Why Do People Think Any Horse Can Be A Trail Horse?

[lawndart]

“Bottom-line…they way you ride trail distinguishes you from either being a pleasure rider or a trail rider. If you walk it…pleasure. If you trot-canter….trail rider. Believe me, even your silly horse knows the difference!”

And then there are those of us who are both. My usual riding buddy has asthma and various other physical problems, we always ride at a walk. I don’t mind, she has been a good friend and its good for my horses to learn to do the gait I ask for, not the one they would really like to be doing. For this, the 23 year old former show horse is well suited.

If I ride alone, or with my daughter, I take my younger horse because we trot or canter wherever the footing is good enough, and even occasionally jump small obstacles.

I no longer ride in large groups because its slower than I want to go, and mostly socializing. I want to ride and enjoy nature, not the chatter of many voices.

[Feenikks]

• Well well… My horse is a H/J and learned some dressage, he is competivelty conditioned for a good 25 mile trail…

But the people who know me and my horse say:
What a waste of talent, she is ‘just trail riding’ her horse… Trail riding takes skill too, it is a dicipiline and if I hear one more time that if someone sees an advertisement for a horse classified as a “trail horse” they consider it unsound for the h/j world I just might scream!

Trail riding can be brutal, I would NEVER ride my guy out there without complete soundness. And just because I choose the trails over the jumper world does not mean my horse is not sound, is sour and a good for nothing POS.

P.S. I cannot spell today …

[TripleRipple]

Gothedistance/hannah - what is CTR?

DH and I were discussing this thread. We think we’d like endurance as a competitive sport. But its interesting to see the difference of opinion on what trail riding is. I have a friend who trail rides, which to her means riding around her flat to slightly sloping 12 acres. Maybe out for an hour max, more typically 30 minutes after ring work. Usually at a walk, maybe some trotting, not much. Definitely not done daily.

For us, an hour ride would mean we don’t have much time or is for a specific reason for a specific horse. More typically ours are no less than a couple of hours, with other rides being 3-6 hours done at intervals, depending on who we are riding and where they are at physically. The terrain goes from flat to mildly sloping to steep to horrendously steep, from dirt to rocks to water crossing to traversing rocky box canyons, rides where we take food for everyone and gear. The horses must be cool to accidental flushing of deer in quantity (sometimes 20+), jack rabbits popping out and keen to avoid cougars, mellow re atvs and the like. Sometimes going with others, or just the two of us, or out on solo trips.

[Hannahsmom]

I agree it’s all about training, just like anything else. My very good event horse used to be terrified of riding on trails in the woods. He hated the fact that he couldn’t see ‘forever’. This is a horse that gallops XC and leaps Prelim jumps like a machine! But I enjoy it so I spent years working with him with the help of friends. Now he is really fairly brave, but more for quiet rides in the woods than anything serious or with the really good trail horses. Fortunately he’s always been one that if I get off he’ll follow me over anything. “You first mom!”

[FairWeather]

what we have here is a difference of terms.

Just to clarify,
To me, a ‘trail horse’ is the same thing as a ‘pleasure horse’.
Backyard rides, fun walk through the woods.
An endurance horse, or CTR horse, is one who i consider an ‘athelete’.

[situpandride]

for some people trail horse means a horse that can routinely go out for 25+ mile rides over all kinds of terrian, I have to say the trail riders in my riding club go out for 4-6 hour rides, they don’t compete or show, they think of themselves as pleasure riders. The first time I went with them it was like a ctr ride, luckily I did do distances before. They go on overnight rides, they go to the mountains, they ride on spretty rough terrai. I have another group of friends that think an hour out on the trail is a typical trail ride.
so even when you’re talking about a trail horse i think you have to be pretty clear especially if you’re selling or buying one.
For me a trail horse should be one that can keep up with my friends, that’s the kind of trail riding I do, we don’t go as fast as a competition but we do go far and we ride all over. On the other hand I’m looking for a trail horse for my husband, it can be the kind that is not sound enough to hold up to other more intense riding as my husband typically only rides about an hour or 2 and rarely does more than walk. But we want a trailwise horse, not one that failed at everything else and might make a trail horse with years of training. so for each of us a trail horse would be 2 entirely different animals.
I do remember a few times the show people at barns where i used to board thought of me as less a rider and my horse barely trained because i was a trail rider, until they went trail riding with me, a few vowed to never do it again, i did warn them we would be going far, for a long time and fast but I quess that means something different to diferrent folks
as far as training, i have vary little experince training horses but the handful i have trained always went trail riding as soon as i could get them to stop and turn in the ring. the one i raised from a baby had done many trail miles before she was 2 as i would pony her from my other horse, by the time i got on her she had crossed roads, gone up and down banks, met dogs, cars, farm equipment etc, crossed water. I also hand walked her out there by herself ever since she was weaned and learned to lead. i wanted a trail horse first and found that teaching her to jump or go in a frame was easier after we had done trail riding for a year or so, i spent very little time in the ring with her until she was in her 5th year.
the first serious trail ride i took her on undersaddle was about 15 miles, it was about 2 weeks after i got on her the first time and it took a long time because she was too young to do anyting but walk and we had to work out a few things but she was no worse for wear. i also found that unless you had a hard case or a horse that was older and needed retraining to make a trail horse, it’s easier to take them out alone than in a group for the first rides.

[KarenC]

I agree completely. “Trail Horse” in advertising tends to mean “he can’t do anything else, so I guess he’ll make a good trail horse.”

Regardless of whether you are competing (distance riding) or simply trail riding for pleasure, a good trail horse requires a specific disposition and set of skills just like any good show horse.

Of course, I’m sure you’ve all witnessed some of the yahoos on public trails… I suppose it isn’t suprising what some people think makes a good trail horse.

[FairWeather]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Yes, I take offense when someone says…well this horse is stupid or lame, or unable to jump, maybe it can do trail. Please…you people get my rejects…not the other way around! My horses have to be close to perfect, with NO problems! I can’t have a neurotic horse who is afraid of a loud voice or a sudden touch. Please. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The animosity on this thread is unreal.

Please dont try to shove your terms down my throat either. We have different terms for what a “trail ride” is. When I call my friends up to see if they want to join me on a leisurely w/t/c through the woods I actually say…Get ready for this…

“Wanna go for a trail ride?”

Give me a break. Obviously my posts arent referring to your 15MPH for billions of miles trails.
And no, I dont just “walk” on my trail rides.

Starting to smell like the Hunter/Jumper board. Are we going to start picking on one anothers choice of helmet now?

[Dalriada]

My “distance” horses are all show horses and my show horses are all “distance” horses. We cross ours over and TRAIN for each and every discipline. Doing many disciplines is what keeps our horses fresh and happy and doing it well.

I don’t expect my horses to be able to go down the trail when I have never trained or conditioned them to do so. It takes effort to make a horse go down the trail properly same as it does to make that perfect hunter round or dressage test or follow the specs of a specific class.

My horses are all sound with no “limited” or “limiting” soundness issues - those are the ones we sell as PLEASURE horses or retire to broodmare status.

We can go out for strolls with friends but I tell you my butt hurts from me sitting in the saddle for a couple of hours just walking along (and I bet my horse’s back does too). Personally I prefer to go a tad bit faster and to vary it up a bit.

Trail horses to me are those that can do an obstacle class in the showring under western tack. Competitive trail horses are those athletes that compete 25+ miles at 5-8mph. Endurance horses are those that race 50+ miles against others in order to get to the finish line first before the clock stops. Pleasure horses are those that people keep in their backyard and ride out occassionally with their buddies. It’s all a difference of semantics.

[sonata]

Hi, I am a lurker, but thought that I would put my 2 cents in. A good trail horse will take care of his rider, not run from hot air ballons, bikes, 4 wheelers, battery operated airplanes and real ones that are swooping down to attack. He won’t just put his feet anywhere, he will check out the terrain, go with other horses and teach the younger horses how to cross mud, streams and wooden bridges. I am lucky, I have one of those horses and have been riding him for 20 years. I am now starting to ride his younger sister as he will go into semi retirement at the age of 23.By the time he is in full retirement, I hope that she will be half as good as he is.

[gabz]

Thank you gothedistance…
Fairweather - perhaps you might want to reconsider your not quite sound horses as “pleasure horses” rather than trail horses, although I understand where many will advertise a “trail horse” as one that may not be trained for arena-type competition (whether dressage, jumping, western pleasure, reining, etc.).

As another thread discusses - there are trail horses that have to be completely fit, fully trained, and SOUND to do trail work - even if it IS NOT competitive.

Friends and I go out with our “square-wheeled” horses (not gaited) for 3, 4, 5 hours at a time. Some walking, much trotting, and some cantering. This equates to 15 - 20 miles or more depending on speed and terrain. I prefer to NOT have to walk back … Those who participate in the Michigan shore-to-shore scheduled rides routinely ride 25 or more miles each day - there’s even a “criss-cross” where you start on one side of Michigan ride across and then return. The horses AND RIDERS have to be fit and be prepared for all sorts of strange activity and conditions. And you might be surprised to find that a large percentage are in their 40s & 50s, while many are retired and are in their 60s or later years. These riders ESPECIALLY need their horse to stay sound and take care of them the distance between camps.

[silver]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>If the horse has no experience on the trail, I would expect him to be advertised as a prospect. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
When I lived Southern CA that was an issue b/c people don’t get off the property much. You would see all these horses advertised as “retired from show ring, suitable for light trail riding” and when you talked to the owner it turned out the horse had never been on a trail ride in the 10 years they’d had it! Basically it was just too lame to show anymore.

I helped a fairly novice friend buy a trail horse years ago in LA and the horses people were trying to sell her were 3yo fresh OTTBs, lame show horses (like navicular, lame at the walk, lame), horses that “didn’t like ring work”, ie flipped over when you asked them to go past the gate. The main qualification all these horses had for being a trail horse was that they were cheap.

We found her a great little horse of indeterminate breeding for about $3000 (who has never put a foot wrong with her or her kid) and all people could say was “you paid too much for such a small horse”. Craziness. Many pleasure riders are novice or older riders without a lot of time on their hands to be retraining something. That $3K was money WELL spent.

[Hannahsmom]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by FairWeather:
Um, folks there is a huge difference between a “trail horse” and a competitive athlete that can cover 30 miles at a go. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know, but I did mean just the simple little ‘trail’ riding. And maybe my horse is ‘psycho’ but it wasn’t easy for him. I am considering trying a CTR of the lowest possible level but I think even that will be a huge challenge for my horse’s brain and I’m reading this forum to try to learn more before I try one.

[gothedistance]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by FairWeather:
Starting to smell like the Hunter/Jumper board. Are we going to start picking on one anothers choice of helmet now? </div></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh, no Mr. Bill!! <running the opposite direction>

FairWeather - you’re right … it’s all semantics. Toe-maa-toes and toe-mah-toes. When it comes right down to it any way you look at it-- dressage, trail, hunting, jumpers, endurance – it’s all just pleasure riding with a theme. Not worth the fuss.

BTW - Love your website!

[Hannahsmom]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by gothedistance:
You should do it, H. Take a friend with you and ride as a pair just for the experience. CTRs are inexpensive and super fun with great dinners, lots of friendly people, and lovely trails to enjoy for the day. You will learn TONS about your horse, his fitness and readiness, his metabolics and his abilities,… </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree, which is why this appeals to me. I got a taste when I was competing my old three day event horse where I had to condition for the endurance day. I really enjoyed all the training time, the gallop sets, the extra work and knowledge needed to condition for the full endurance day. The partnership was unbelievable as well as I knew my horse so much better.

I have no illusions about my horse and I being able to do more than a 25 miler. That’s our goal. I have been eventing this horse for about 6 years at the Preliminary level and just moved up to Intermediate (so he’s sound!), but I’ve been reading up on this forum as I’ve always been a bit intrigued with the thought even though I know he’s not really the right ‘type’ of horse I’m hoping that my horse will figure out not to be a looney tune mentally just like he has realized that gallop sets are WORK, so settles into them without a lot of fuss and pulling. I’m just not so sure I’M sound enough! There’s a lot I have to learn but I have a lot of years left to do it.

And to the original poster, I guess you are hearing the same things we eventers hear! “Oh, the horse isn’t good enough to be a hunter or dressage horse, sell him as an eventer.”

[FairWeather]

Hey folks, before you try handing me my ass in a hat again, read my posts.

Arabhorse–Yes, that is why I made the above post of “trail riding” versus a competitive trail/endurance horse. Sorry folks, to me a ‘trail ride’ is a leisurely wander thru nice scenery. Obviously a sound horse is needed in any competitive (tho not necessarily one who competes) discipline.

And Gothedistance, thats funny. I’ve only come across a handful of horses that didnt take to trail riding like a fish to water, or with very little training. There are definately the odd few who simply dont enjoy it, but for the most part the majority of horses will adjust fine to it. Are you suggesting that I believe horses leave the ring and trail ride and act perfect the first time they do it? Sorry dear, I never said that. Trail riding takes training just like any other discipline. I dont trail ride my fresh off the track TB’s by themselves the first time, and I dont expect them to cross water without a minor freak out. Does this mean they cannot learn? Not in my book, and not in my experience. The topic is “Why do people think any horse CAN BE a trail horse”, not "Why do people think every horse IS a trail horse. Any horse can trail ride. And most of them can be nice trail horses with the right training.
And again Captain aggressive, I didnt say UNSOUND horses. I said horses unsound to jump. Funny, My horse with an arthritic knee and fused hocks can withstand the rigors of any trail i’ve put him on. Would I put him in the A/O jumpers? Nope.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Kinder all around to sell your unsound horses as pasture ornaments or family pets for light riding around the barn. You do no service selling them otherwise. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Point out to me where I say I sold unsound horses?? Cause i’m pretty darn sure I didnt. Now, read carefully dear, cause these posts can be pretty confusing.

edited bc i cant spell. grr.

[gothedistance]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by Dalriada:
We can go out for strolls with friends but I tell you my butt hurts from me sitting in the saddle for a couple of hours just walking along… </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
OMG! So does mine! I can go 100 miles in endurance or foxhunt for hours no problemo, but give me a 2 hour strolling walk with friends down the road and my butt is just howling for mercy. And I select my saddles for the softest seats, too!!

Glad to hear this board has more than one “candy ass” besides me.

[RTM_Anglo_s]

Glad I could return the favor!

Ahahaaaa

At least in my posts I state it is my opinion, and not the way of the world.

Ahahhahaaa

Learn to take what you give…my motto in life.

[Sparks5]

One of the hardest rides of my life was a trail ride. It was about 30 miles over unthinkable terrain, through hornet nests, up the side of a tennessee mountain, through a river we had to SWIM, jumping logs 3 feet high, galloping, trotting till I had bruises and water blisters…

Serious trail riding is for serious riders with a VERY ATHLETIC horse!

Trust me - I NEVER needed that kind of athleticism, wind, or power in the dressage ring!

[RTM_Anglo_s]

OK,

A lame horse is a lame horse! Pure and Simple and not a use to anyone in any type of discipline period.

Good Lord, am I hearing this stuff right? Generalizations are being made about trail riders. So, I ride 100 miles and my horse is lame, and that’s ok because I compete on trail?

Oh my!

In the equation of competition on any trail, the first and foremost is your mounts legs! Holey Moley. Why would I spend $200 on a ride for entry, trailer there another $200 for one weekend and take a horse that is lame? AHahhahhaa

Maybe I am not reading this thread correctly, but I don’t think a lame horse is EVER remotely EVER acceptable for trail riding of ANY kind. Retire it to field or put it down. Why would a trail rider ever think of riding a lame horse, but a show person wouldn’t?

My goodness, we have this thing called vet checks and it prohibits lame horses from competing! Ohhhhhh

I guess “us” silly trail ridden fools are just too stupid to understand the dat-burn horse is lame? Ahahhahaaa Hay, Arnie…it’s only got three legs.

Please, I have known show people, and I have know trail competitors…two separate folks here. My experiences have shown me, that show people don’t know how to take care of their horses, trailer them, or even how to schedule vets. On the other hand, trail competitors know everything about their horses. What they like to eat, were they like to be scratched, when they don’t feel right, how to backup a trailer, and when to schedule a vet. They notice their horses. Show people pay someone else to do that, or hope they do.

Generalizations are hurtful…as the one I provided above.