Why does no one question horse prices?

[Scribbler]

General comment.

The gap between the upper and upper middle class and rest of us especially in the USA has gotten huge in the past 20 years. Apparently back where things were in 1890s, all the gains in egalitarians 9f the 20th century wiped out. And the poor are very poor. Much of this money is new. Celebrities, tech, finance and international flight capital, drug profits. Aa

This has created a world wide luxury class for whom a whole teir of goods and experiences have been created.

Things that have gone crazy expensive in the past decades include land, vacations makeup skin care designer handbags watches and high end hunter horses. Because hunter is the default discipline for wealthy juniors and the current trainer centered model works for those with more money than time.

However money was always a huge advantage. We tell children you can be anything you want so they don’t get discouraged but we adults always know it’s not true.

There’s lots of threads on here of folks saying they have a 6 figure income and are still priced out of the true A hunters. Not just the horse but the board training show fees and long shows.

Just like you can’t really buy a house in my city with a low 6 figure income. Or a Lamborghini or a Rolex or a Hermes handbag.

It can be a big shock to come up against adult realities that you are priced out of much of what’s shown on Instagram and that raw work ethic is not the whole picture. But there’s no point being bitter about it. You just have to find your niche where you can afford to play.

[KBC]

@lenapesadie

Don’t want to be called a spade? Don’t act like one. Real simple

Round of applause.

[CindyCRNA]

I paid $1 for my guy. He took 4th in open training at The Fork this year. So there! lol

[TheBigEasy]

Sheesh…reading 271 posts I have nothing -and a lot- to say. Enjoyed the wine and guac.

The OP may be way off base on pretty much everything - but I learned a lot by reading sensible, thought out replies.

I really should have spent the hour reading this thread and the bizarre tangents, studying my dressage tests or watching videos on how to develop my changes. Cause that’s where it’s at for me and my “bought mid 4s and could now sell for much more but never will”

Another angle breezed past here - there are certain ammies who could buy much more horse, but are in it for the journey.

There are three ladies at my barn who could afford a high-fives/low-six horse and the commensurate training board and show fees. But - they don’t - those ladies have educated affordable horses they brought along, learning as they progressed. All three skilled horsewomen who can do equine management, trailering, taking lessons and fixing problems with the trainer. Women who have deep pockets but choose not to use them. Because be-bopping to a local circuit with your gal pals on a horse you get dirty with every day is just what you want to do.

[Sleipnir]

Europe is not a country. It’s a collection of countries, all with different cultures and viewpoints, and in most horse meat is a taboo, not a delicacy. However in those where this meat IS traditional to eat, there are horses raised specifically for this purpose, like cattle, not just some random sport horses shipped to slaughter after a long career in drug abuse.

[BrendaJane]

true. They ahve to record drugs used on sport horses in their passport.

[2DogsFarm]

@self_made_hunter_jumper

I’ve interviewed an actual Olympian who told me this back in 2015

So… While I was going my daily See What’s New on this BB, I found a thread where you, OP,
@self_made_hunter_jumper admitted to being in your early 20s - 24 IIRC.
So you interviewed said Olympian at the age of 17? Media Prodigy? Or HS journalist?

Back to the Blue Saddle kitchen…

[OfCourseItsAnAlter]

I was thinking about these claims that “back in the day” you didn’t have to have money to compete at big shows and you know, that’s just not really true.

I still, 50+ years later, vividly remember the incident that brought home to me that, in the horse world, my middle-class family was poor. I started taking riding lessons in the late 1960s with a small group of kids all about my age. We all rode lesson horses. I was lucky because I was one of the few who actually owned a horse (kept at the neighbors farm).

Then, one day, my best friend from my lesson class got her own horse. A lovely little mare that cost $5000, and she embarked on a showing career at rated shows.

My horse, a very much not-so-lovely little mare had cost $250. When I went home and requested an upgrade, so I could join in the fun with my friend Linda, my Dad gave me a lesson in economics. It turned out that I was really lucky that they were willing to budget enough money for my riding lessons and that if we hadn’t been able to keep my horse for free at the neighbors, we wouldn’t even be able to afford a $250 horse. My little 12-year-old mind was blown. I always thought we were, well, not wealthy, but certainly reasonably well-off.

Thanks to Google, I converted those horse prices to 2022 dollars:

Linda’s $5000 horse cost nearly $42,000 in 2022 dollars.

My $250 horse cost about $2000 in 2022 dollars.

So, it seems that, economically, things “back in the day” weren’t really that much different.

[lenapesadie]

Yeah the back in the day argument doesn’t really hold water does it?

I knew 20 yrs ago that I couldn’t afford a fancy dressage horse. But instead of accusing the horse work at large of being money laundering mobsters, I figured out what might be in the realm of my financial reality and went in my way.

[Piaffe11]

I think this plays into it a lot - no one thinks about the difference in value between “then” dollars and “today” dollars. How much of that plays into the current horse market I am unsure.

I make a (barely) 6-figure salary (CND dollars albeit) and in Ontario we have the “Sunshine List” where all public servants are listed when we make more than $100,000 to be basically publicly shamed for making money (not really, but there is always some outcry when it comes out). The Sunshine List started in 1996. For the list to truly be accurate today with inflation of the dollar and everything the list should start at $184,000!

Part of the problem is that salaries have not risen at the same rate as the dollar. Horse prices should reflect the cost that is put into them for sure - that is only fair. We can complain horse prices have gone up, but the real complaint is that we don’t have the same purchase power we used to.

[beowulf]

@Piaffe11

I make a (barely) 6-figure salary (CND dollars albeit) and in Ontario we have the “Sunshine List” where all public servants are listed when we make more than $100,000 to be basically publicly shamed for making money (not really, but there is always some outcry when it comes out). The Sunshine List started in 1996. For the list to truly be accurate today with inflation of the dollar and everything the list should start at $184,000!

Oh wow… and what a name to pick for the list, too!

Talk about zero faith in your local public servants… I work in municipality and know that culture very well.

ETA: I just virtually attended a town meeting and the opener was from the Finance Committee complaining that they (towns folk) are paying us too much money and they need to pay us less. Talk about setting the mood!

[Jealoushe]

Except horses aren’t produced in factories that were closed because of covid, don’t take computer chips, and aren’t impacted by sanctions on hostile countries.

So…not following your logic?

And thanks again for the personal dig! I hope it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside

There is actually a reason for the horse shortage.

Approximately in and around 2008 and 2018 there was a recession which caused many to stop breeding. Many people with young horses chose to not send horses for training and many horses sat untrained or not shown. 4/5 years later there is a shortage of trained horses, young horses and schoolmasters.

Do you listen to any podcasts? You can learn a lot about the industry that way.

[Jealoushe]

I’m the one who suggested OP was jealous but not because of the price of horses….because of the way the posts come
across and the non stop bashing of amateurs with money.

[Jealoushe]

Longines is only one show circuit though lol that alone hasn’t ruined the sport. Maybe it ruined that circuit. You are very much in a bubble with blinders on.

[MunchingonHay]

OMG! I finally made it to the end. it took me hours.

I have so many things to say.

I find it very bold for a 24yr old to speak to adults in the manner of which the OP did. Perhaps I am old (mid 40’s) but when I was a 24 yr old and a professional groom at the time for CDE’s I would NEVER speak out of turn. And that is what your are doing OP.

Learn, watch and listen. COTH is an amazingly community, you could learn from them. But you are already skilled, and ride well enough to be a pro and I am sure you know it all, but yet; know nothing.

Please sit down, seriously you sound like a spoiled hunter Princess that daddy recently cut off.

You have a lot to learn.

[BrendaJane]

Did the 2008 recession make a major impact?
I mean a lot of breeders hung it up for good then.

[KBC]

@MunchingonHay

I am sure you know it all, but yet; know nothing.

Default setting for the younger generation,I guess we were the same, but had such a limited access to others that our “learning” times were less public.

[BrendaJane]

if it comes with the right attitude it’s the motor that drives us forward.

Or tears down the China Shop

[MunchingonHay]

At 24 I knew to keep my mouth shut and listen to the people that had more experience than me. Did I ask questions absolutely. I encourage the conversation, but at no point did OP relent to the fact that their limited view was just that…limited.

I just find it bizzard, the broad brush statements with nothing to back it up and then telling us these things are happening like we are all wearing blinkers.

I was about ready to fashion a tin foil hat !

[fivestrideline]

Woof. I just read this whole thing, and this is my first COTH train wreck thread I got to see live .

I think one of my threads about what hunters are going for right now may have triggered this one - OP was on it commenting they’d never spend more than 20k. I think it’s very eye opening, and discouraging, to be shown real numbers on a sport you are passionate about, one where even the lowest levels are expensive for all but the lucky and well-trained. Especially in the economic times we are in, especially as a young person. So I have some sympathy in that regard, but the wild conspiracies really threw it off. Too bad, since there is some fabulous info here on what it takes to produce a decent hunter horse!

Can I join in the guac party, even if I’m late?