When it coarse hay too coarse?

[SharonA1]

So, the hay lately feels pretty stiff and stemmy, except when it is finer but looks dead-er. The stiff stemmy hay is pretty green, whereas the finer hay, again, has significantly more brown in it. Horse is an easy keeper in very light work, but still. He deserves good hay. He seems to waste more of the finer, browner bales than of the stiff, stemmy greener bales. He was definitely not impressed with the stiff, stemmy chunk of hay, which felt like that rattan they make chairs out of, that I threw to him last night.

I full board, and I am very appreciative of the situation, and the BM is professional and not crazy, works hard for the horses, has all the boarders’ support, etc. And, I can go buy the odd bale of nicer hay, if I’m really fussed about what the barn is offering. But, I would like to educate myself, in case the stemmy hay is a trend, because if the stemmy hay is a trend, I will at least have a conversation about it with the BM.

Just for general education, where do people draw the line on hay quality?

[candyappy]

We have baled all our own hay for years now. Sometimes the weather just does not make it possible to get it cut at the optimum time. Sounds like you are dealing with hay cut past it’s prime. I am fortunate that my horses all hold weight easily and pretty much eat everything.

We do our darnedest to cut hay when ready but sometimes you have no choice no matter if you do it yourself or purchase it. As long as it isn’t dusty or smelling musty/ moldy I will feed it and throw out what they may not eat. Sometimes I have to feed my leftover hay from the last year before the newer cut this year.

It will be faded a bit ( it is wrapped) but they eat it just fine. I feed a good RB and also some Vitamin Mineral Supplement to make up the difference, since they only get a pound of the RB.

[trubandloki]

@SharonA1

So, the hay lately feels pretty stiff and stemmy, except when it is finer but looks dead-er. The stiff stemmy hay is pretty green, whereas the finer hay, again, has significantly more brown in it. Horse is an easy keeper in very light work, but still. He deserves good hay. He seems to waste more of the finer, browner bales than of the stiff, stemmy greener bales. He was definitely not impressed with the stiff, stemmy chunk of hay, which felt like that rattan they make chairs out of, that I threw to him last night.

I full board, and I am very appreciative of the situation, and the BM is professional and not crazy, works hard for the horses, has all the boarders’ support, etc. And, I can go buy the odd bale of nicer hay, if I’m really fussed about what the barn is offering. But, I would like to educate myself, in case the stemmy hay is a trend, because if the stemmy hay is a trend, I will at least have a conversation about it with the BM.

Just for general education, where do people draw the line on hay quality?

Stemmy hay is a trend? That is a weird word for it.
Hay is not manufactured, it is an agricultural product. Depending on the weather conditions where it was grown they might not have been able to get it off the field when it was perfect so it got a little over mature.

[horseshorseshorseshorses]

It really depends on the variety of hay you are feeding, where it was grown, and when it was cut. For example back in the PNW it was very easy to find orchard grass hay with thin stems, lots of leaves and bright green in color. Now that I am in the deep south the orchard I’ve been seeing is a bit more straw like (stemmy), the leaves are well developed and the color is more yellow than green. This is because most of the orchard grown in the PNW is irrigated and the hay I am feeding now wasn’t. The midwest and SE had not the best hay growing seasons the last couple of years which caused the crop to come in late, unlike the PNW.

As long as your horse isn’t loosing weight, the hay doesn’t smell moldy or sour and isn’t dusty, I would not worry about. I have fed pretty much straw before (supplemented with grain and vitamins) and though the horse’s didn’t love it, they ate it or turned it into bedding and survived.

[Scribbler]

Hay that is cut when the grass is more mature has thicker stems.

Some hay contains multiple species of grass that matures at different rates or looks different when mature. Some grass can be very mature but not that thick.

If the horse is eating the hay and is in good condition, the hay is good enough.

Typically very mature hay is less desirable and cheaper so your barn may be cutting costs here. Perhaps this is what they can afford to feed based in your boarding fee.

[Weezer]

Scribbler makes a good point about cutting costs. As a boarder, I hated it when my horses were fed poor quality hay. It sounds like the stuff you’re dealing with now may not be the most nutritious but if it’s not dusty or mouldy, then it should not be causing too much harm. I recommend getting it tested so you can figure out if you need to supplement his diet.

[IPEsq]

It is too stemmy if they won’t eat it. Or if it was late cut because of moisture/weather issues. Sometimes they don’t flake well in this stage and so you might want to make sure it’s not dusty/moldy. But otherwise, you don’t really know without a hay test to look at how much of it is digestible matter and how it is nutritionally.

[Scribbler]

In general the stemmier a hay, the higher the indigestible fiber. But a species like Timothy is naturally thicker even when it’s less mature, whereas some other grasses can be dead and dry and still very fine, like lawn grass that was never mowed. Fine dead grass could still be high in indigestible fiber.

Where I live, we have mild wet winter and spring. Grass can grow all year around, or it might get briefly knocked back by snow in January. By April it can be tall. But it’s too wet to get equipment into the field or make hay until June. By then the grass has flowered, maybe gone to seed, and is getting stocky and full grown.

Our June harvested hay is called First Cut, and it is coarser, lower protein, higher sugar, than other hays. We then get a second cut towards the end of August which is cut at a much younger stage, before it flowers. It has only had 2 or 3 months to grow back since it was mowed in June.

Around here it’s well known that First Cut is less nutritious than Second Cut, and it is sold cheaper.

Weather patterns in other areas may mean this doesn’t apply everywhere of course.

[quietann]

/waves hi

My mare’s hay comes in weekly and is not always the same. It’s “first cut mixed grass” or “first cut timothy.” Occasionally it’s a little straw like, and she will object for a few days, but ultimately she’ll eat it, all but the thickest stems or anything in it that is not hay.

If he’s eating it and not losing weight or energy, it’s probably OK.

Also – if your hay is coming from New England, remember that the weather was really weird this year. We had a fairly damp spring, and then drought for months. A friend who grows hay had to delay her first cutting until the hay was tall enough to cut. This winter could get ugly, hay-wise.

(Reminds self of a barn that insisted that its own 3rd cut hay, full of milkweed and ferns and G-d only knows what else, was perfectly fine – and my not very picky mare didn’t like it. It got to the point that the BM would put each bale in front of my mare before distributing it – because if Feronia wouldn’t eat it, it’s bad hay, period. Feronia was rejecting about a third of the bales! Eventually one of the vets stepped in because some horses were losing weight and having digestive issues, and told BO she could not feed it except to the very easy keepers.)

[walkers60]

We are paying for crap and just because your horse has a hay belly it doesn’t mean he is getting good nutrition in that straw /hay. I wish people would stop buying this junk as we are all getting ripped off paying for this straw ,Stop thinking if a horse eats it then its good, they eat trees wen they are hungry also just to feel full.
I really can’t understand why people won’t learn about hay and demand it to be decent or at least don’t pay much for this junk.
The mid west , the south and the western US had terrible hay year, it’s just cow hay. Here some of buying truck loads of organic milk cow hay (best hay availabe) so their horses can perform.
My vet says he has never seen so many poorly horses , big bellies but no muscle and unhealthy.
since so may farmers killed their cows this year you’d think their would be a glut of hay but where did it go?They probably let it rot in the fields as even horse races were cancelled.
They slaughtered their beef cows because restaurants/schools were closed. The food supply system is a disaster.
You know most dairy and meat is grown for commercial use so when the world closed and schools then they had to kill the cows.

[trubandloki]

@walkers60

they eat trees wen they are hungry also just to feel ful

Sometimes they eat trees just because they want to, no hunger, no need to feel full.

@walkers60

I really can’t understand why people won’t learn about hay and demand it to be decent

The problem with this is that hay is not a manufactured thing. You can’t just demand it is better and it happens. If most of the country had a bad hay year no amount of foot stomping will make good hay appear.

[sing]

@walkers60

We are paying for crap and just because your horse has a hay belly it doesn’t mean he is getting good nutrition in that straw /hay.

I always assumed a haybelly was a red flag. Not a sign of good nutrition. Quite the opposite.

[SusanO]

Not all of the western hay is crap. I have gotten some lovely 3x3 bales from a hay broker in Tennessee. I do think I am paying more than I was last year though. My southeastern hay is kind of meh this year though. But none of it straw. And I do recognize that weather plays a large role in hay quality.

[endlessclimb]

We bale our own. We rotate in and out of the “really good” stuff. Some bales get picked through, others get devoured. Some horses LOVE stemmy stuff, while others won’t touch it out of the same bale. Some grass looks so yummy to me, my horses won’t touch. It must be bitter or something (no we don’t spray with the preservative).

Long story short, if your horse looks good the hay is fine.

[endlessclimb]

I really wish people would learn about supply, demand, and shipping costs so they quit kvetching about paying market price for what’s available.