When to teach lead changes

[Lord_Helpus]

I have a young horse who ticks all the boxes. He is 6, but was a dressage horse for 2 years. In many ways, he has a 6-year-old brain, but in other ways, he is a baby. The biggest of these young horse problems is his lead changes. He did not come with any.
My trainer has brought him along slowly and I am very happy with what she has done over the last 9 months, but she has never asked for a lead change. If he lands wrong, she trots through the corner. I have asked why she is still not setting him up for changes; she says that changes worry him and he gets heavy in her hand.
3 Days ago she set him up and asked for a change and he got very confused so she went back to trotting the corners. I fully understand his conundrum . The rules have changed and he doesn’t know why.

Now to my issue. several shows are coming up,and except for the change issue, he is ready. So far he has been to 6 little shows with 5 championships and1 reserve. Trainer wants to take him to these recognized shows, but I am not going to spend $$$$ to watch him trot his lead changes. I think that, if he can do 3 out of 4 changes then I will send him. But that means she has to work on them now, even if he gets confused for a bit.
Yes, she is the trainer (and is a good one). But I was riding at MSG before she was born and have started many babies. I would have set him up for rebalancing into the new lead, months ago.
Q: Should I " pull rank" and tell her flat out that he needs to have his changes before I spend over $1000 on a horse who will win the hack, but not get any other ribbon if he trots in the corners. If I say nothing and not explain my rationale, he might not have confirmed changes for 6 more months; sitting home when she is off to other shows If I push the issue, I know she might “fire me” and I will be left with a 1/2 finished horse who other local trainers might not take him on since this is a close-knit community.

[Pennywell_Bay]

@Lord Helpus

I have a young horse who ticks all the boxes. He is 6, but was a dressage horse for 2 years. In many ways, he has a 6-year-old brain, but in other ways, he is a baby. The biggest of these young horse problems is his lead changes. He did not come with any.
My trainer has brought him along slowly and I am very happy with what she has done over the last 9 months, but she has never asked for a lead change. If he lands wrong, she trots through the corner. I have asked why she is still not setting him up for changes; she says that changes worry him and he gets heavy in her hand.
3 Days ago she set him up and asked for a change and he got very confused so she went back to trotting the corners. I fully understand his conundrum . The rules have changed and he doesn’t know why.

Now to my issue. several shows are coming up,and except for the change issue, he is ready. So far he has been to 6 little shows with 5 championships and1 reserve. Trainer wants to take him to these recognized shows, but I am not going to spend $$$$ to watch him trot his lead changes. I think that, if he can do 3 out of 4 changes then I will send him. But that means she has to work on them now, even if he gets confused for a bit.
Yes, she is the trainer (and is a good one). But I was riding at MSG before she was born and have started many babies. I would have set him up for rebalancing into the new lead, months ago.
Q: Should I " pull rank" and tell her flat out that he needs to have his changes before I spend over $1000 on a horse who will win the hack, but not get any other ribbon if he trots in the corners. If I say nothing and not explain my rationale, he might not have confirmed changes for 6 more months; sitting home when she is off to other shows If I push the issue, I know she might “fire me” and I will be left with a 1/2 finished horse who other local trainers might not take him on since this is a close-knit community.

All the feels here for you. Mine is USEF 7, really 6. I have flip flopped on pulling rank, as I am in a similar situation. Mine does have a change (though not reliable) when he’s motoring. It help we do the jumpers (mamma needs a change though )

I showed him 1 rated show without a change in hunters to get me around (I’ve only had him 5 months). Seriously- it was not fun knowing how much I was paying not to get a change if we didn’t land on it. Thankfully I did not feel odd because a lot of ammies were missing jumps and leads lol.

So- last show I switched to the jumpers- where he shines. But I still want a change. Now that I’m more confident on him, my trainer is going to put the change on him solid. Like I said- If I ask and /or we are motoring- he’ll swap.

I deferred to my trainer because he had pulled the horse out of him mom as a baby, broke him, backed him and showed him his whole life. Now I’m at the point I want the change solid. Just Saturday trainer said “it’s time”. Which is good because I had been griping mildily for a few months but never “insisted”.

At this point- say it point blank. I don’t want to spend thousands and not have a change.

[OnDeck]

Don’t go to the show without a change. You’ll spend a bunch of money to put a bunch of DNPs on his record and he’ll get the same experience he could get at a smaller show.

Ask the trainer her plan. If she has a very thought out plan for progressing I would let her go ahead and take her time (and skip the shows). If she says “well I was kinda hoping he’d stop stressing in his own time” then I would tell her to start working on the change.

Have you ridden the horse? If no, that may help you decide if he’s truly ready or not.

[Redlei44]

I don’t think it’s pulling rank to decline to send him to $$ shows without a change, it’s just being fiscally reasonable. Pulling rank would maybe(?) be the opposite situation (trainer doesn’t want to take him without a change but you really want to show) or trainer flat out refuses to work on changes and you say “work on them or else (. . . I’ll send him to someone else to put the change on).”

If the horse gets heavy, I’d want to see her concentrating on flatwork to address that. I’d want to see her getting the changes over a pole on the ground. Progress in general. If the horse really does get tense, I’d be glad she’s taking her time (unless I thought it was a hole in her skill set). If she wants to take the horse to $$ shows, she can confirm the changes first.

[EmilyM]

Tell her you don’t want to waste money. Go to a schooling show if he needs miles and doesn’t have a change. Usually they have divisions that allow it.
On the other subject, can you put the changes on him? I find if you have the quality canter and lightness to the aids the changes are easy.

[Peggy]

I don’t think I’d send him to any more shows without changes. Too much money to spend at a rated show without them and it sounds like he’s got the showing thing figured out pretty well at the schooling show level.

I’m not against taking a horse who hasn’t shown much or at all to a show without solid lead changes bc I figure that stuff is going to go wrong the first few shows and even one with good lead changes may lose them temporarily. But it’s worth it just to get them out there. And by the time they’ve figured out the showing thing the changes are probably going to be OK.

[IPEsq]

Rated shows are so expensive I wouldn’t go without having a decent chance at a change.

Sometimes you go through phases where they are close to fried to make progress, and then you forget about it for a while and start again. But one ask and a miss and then forgetting about it? I’m afraid you won’t get anywhere.

I also really don’t like trotting changes for ones that get heavy and anxious. Simple changes through the walk are more likely to give you the balancing prep you need to actually get the flying change later. And encouraging breaking gait (versus a more deliberate walk transition) could create another bad habit. With my horse when the questions get hard, he gets insecure, or he has a baby brain moment, his default is to trot. Usually a bracing and connection problem coupled with his very quiet nature. Or sometimes I just exhale too much after a nice jump and he thinks it’s time to quit. But regardless, it drives me totally crazy! And is not good for teaching him how to be a hunter horse. Or a dressage horse for that matter. Don’t accidentally teach that.

[Justice]

This is so hard. My namesake Justice had a tough change to the right as a 4 yo. Really tough. Nothing physically wrong, he just struggled with it but never got tense. I will say he never missed a change at a show. The trainer that did him in the bgs and pgs changed him over the jump, and the one time he landed incorrectly after a winning round he just trotted and circled instead of asking for the change that was not there… still won. He is 23 now and still no solid change to the right, but it hasn’t stopped him from a successful career or a great life. We tried EVERYTHING when he was young. He would change for my trainers and myself but there were a lot of prayers said ringside and it was a huge HUGE source of stress since I was young and had limited horse show funds and my favorite color has always been blue.

If you will be upset if he doesn’t get the changes, and he can’t land correctly dependably, don’t show. Too much pressure to try to make something appear out of nowhere. There are a lot of people who trot the changes until the horse feels ready with success, but some horses are harder than others. I would just tell her the next outing is when he’s doing them consistently at home, because why show if it’s not fun? And why try to rush after putting such a good foundation on him. Once they learn how to miss behind, it makes it so hard to fix. The good news is that there has perhaps never been a better time to stay home and work on lead changes!

[Lord_Helpus]

THANK YOU all you all for the quality answers. Not only does it take time to figure out the damn new COTH, but the responses have been well thought out and (best for me ) the posts have all agreed. I have been mulling it around (God – if I am sleepless over lead changes, I need a life). And, based on the input from this thread, I will plan to keep him home until he has a chance of doing his changes. But I will go out this morning and set up a couple 'pile 'o poles in different places and mention to her that I have done it “in case she wants to ask him for lead changes”. — I am also going to suggest that we go to different rings so he will not automatically know where the corners are and he will have a better chance to listen to her for guidance.
PS: Yes, I have ridden him several times, but I have not asked for changes because I do not want to get him even more confused.

[Backstage]

@Lord Helpus

THANK YOU all you all for the quality answers. Not only does it take time to figure out the damn new COTH, but the responses have been well thought out and (best for me ) the posts have all agreed. I have been mulling it around (God – if I am sleepless over lead changes, I need a life). And, based on the input from this thread, I will plan to keep him home until he has a chance of doing his changes. But I will go out this morning and set up a couple 'pile 'o poles in different places and mention to her that I have done it “in case she wants to ask him for lead changes”. — I am also going to suggest that we go to different rings so he will not automatically know where the corners are and he will have a better chance to listen to her for guidance,

I agree with the other posters - I wouldn’t send him to a rated show without a change, but I would explain my rationale to the trainer. I think its also time to have a realistic discussion about what her plan is for setting him up for success with the change, and general idea as to timeline. I don’t think it needs to cause a rift - I think most trainers would understand why spending $1,000+ a week to show a horse who doesn’t have a lead change holds little appeal (unless, of course, he was quite reliable at landing the lead), and why an owner would like to understand the game plan. As long as its not presented as ‘he needs a change in X time frame, or else’, it really shouldn’t cause an issue.

[dags]

What kind of simple changes are these? Like, still 8 steps of leg re-organization before we find our way back into the canter? I’m just trying to picture 9 months of trotting changes and not having established the promptness that clues horsey in on what we’re heading for here. If we’re not down to 1, 2, maaaybe 3 steps, then we have a transitions problem. And yes, that will lead to a real tough time teaching lead changes… especially if she’s only ever taught changes by throwing off balance and kickin’ reel hard.

I likewise would caution spending hundreds (if not 4 figs) to throw a bunch of DNPs on the record, especially if you have non-rated options at which he can gain basic show exposure.

[ElementFarm]

You’ve already gotten good advice, and I’ll echo it.
Why on earth would you pay for a rated show without a decent chance of getting the changes?

Lead changes are my nemesis, and I know I’m not good at installing them. But not all pros are either (but they’re probably not as willing to admit it). And some horses are just tricky and never figure them out (often with a physical component to the issue). But I’d have a pointed discussion with your rider and talk through her plan to put the changes on. If she doesn’t have a clear progression or strategy, and just plans to keep trotting the corners in the hope that one day he’ll figure it out, I’d frankly be looking for a different trainer/rider, at least for that one training milestone.

Unfortunately, the fanciest horse in the world, with a 10 jump, is still going to have virtually no value as a show hunter if it can’t consistently get a lead change or reliably land them. If this horse is destined to be a hunter, I’d be pretty anxious to at least seeing progress towards the changes.

[gottagrey]

Am in agreement with the other posters - stay home save $ and work at getting changed at home and schooling shows.

as far as changes go how is your horse at home - do you ever see him cantering around the fields - and if so does he change naturally? I had a youngster that would sooner crash into the fence than change leads; current horse would practically do tempe changes if they were playing in the fields. For one that’s not doing them naturally it’s going to be a tough battle to get them to change so you may want to work on lead landing…

[RAyers]

You say this horse did not come with “lead changes.” How do you know? To what level of dressage was this horse trained? Flying changes are not required until 3rd level, but many trainers will be working the changes at 2nd level in preparation for 3rd. If it was true, serious, dressage training 2 years would be where this horse already has changes, just NOT what hunter riders think they should be. As a matter of fact, this horse would be very well trained.

He gets “heavy” because in dressage you want to push the change hind to front in the suspension phase and requires the rider to keep connection through the bit while there is a deliberate movement of legs and seat (no need to go into that).

[Lord_Helpus]

RA Ayres I have had him since he was 2. I bought him as a yearling, racing around a ring. as a sponsor for a young dressage rider to train up through the levels. He was great through 1st level, but when she started 2nd level movements , he changed. He was surly; he fought her and things were not going well. He had a full workup – x-rays, MRI, etc. Turns out he has 2 vertebrae that get pushed together (like a wobbler, or kissing spine), but the vertebrae were mid-neck and did not hurt until he was asked to come through from behind and lift his front end. Vets said he would/could never be a dressage horse, so, he came home to my farm and was turned out for a year. Since he was sound, I thought he might make the world’s fanciest trail horse. He LOVED hacking around, as a 10 mover and was naturally balanced in a hunter frame. So, he moved on to a new career as a hunter. The only “rule” he has is that he cannot be ridden with a lot of rein pressure (which would bring jaw to chest and therefore create pain). He naturally moves like a hunter should, So, yes, I do know him – literally from the inside out. Mz trainer is very good, working within his limitations and I am a very happy ‘mother’. I just worry that he will have more trouble than other horses when working on his changes. On the good side, no one will ever want to buy him with this neuro defect.

[IPEsq]

Based on this extra bit of info, I will share about teaching my last horse changes. He kind of had a natural change one way, not so much the other but he favored that lead so in his beginning days of course work, mostly just had to do the one he’d do on his own in the turns. He would also do basically tempis out in the field. He was 4, and the breeders had never schooled changes according to their trainer.

I get him home after doing one change his good way on purpose (though after aiding for it about 3 times) in the test ride, and someone has a pole out on the diagonal, so I’m like hm lets see what these changes are about the less natural way. He charged at that pole, dove in (and down) on the inside shoulder, cross cantered, got mad about cross cantering, and threw a fit. Ummm ok! He also had neck issues and I would not ride him in a collected frame, although the contact doesn’t sound like it bothered him as much as yours.

They can still come through from behind in a hunter frame. I had to install a half halt. This started as a full halt on the diagonal or centerline of a serpentine. To a walk transition instead. Followed by leg yield or clear change of bend, at walk, then canter again. Once this was reliable, when I went back to continuing at the canter, there were those balanced changes he could do out in the field. Sometimes breaking down the steps into minutae works for these warmbloods.

His only fault after that was sometimes getting croup high in the change. He had some SI issues too. Addressing that, and perfect changes. Neck and SI issues often go together.

If this is the kind of anxiety and physical issues you have, it is fixable but probably not by trotting. If instead he’s a horse who would not do a change at liberty and you set up a change of direction and he has zero inclination he needs to change his body, then that’s a different story. And I would get onto the changes even faster. The more you let these ones without natural aptitude for changes get comfortable not doing them, the worse the problem. But in all cases, I’m more of the camp of teach them to the 4 and 5 yr olds anyway. I do true counter canter later, especially with the second type of horse.