I would help her to get an extraordinary education. Horses will always be there! My son was heavily involved in showing through high school and then the decision to allocate huge amounts of money to continue in the show world, seemed like a dead end of sorts. Being a horse professional (in nearly any capacity besides at the top of the food chain) is a very very hard lifestyle choice. It seems like a dream world, mostly because it is. The old saying that to make a small fortune in the horse business, you need to start with a large fortune is pretty true. If you have the means, great! My son is currently getting an education in aeronautical engineering which probably costs as much or more than than that “big ring” horse, but after all is said and done, the education seems like a better investment. the horses will always be there when he wants to return to horse showing…Just one mothers opinion.
[QUOTE=findeight;5918036]
Nobody is bashing Equine (or any other) degrees for those with some flexibility in what they will do with them.
I think most have had a real bad experience with those who expect it to lead to a RIDING job and have no intention of working in a lab or any other setting much less continue schooling. Not to mention running up 40k+ in debt for a job that starts at 16-20k a year (if and when it is secured) does not reek of good planning for the future.[/QUOTE]
Despite my support of Animal Science degrees for those who understand what it will do for them, I agree with this sentiment. I didn’t have any of these folks in my sphere at school, but I have met some in the decade since who were quite bummed it didn’t lead to a barn management job or something similar.
[QUOTE=smokygirl;5917430]
But how many openings are there?
There are many well paying careers you could choose, but if their is few jobs… it makes it extremely difficult to find work.[/QUOTE]
well I know a vet pathologist in my home town who is looking to expand and a human lab who wants to hire a vet pathologist and thats just off the top of my head.
there might be fewer jobs for those who want 6 fig salaries, but if you don’t mind moving, i don’t see any reason you couldn’t get a job at a company if you had worked hard enough in grad school.
as pre-vet, i’m not worried about lack of jobs. if no jobs in my residency, i will just work at a clinic for a while until i find one. many many clinics in the US, and if you partner with someone in a higher class part of town, you should do fairly well.
always new feed companies starting and new labs etc etc wanting people. we had alltech (They sponsored WEG remember) come to our school and offer several positions for the right person.
i feel like finding a job in this major is like most any other profession. not just ADS majors. i was just stating that there are several different well rounded career paths, not just working in a feed store.
heres another question…why is everyone saying she will be in massive debt?
I go to MS State University as an ADS major and I have several scholarships, not only from MSU, but also from the ADS dept. I am paying about $500 a year to attend. I am also out of state and had those fees lifted because of HS grades. If she has the grades…she will get scholarships. I also already stated that if she IS that good of a rider, if she went somewhere like Auburn (who also like to hand out large academic scholarships) she could get a scholarship and sign on to the NCAA team. Same with colleges like TCU and UT Martin.
I’m sorry to quote from another thread but…
[QUOTE=ponymom88;5715070]
We went last year for the first time and had an amazing time. It was well worth what it cost. The entry fees were not that expensive. They were about $350. The stall was $225 for the week. Other costs included flights, hotel, car rental, golf cart rental (not an option, the park is huge) getting the pony to KY, stalls, paying our trainer, food, we did share a table that included breakfast and lunch. I read on this board last year that it cost about 10k to go and that was about right.[/QUOTE]
And OP was looking to lease a pony for the Finals this summer. 10K is a lot of money for a week of showing.
I hope you haven’t lost your job and/or incomes.
If not, I’m sure you could find a lot of lower-end barns and go to closer shows. And I’m sure there is a lot of cheaper solutions in order to keep up with your daughter’s riding addiction without going bankrupt!
How old is your daughter?
[QUOTE=Jumphigh83;5918055]
I would help her to get an extraordinary education. Horses will always be there! My son was heavily involved in showing through high school and then the decision to allocate huge amounts of money to continue in the show world, seemed like a dead end of sorts. Being a horse professional (in nearly any capacity besides at the top of the food chain) is a very very hard lifestyle choice. It seems like a dream world, mostly because it is. The old saying that to make a small fortune in the horse business, you need to start with a large fortune is pretty true. If you have the means, great! My son is currently getting an education in aeronautical engineering which probably costs as much or more than than that “big ring” horse, but after all is said and done, the education seems like a better investment. the horses will always be there when he wants to return to horse showing…Just one mothers opinion.[/QUOTE]
This. My son realized way before I did that horses were no way to make money. He sold his horse to pay his first year in college, rode on the team, graduated (creative writing :/), worked at the shows for a top trainer to make $$ until he left for China to teach English. He’s now in Bangkok, still teaching, married, making a living.
Me, I thought we could keep pouring $$ into horses living on an instructor’s shoestring until reality knocked us in the face this past year. My husband can no longer work, we have no savings/retirement and I have to get a real job. My ponies found wonderful homes and lives.
And I had to grow up.
As a few others have asked, how old is she?
Regardless of how old she is, I think it’s time to sit down and have a discussion about how much everything costs if you haven’t already. The depth and direction of the conversation should vary depending on her age. But the bottom line is, you need to be honest with her about the situation at hand. Be prepared to offer a couple of solutions or ideas for her to think about.
I just recently graduated college ('08), and I’m glad that I went to a college that offered good financial aid packages. They meet 100% of the need calculated by the FAFSA form (which I know can be an unrealistic figure for some families, but in my case it was about right). My student loans are a lot less than a lot of my friends who went to other schools that cost the same. If you go onto CollegeBoard.com, you can look at stats by school and see the average percent of financial need the school meets, what percent of students receive financial aid, etc. I didn’t receive any equestrian-specific scholarships, but I did get scholarships and grants for academics and leadership.
I would highly recommend to your daughter that she consider going to college. I know that if I didn’t go to college there’s no way I would be riding because there’s no way I could afford it! Even with a full time job I still find plenty of time to ride, but I also have enough money left over to live, do other things, and save for retirement (so I can buy a horse farm when I retire! :winkgrin: )
Last thing, does she know exactly what kind of career she wants? It might be beneficial if she can set up some meetings with professionals with that career so she can determine if it’s realistic for her. If she has all of these professionals telling her how hard it is or telling her it’s not what they always dreamed of, she might change her mind.
my trainer/friend/judge has an advanced degree in biology
[QUOTE=mvp;5917964]
. . . .
Big business. Big. Cattle breeders make horse breeders look like impoverished backyard hicks. It’s really impressive.[/QUOTE]
There’s far more demand for cattle, since they’re part of the dinner bell. More demand = more $$$$
Since horses are not part of the consumer-demand, except by those of us who can actually afford the extras (aka the Horse), there’s not as much demand and never will be. When the economy tanks and people lose their jobs, horse breeders readily see the results.
Which is another reason why you need to talk to your daughter, OP… a horse-related job is the first to tank in a bad economy and the last to pick up when the economy finally does rise. I wouldn’t really recommend a job in the equine industry, no matter how good she is. She is far better off getting a top quality education to land herself a top quality job so she can support herself in the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed - a house, car, savings, and then a horse.
Exactly. Now, if you want to go get a civil engineering degree? You can in fact get hired tomorrow. Likewise a lot of tech/manufacturing jobs are hiring. Having an engineering/science undergrad that applies in those areas is indeed valuable.
Going to get a BA in English or one of the social sciences? Save your money, enjoy being severely underemployed, or have enough money to pay for lots of grad school.
Not all college degrees are created equal. If you are going to spend that kind of money you have to think about what it’s going to get you. You don’t need to go into six-figure debt for a degree that’s only going to qualify you to be the most educated staffer at the daycare. It’s not even worth paying for a state school (and I agree, if you can afford to show Pony Finals saving enough for a state school shouldn’t be a problem.) Heck, I went to all-private out of state schools and we paid cash. But if you are pouring a lot of money into it, it pays to think what you are getting. In this market, some degrees have value, some just mean you need to pay or borrow tons more before you can get your foot in the door.
[QUOTE=rodawn;5918328]
There’s far more demand for cattle, since they’re part of the dinner bell. More demand = more $$$$
Since horses are not part of the consumer-demand, except by those of us who can actually afford the extras (aka the Horse), there’s not as much demand and never will be. When the economy tanks and people lose their jobs, horse breeders readily see the results.
Which is another reason why you need to talk to your daughter, OP… a horse-related job is the first to tank in a bad economy and the last to pick up when the economy finally does rise. I wouldn’t really recommend a job in the equine industry, no matter how good she is. She is far better off getting a top quality education to land herself a top quality job so she can support herself in the lifestyle to which she has become accustomed - a house, car, savings, and then a horse.[/QUOTE]
There is always a market for the cattle… no matter how cow-hocked it is 
[QUOTE=Trixie;5917835]
Um. But the thing is, they’re NOT qualified veterinarians.
They’re qualified to go to more school to possibly become veterinarians eventually.[/QUOTE]
Wait what? I’m confused 
The only thing I meant by that was in response to the person who basically made it seem like because their friend had an animal science degree, they couldn’t get a job anywhere but at a feed store. And actually the 31 people in my class with animal science degrees are qualified to become veterinarians in two and half years (yeah!! 
)seeing as how they were admitted to vet school. In order to be admitted the veterinary school has to feel that you have the qualifications necessary to become a veterinarian, so I really don’t understand? Maybe I’m just completely missing the point which is totally possible seeing as how we just had a huge final and my brain feels like it’s going to explode! Sorry that this is not really relevant to the thread anymore everyone!
[QUOTE=bascher;5918429]
Wait what? I’m confused The only thing I meant by that was in response to the person who basically made it seem like because their friend had an animal science degree, they couldn’t get a job anywhere but at a feed store. And actually the 31 people in my class with animal science degrees are qualified to become veterinarians seeing as how they were admitted to vet school. In order to be admitted the veterinary school has to feel that you are qualified to become a veterinarian, so I really don’t understand?[/QUOTE]
I think the point is that the degree in and of itself doesn’t, in fact, make you qualified to get a job.
It may very well make you qualified to go on to more school, which THEN may make you qualified to get a job. But without the additional education (and added expense of lots and lots of money) your employment options are limited.
[QUOTE=AmmyByNature;5918445]
I think the point is that the degree in and of itself doesn’t, in fact, make you qualified to get a job.
It may very well make you qualified to go on to more school, which THEN may make you qualified to get a job. But without the additional education (and added expense of lots and lots of money) your employment options are limited.[/QUOTE]
Yes that makes total sense! I just thought that the very first post that got this whole discussion started insinuated that the degree didn’t make you qualified to do anything, even move on to further education. It sort of sounded like the poster was saying that the degree was a waste, and I was just pointing out that you can use the degree to do a lot of great things. But I think I sort of misinterpreted the idea of the posts haha 
Your post definitely clarifies what people are ACTUALLY discussing rather than what my fried brain thought everyone was discussing lol
[QUOTE=rodawn;5918328]
There’s far more demand for cattle, since they’re part of the dinner bell. More demand = more $$$$ [/QUOTE]
Is it too late for me to become a Bull Madame? I’d run a fine brothel. Of course, I’d follow protocol which, as I understand it for Holsteins, means that human beings and bulls are always separated by a chain link fence. Apparently dairy bulls are mean. But I’d give “my boys” the best of care and appreciation for a job well done.
Which just goes to show you that you don’t need a terribly good mind or good conformation to do the job. Dairy cows do need to be kinda sorta tractable and be built to pack around their all-important udders. But I’m not sure how long they need to stay sound.
Exactly, Ammy.
The Animal Science degree has qualified these to go to more school, which will then, if they finish school and all required licensing certifications successfully, qualify them to work as vets.
Other examples have also involved a great deal of further higher education.
This isn’t necessarily helpful to a student who is trying to find a career directly out of undergrad.
[QUOTE=mvp;5918471]
Dairy cows do need to be kinda sorta tractable and be built to pack around their all-important udders. But I’m not sure how long they need to stay sound.[/QUOTE]
Actually, you’d be surprised. From what little I’ve heard, they really do worry about conformation and soundness since they know it can strongly affect production and the overall bottom line. Picture a horse industry where any horse that was dificult to keep sound or performed poorly would quickly end up as unlamented hamburger.
[QUOTE=Trixie;5918487]
Exactly, Ammy.
The Animal Science degree has qualified these to go to more school, which will then, if they finish school and all required licensing certifications successfully, qualify them to work as vets.
Other examples have also involved a great deal of further higher education.
This isn’t necessarily helpful to a student who is trying to find a career directly out of undergrad.[/QUOTE]
Understood I wasn’t thinking in those terms initially, but it makes complete sense to me now!
Horses aside, I think in the next few years we will see that the job market will be so competitive that even a four year degree won’t be enough for most jobs. It already seems that most everyone is getting at least a masters if not beyond, in order to get a good paying job straight out of college.
[QUOTE=reay6790;5918060]
well I know a vet pathologist in my home town who is looking to expand and a human lab who wants to hire a vet pathologist and thats just off the top of my head.
there might be fewer jobs for those who want 6 fig salaries, but if you don’t mind moving, i don’t see any reason you couldn’t get a job at a company if you had worked hard enough in grad school.
as pre-vet, i’m not worried about lack of jobs. if no jobs in my residency, i will just work at a clinic for a while until i find one. many many clinics in the US, and if you partner with someone in a higher class part of town, you should do fairly well.
always new feed companies starting and new labs etc etc wanting people. we had alltech (They sponsored WEG remember) come to our school and offer several positions for the right person.
i feel like finding a job in this major is like most any other profession. not just ADS majors. i was just stating that there are several different well rounded career paths, not just working in a feed store.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know what the qualifications are at the job your friend has, or the openings you mentioned for vet pathologist, but I do know that pathology is a relatively competitive specialty as far as the veterinary field goes. There are a few residency spots available each year (as in <20). For a boarded vet pathologist, a residency is required, so that’s 2 years minimum after vet school. Not exactly an easy career path.
That said, there are plenty of other opportunities available in the food animal or agriculture industries to students who graduate with a BS that don’t require a veterinary education.
