’s not a quick switch back to amateur life either. It would be a shame to go through all of that and not find any opportunities. Depending on the shows available in your area you may not be able to show as professional on the weekends, if that matters to you.

[LovesHorses]

Go work as an assistant for the best trainer you can find. Gain years of valuable knowledge and experience so you have something to offer potential clients down the road. Going pro out on your own is expensive.

[Midge]

@LovesHorses

Go work as an assistant for the best trainer you can find. Gain years of valuable knowledge and experience so you have something to offer potential clients down the road. Going pro out on your own is expensive.

It sounds to me like she wants to be paid to do some riding. A little side gig. Not make it her career.

[mmeqcenter]

I’ve always shown “Open” and registered as “Pro” (but really am just a non-amateur). I’m not a trainer, but I don’t want to limit my opportunities, such as recently riding and selling a nice warmblood for a friend on consignment. I have no qualms about showing against “real” pros.

[findeight]

@Midge

I wouldn’t ‘declare’ pro until a money making opportunity arrives. It doesn’t sound like you are contemplating an instructor’s position. It sounds like you are hoping for some pro rides. As far as USEF goes,I assume you are amatuer. No need to change that mid stream, if you haven’t made any money. Are you thinking about advertising yourself as a pro? Go ahead. If you get a money making position, then change your status.

This. Times 10.

You CANNOT get money for any riding, teaching if training as an amateur so don’t know why you are worried about people taking you seriously if you ignore the rules???

Far as being taken seriously, what is it that makes you worth anything as a catch rider? Why would anybody pay enough to make it worth your time and travel?

You need to think about that. And how much income would make it worth your while? Don’t think it’s going to pay what think it might. Non horsey part time jobs typically pay better. Much better. Much less risk of injury too.

[faultfree]

@findeight

This. Times 10.

You CANNOT get money for any riding, teaching if training as an amateur so don’t know why you are worried about people taking you seriously if you ignore the rules???

Far as being taken seriously, what is it that makes you worth anything as a catch rider? Why would anybody pay enough to make it worth your time and travel?

You need to think about that. And how much income would make it worth your while? Don’t think it’s going to pay what think it might. Non horsey part time jobs typically pay better. Much better. Much less risk of injury too.

I’m not sure I’m understanding the first part of your post. The other poster made a point that I shouldn’t declare as a pro until someone has offered to pay me. My response was that I wasn’t sure if anyone would offer a paid position, be it riding or teaching, to someone who is still an amateur in the first place. If that makes sense.

As far as money goes, I have no expectation of making lots of it riding or teaching. I definitely plan on keeping my non horsey part time job as well. I’m just dying to ride and be around horses, that’s all.

[Redlei44]

@faultfree

I’m not sure I’m understanding the first part of your post. The other poster made a point that I shouldn’t declare as a pro until someone has offered to pay me. My response was that I wasn’t sure if anyone would offer a paid position, be it riding or teaching, to someone who is still an amateur in the first place. If that makes sense.

As far as money goes, I have no expectation of making lots of it riding or teaching. I definitely plan on keeping my non horsey part time job as well. I’m just dying to ride and be around horses, that’s all.

IME, whether you call yourself pro or am is much less important to any potential owners/trainers than how you actually ride. And relatedly, when you’re available to ride (during the business day or not).

“Advertising” your availability may seem more normal for a pro, but either way, you have to make the connections. If you literally do not care whether you are an amateur and can show in amateur divisions, then sure, make some cash if you can. But if you are a good riding amateur you will still be valuable in barns because clients are usually thrilled to have a skilled catch rider hanging around. Jumping/showing opportunities will be harder to come by with either option.

[Scribbler]

I wonder if the playing field changes if you go from junior to adult.

There’s going to be a limited pool of very good junior riders because realistically kids get better and better better into their late teens.

If you are a pro trainer in the show and sell business, you will need junior riders to take your project horses through the junior shows and get junior miles on them so you can sell them to other kid clients. The advice for buying kids horses is "look for show miles with a junior rider.’

You as the trainer or your assistant coach can’t do this because you are not juniors.

Plus juniors can be paid and everyone likes to help out a good kid. So it makes sense to pay juniors to ride.

My guess is the playing field changes a bit when you become an adult.

Some of those excellent juniors have gone full scale pro, as in junior instructor or working student, and their skills have really improved. And they are available to ride Open.

Plus the trainers can ride their own project horses Open.

Plus there is a bigger pool of potential Open catch riders out there, that is the entire population of riding adults, as opposed to juniors, when its probably really about 5 years in age span maybe less.

Plus everything else being equal, competition in Open is going to be stiffer than in Junior.

Though obviously some Junior classes and some Junior venues are going to have an overall higher level of horse and riding than some Open classes in some other places.

But this is all to say that the value of a good junior catch rider may not translate to the same person as an adult.

The only way to find out is to make contacts locally. Probably the best way to make friends with a coach is to approach saying you want to take lessons and get back in the saddle. Then once you know the barn, you can sound out possibilities for exercising horses for free (rather than leasing) and see if catch riding at shows or paid schooling sessions on freebies can evolve out of that.

[rockonxox]

If you will be accepting any form of remuneration for riding others horses then go pro. The right time to declare being pro is the second you accept remuneration (per rule book: Remuneration is defined as compensation or payment in any form such as cash, goods, sponsorships, discounts or services; reimbursement of any expenses; trade or in-kind exchange of goods or services such as board or training.) Until you’ve made any arrangements, unless you really want to start limiting yourself to only riding in pro classes, just stay an amateur. If you are willing to ride others horses and do other work with them and/or teach students for free without any remuneration (cash or otherwise) then stay an amateur.

[findeight]

@faultfree

Thanks for your thoughts! I’ve considered this but I’m worried that people won’t take me seriously if I start offering riding or teaching services while I’m still an amateur.

I was referring to OPs statement here in my earlier post.

[gottagrey]

You’re a junior in college, focus on your remaining education. I’m also in the camp of waiting until the opportunity(s) arise before you declare anything. You could declare right now, never earn a dime as a pro, and will have to sit out a year to show as an amateur. Are you a member of USEF currently? If not, you don’t even need to worry about declaring yourself as a pro or amateur until you decide to renew your membership again. Remember what determines professional status according to the USEF encompasses different scenarios - not just riding and teaching.

[aascvt]

Honestly, without getting into the nitty gritty of things, I think what stands out to me is that you mentioned wanting to turn pro and have that be your side gig. I appreciate that you are being financially smart in wanting to continue your education and set up another F/T career, but I just don’t think it makes sense to turn pro just for ANY sort of part-time situation. If horses come before everything and are the key to your happiness, then make that your focus and your full time. If you want to continue your other career path and just be around horses, I would absolutely stay ammy and have the flexibility to show as such.
You clearly DO have a solid education and riding resume and can surely find some riding opportunities to give you your fix.

[Another-Bay]

@faultfree

Some background on me: I am 21 (in my third year of college) I am fairly sure I do not want horses to be my sole source of income as a long term career plan, but I would love to make some money doing what I love, especially now since I am at the point where I no longer have the financial backing of my parents, and also don’t have the financial means to pursue this on my own.

If this is your motive - to afford riding regularly - I would instead focus on ways you might lower your costs as an amateur rather than try to add a revenue stream as a pro.

Horses can be all-encompassing, and it will take a unique situation for someone to be willing to pay and trust your experience and skill knowing you are a part-timer. Why choose you over Sally who has her own dedicated barn, program, and staff down the road?

I would instead find a lease situation on something green you might be able to put miles on. Or an owner who wants show miles on a horse and may be willing to help offset costs.

Food for thought!

[anicolle]

If you accept any money for services you’re automatically considered a pro, right?

Can you keep your amateur status even if you ride other people’s horses (with out being paid) I would think that would be the route to go?

When I was a jr rider I was being paid x amount of money to hack certain client horses for my trainer. Started off as a working student, wasn’t paid. Eventually worked into a paid position. I started grooming for trainer / clients professionally. How does that work after you turn 18?

Can you get paid to groom and ride as an amateur if you aren’t getting paid to ride horses?

I haven’t shown USEF since I was a jr and I haven’t worked with horses (except mine) in the 4 years now.

Either way if you really want to go pro find a good trainer who’s looking for an assistant