Will bitless ever be permitted in competition?

[Synthesis]

Will it ever be permitted in recognized competition? No idea.
Is it a better tool for some horses? Absolutely.

My mare’s understanding of a bit is 100% improved due to spending most of 3 months schooling in a short mechanical hackamore. She had some lousy work done with her before me. (Green as grass and anxious/spooky, solution was to truss her up in front like a turkey)

Getting past the braced jaw/neck/back and the hiding behind the bit had been nearly impossible. So I tested the hackamore for hacking and realized that I was getting a dramatically better trot with reaching, swinging and (gasp) connection. She was reaching into the hackamore and holding contact. I could get her to push through from behind and recycle that energy. Canter was better and jump bascule shockingly improved. On approach to a jump, I can push her up herself and build power, the differences are pretty remarkable.

So, I’ve worked her consistently in the hackamore to build the right muscles. The longer I’ve worked her in the hackamore, the better the work in the snaffle has become because she ‘suddenly’ finds it easier and has built the habit.

At the end of the day, I’ll use a snaffle in competition as long as I have to but if there’s a tool that my horse prefers and is more correct then I’ll work this that.

[Sticky_Situation]

I know I’m preaching to the choir here, but count me in the group that is not a fan of those cross-under bridles. They seem to be marketed largely to beginners as a kinder, gentler alternative to the “cruelty” of putting in your horse’s mouth, but they’re anything but.

With a bit, the softening of pressure as the horse relaxes into contact is instantaneous, as long as the rider does their job. With those cross-under contraptions, especially since many of them seem to be made of stick biothane-type stuff, they stay tight-ish and only gradually loosen up even if the rider totally drops the contact. Not conducive to training the horse to respond to aids that are in any way subtle, and definitely not kinder or gentler than a correctly used bit.

[SendenHorse]

I ageree sticky situation- they create a lot of pressure.

[Foxtrot_s]

^^^ agree - but also, there is something comforting about having a soft mouth
at the end of the reins that you can feel…like taking the hand of a child before crossing the street. It is not a yank, it is a communication, and the child willingly comes along. I’m just not able to visualize that feeing with just bitless or halter or hackamore.

When I start my horses they also do not have a bit for a while - they are too easily unbalanced but of course, the experts do bring them along quickly with a bit. No prejudice against bits from me.

[StormyDay]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;8868895]
^^^ agree - but also, there is something comforting about having a soft mouth
at the end of the reins that you can feel…like taking the hand of a child before crossing the street. It is not a yank, it is a communication, and the child willingly comes along. I’m just not able to visualize that feeing with just bitless or halter or hackamore.

When I start my horses they also do not have a bit for a while - they are too easily unbalanced but of course, the experts do bring them along quickly with a bit. No prejudice against bits from me.[/QUOTE]

Its a different type of communication, because most of the steering is done with the body. The bridle is only for speed changes and confirming which way you want to turn. It is perfect for horses who don’t like riders in their mouth over the jumps, and are finished jumpers, because they can just do their thing. But dressage horses don’t get to just do their thing, they need constant feedback. My finished jumper doesn’t need constant feedback from me, but my dressage horse does.

[Synthesis]

[QUOTE=StormyDay;8869129]
Its a different type of communication, because most of the steering is done with the body. The bridle is only for speed changes and confirming which way you want to turn. It is perfect for horses who don’t like riders in their mouth over the jumps, and are finished jumpers, because they can just do their thing. But dressage horses don’t get to just do their thing, they need constant feedback. My finished jumper doesn’t need constant feedback from me, but my dressage horse does.[/QUOTE]

Funny, that’s almost the opposite of how my mare goes in the hackamore. I ride her almost identically, she goes almost identically but more -er. Round-er, forward-er, relaxed-er, swingy-er. Exception being the absence of bracing through the jaw/neck, which allows my half halts to not get jammed up.

[Keg-A-Bacchus]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;8868895]
^^^ agree - but also, there is something comforting about having a soft mouth
at the end of the reins that you can feel…like taking the hand of a child before crossing the street. It is not a yank, it is a communication, and the child willingly comes along. I’m just not able to visualize that feeing with just bitless or halter or hackamore.

When I start my horses they also do not have a bit for a while - they are too easily unbalanced but of course, the experts do bring them along quickly with a bit. No prejudice against bits from me.[/QUOTE]

I love your explanation here! Goosebumps! It is an incredible feeling having that connection. However, for certain horses who for whatever reason can’t tolerate a bit (I’ve only had one now in my 30+ years riding) you can’t ever get that soft, willing response. It’s like taking the hand of a child with a broken hand. It’s uncomfortable. They wince instead of squeezing your hand back. They will hold it and suck up the discomfort because you asked them too. They would much rather have you place your arm around their shoulder and guide them across the street. You still get that connection, closeness and moving as one…just without the wincing. I never would have believed it until I experienced it, but you can get that exact same feeling in bitless. My mind was blown. I hope someday you get a chance to ride a horse who is connected bitless. I think you would be as blown away as I was at the feeling being virtually the same…minus the fussing with a bit. My pony isn’t so severe she can’t ride with a bit but she defintely prefers it. I would be devastated if we couldn’t do FEI, which she is otherwise perfectly capable of both bitted and bitless, if she, like some horses, couldn’t use a bit period. That’s why I’m hoping we can follow in some other countries footsteps and at least try it in competition and see how it goes. It won’t hurt anyone, it shouldn’t be considered an “advantage” so I can’t imagine why people would have a problem competing against a bitless horse. In a side pull, of course, with no leverage. I don’t see what we have to lose giving it the old college try!

[andhourspass]

Nice to see so many people chime in. I agree those cross-under bridles are terrible. There’s a boarder at our barn who has used it on 2 different horses and it was a disaster.

Synthesis in post #65 - my horse is the same way!! I wish I had switched to a hackamore years ago. The only reason I switched my older horse to a hackamore a little over a year ago is because of a tooth issue. Dentist, vet and I agreed that it’d be best to not use a bit anymore. Well she goes better in the hack than she ever did in a bit, and I have better steering and better brakes and an absolutely better connection with her. Her mouth is relaxed, ears, floppy, gaits fluid, not flinging her head or getting nasty. It was immediate but I went through 5 or 6 different hacks before I found one that works for her so there was a bit of trial and error. Sadly, I’m not able to compete in even low levels at our local dressage schooling shows because of it. Very frustrating.

[poltroon]

[QUOTE=Keg-A-Bacchus;8862188]
I ride in a bit because I show and have to. I’ve been through dozens and dozens of bits and she’ll ride in one beautifully because she’s obedient but she’s never 100% comfortable in one. She’s got a funny shaped mouth and she prefers to be bitless. I had never ridden bitless before, I’m not a “bitless advocate” and I’m not a mushy “bits are cruel” person either. I think for most horses bits are just fine. But honestly, aside from the fussing with the bit in her mouth periodically she rides exactly the same with it or without it. She’s on the aids, up over her back, in self carriage and there is zero difference. She can collect and extend with ease. She’s light in my hand and responsive to the slightest half halts. She’s in a side pull so there is no leverage. As someone who can ride either way I seriously can’t find a single reason they are required other than a technical term “on the bit” I believe is taken entirely too literally. On the aids is a much better way to describe what should be going on when you’re doing dressage. If a piece of metal in the mouth is a necessity for a horse to be round and working up over their back then, honestly, I think you’re doing it wrong. The bit should just be there to help communicate and channel energy back to the hind legs. The exact same thing can be accomplished without it. I can’t find a single thing in trying it both ways that has swayed my opinion on that. I think bits should be optional. If you prefer a bit, great! Have at it! If your horse prefers bitless, by all means, if you can do the test and the movements good on you. I couldn’t care less. But I can’t find one reason why they are a requirement. Leverage hackamores, like leverage bits, of course shouldn’t be allowed, but regular bitless bridles should be perfectly legal in my opinion. I know my pony would be thrilled. And until I come across something that requires a piece of metal in her mouth to accomplish where we are at in dressage I will stand firmly by my opinion. But I don’t think I’m ever going to find something that we can’t do bitless. I will certainly report back if I do.[/QUOTE]

I basically agree that there is no reason we should prohibit a sidepull type bitless arrangement. To me, the idea of “on the bit” is fundamentally about a connection between the horse’s front end and the rider’s body, and if someone can produce it without a bit, why is that a problem?

It is just a different choice in equipment, IMHO as valid as choosing a mullen snaffle over a jointed snaffle.

If the result isn’t harmonious, then judges will give it poor scores. No problem.

Just to show where we are already, we have paraolympians who ride without arms. We are able to judge them in dressage. How is that easier or more pure than a sidepull?

[Graymaresrule]

Thought this was interesting and positive
http://www.eurodressage.com/equestrian/2012/03/08/bitless-competition-2012-helsinki-horse-fair-huge-success

[poltroon]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;8872455]
Thought this was interesting and positive
http://www.eurodressage.com/equestrian/2012/03/08/bitless-competition-2012-helsinki-horse-fair-huge-success[/QUOTE]

Nice. There are some lovely pictures there.

The right option is the one that makes that particular horse and rider most harmonious. I see no reason the choice of a bitless bridle is any more of a threat to dressage than a Micklem bridle or a Dee ring snaffle.

[StormyDay]

I think it is more of a welfare problem than a competition problem. Someone riding their horse in a twisted snaffle doesn’t really effect me, and hey, maybe the horse even likes that bit. But we don’t allow them because they can be used very, very wrong a lot easier than a normal snaffle.

[Foxtrot_s]

I’d actually be fine with a bitless horse in a dressage class - if they can go as well and beat the others, more power to them…wonder if the judges would penalize in the scoring? At least some shows could put classes in for such as a trial.

Some of the bitted classes show a lot of yanking and stabbing, even higher up, so what is worse?

It will probably start as a grass roots movement and work up.

[Graymaresrule]

[QUOTE=poltroon;8872475]
Nice. There are some lovely pictures there.

The right option is the one that makes that particular horse and rider most harmonious. I see no reason the choice of a bitless bridle is any more of a threat to dressage than a Micklem bridle or a Dee ring snaffle.[/QUOTE]

Those are the best I have seen. Others I have seen have been like the video I posted earlier or a rider much less harsh with a horse just barely tooling around.

The main issue I see with bitless is some proponents claim that bitless is always kinder and bits are always abusive.

[Foxtrot_s]

Your last sentence says a lot, Carol. When people go on about their metal-free horses, it makes it seem as if shoes and bits are cruel…not so.