WWYD about a saddle for this horse?

[Bristol_Bay]

The good news is that I got a new horse and he’s a great fit for me. The bad news is that he’s a bad fit for my saddle. My retired horse is a narrow high-withered TB, and when he moved to his retirement home, I had pro panels put in my Voltaire Palm Beach so I could use it on other horses. It’s been fine on all the school horses with creative padding.

My new horse is a tank. On top of being wide and having low withers, he’s also fat. He tested as IR/low thyroid and is now being fed and supplemented appropriately so he will lose weight in the next few months. But I discovered the first day that every saddle in the barn sat on him like an A frame cabin. My friend loaned me her saddle made to fit her Irish draught and it was also too narrow.

The only saddle in the entire barn that fits well enough is an old Crosby donated to the school saddles stack by a similarly tall woman. So it fits me, I can use it as long as I need to, but I can’t do much in it. There’s so little padding that I can’t sit the trot or his bumpy canter.

Do I try and use a cushy pad or Thinline? He really has no withers at this point so maybe it wouldn’t make the saddle narrower on him?

I know I’ll need a saddle with a different tree. Should I try to find an interim wide saddle I can ride more comfortably in?

Will his back change so much after losing weight that a new saddle now would not fit after he’s more fit?

Or should I just suck it up and two point until fall?

[lenapesadie]

Maybe a used Duett? Relatively inexpensive and can probably resell later at minimal loss.

ETA: gnashing of teeth and tears are also acceptable

[IPEsq]

I think if the borrowed saddle doesn’t bother him, I’d try to tough it out for a little bit to see what shape he is under the chub. If he’s got low withers, then some extra gullet clearance in front is to be expected. For width what matters is where the tree points are.

[Bristol_Bay]

I have had that “hoop tree” thought.

I have to use a no slip pad on him. After my TB, it feels like bizarro upside down world!

[lenapesadie]

I feel your pain. I have an extra wide Friesian/QH but he’s got big withers. My traditional A tree saddles didn’t come close to fitting him, it was a nightmare, saddles would NOT stay where they were supposed to.

Duetts won’t work for him as they are for the wide, round, little to no wither types (as told to my by a fitter). I was pretty bummed as the Duetts are very cost efficient and readily available used. There is an active FB group for them.

I have a Thornhill for my boy, while not perfect, it sits balanced and securely on him and is comfortable for me to ride in. My horse moves a heck of a lot better with a decently fitting saddle.

I think asking yourself to ride in a very uncomfortable saddle is false economy.

[Moneypitt]

Crosby saddles are typically not really very wide. A wide tree Crosby didn’t come close to fitting a moderate withered horse we had years ago. Hopefully, the Crosby saddle’s tree is not compromised.

I’m not very familiar with Voltaire saddle sizing. Do they make an extra wide tree option? Also the leather covered foam panels on French saddles can be adjusted to remove some foam from 20mm to 10 mm thick by an experienced saddler. This helps widen the front shoulder area.

Have you tried an Antares saddle with an AO2 (extra wide tree)? Probably hard to find. Might be worth a try.

I would also suggest a Pessoa saddle with the xchange gullet in a wide or xwide. Might work.

Edited to add link and to mention Tad Coffin saddles.

French Brands

**Also be aware that Duette saddles which is an American Company were being made in South America originally with European leather. Not made in UK as was being claimed. Sort of a bit of a hush, hush scandal; some time ago. Company owner went ballistic from what I remember. Thus the lower price point.

[vxf111]

The market for saddles is crazy right now. I would keep your eyes out for a use British saddle (Duett, Black Country, Ideal, Hastilow etc.) that is either a hoop tree or a wide tree. Even if it’s not your favorite, you can use it as a patch and sell it for likely what you paid later.

[JB]

adding to vxf111’s list is Frank Baines or (unlikely) a Balance saddle (made by Frank Baines. Some County saddles can fit, as well as Prestige. The latter 2 aren’t technically hoop trees, but the top of the “A” frame is wider than the typical A-frame tree

For reference, my WB wore a 39cm Prestige Top Dressage saddle, after we had a Balance Felix. When I was looking for a new CC saddle (because the Balance was simply too big for me), there were lots that fit, both in the Prestige world, the Duett world (that fit him well but it was horrible for me), County. The saddle I settled on was a Black Country Quantum X (the hoop model) in an XW.

[Peggy]

@IPEsq

I think if the borrowed saddle doesn’t bother him, I’d try to tough it out for a little bit to see what shape he is under the chub. If he’s got low withers, then some extra gullet clearance in front is to be expected. For width what matters is where the tree points are.

Maybe a seat saver with some shock absorption would help? Perhaps in adfition to a thinline halfpad or something similar.

[Ponycatraz]

Chunky Monkey is another brand geared towards the no wither propane tank. I see them on my XW saddle FB grouu I p and they seem pretty sought after.

[Bristol_Bay]

Seems like more of a UK brand. I’d like to have something to try first.

Yes, @Moneypitt Voltaire makes an extra wide tree, so I should call and see if my rep has one to at least try on him. However, I’m not confident he would ever be able to say “we don’t have a saddle to fit this horse.”

Also, anyone have experience with saddle fit issues on a horse that has lost weight?

[Bogie]

I am somewhat doubtful that the Crosby is wide enough, plus if it’s an older one, the foam panels will have compressed which increases the chance of pressure points. Adding additional padding underneath the saddle will change the fit.

If it’s just making you more comfortable, Acavallo makes gel seat covers that are super comfortable. I have both the gel in and gel out versions. They make even the hardest saddles feel like a cloud.

In your shoes, I’d look for a relatively inexpensive used saddle that fits your horse now, with the understanding that you might need to sell it when his shape adjusts. But to keep you and your horse comfortable, and to make sure he develops the right musculature, the saddle needs to fit.

When my own mare got a bit too fluffy one winter (I was injured and couldn’t ride), her jumping saddle looked like a party hat in the spring. I used a treeless saddle to get her fitter and also bought a Wintec (they make a wide version) as I got her back into fighting shape. She goes in an XL gullet size, so I hear your pain on finding a saddle that fits.

Thorowgood also makes a Cob version that is aimed at wide horses.

[Moneypitt]

Try some wider Voltaire’s. AO, AO2

Maybe some Antares.

Sometimes the tree is wide but the panels are restrictive to the shoulders. The key is finding a wide, wide combo. In Voltaire that would be pro panels with AO or AO2 tree, I think?

[Ponycatraz]

@Bristol_Bay

Also, anyone have experience with saddle fit issues on a horse that has lost weight?

Yes and unfortunately it made fit harder. My tank lost weight (ribs lightly visible), but gained shoulder muscle with the fitness routine and we had to go up a size.

[vxf111]

I’m not sure wide in some French brands is going to be wide enough. Depends how wide he really is. A lot of French brands have 4.25 as their medium, and their wide is not even 4.75. You can get up to 5.5 in a lot of the British brands.

A hoop tree is a totally different SHAPE too. It’s not just wider.

It might help if you took some good photos of him so we could see what we’re really dealing with.

If he truly is a big wide no wither WB I’m a little dubious that a French saddle is going to be the best fit— but without seeing him it’s really hard to say. Big (and fat) doesn’t necessarily mean the horse needs a wide tree. Depends on confirmation. My massive 18.2 ISH only needed a medium wide. My 16.2 Hanoverian needs a wide.

[Displaced_Yankee]

@Bristol_Bay

Also, anyone have experience with saddle fit issues on a horse that has lost weight?

My horse is broad, but still has some withers. We are in a Fairfax saddle with the various gullet plates. He ranges from a XW to a W depending on spring grass and how much riding I am actually doing. At one point while he was in full training he was down to a medium gullet, but I felt he had lost too much weight. I like his flesh and muscle when he is in the W gullet. The gullets are easy to swap, and the saddle is wool flocked. We like the shape of the tree and panels for this horse. My fitter trusts my eye to swap gullets but I also have her out on a regular basis to check or tweak the flocking.

All that said (and this may sound like blasphemy in H/J land) but what about a Thorowgood or Kent and Masters, considering this is just an interim saddle? They are owned by the same parent company as Fairfax and offer a wide range of gullet widths, including the “broad back” or “cob style” saddle. My Fairfax is the “cob” and offers shorter tree points, but they are no longer doing the “cob” for the Fairfax line.

Even the regular Thorowgood/Kent & Masters are generously wide and are sub $1000 (Thorowgood) and $1800 (Kent & Masters) new. When he is at a weight that you like, then resell this saddle to get him something more permanent.

[Bristol_Bay]

This is him when he was five.

And now.

[StormyDay]

You most likely need a hoop tree.
Duetts are a good saddle for now, and you can usually pick them up pretty cheap. They aren’t the nicest leather though.
CWD can custom make a hoop tree if you have a really good fitter. It’s the only French brand I know of that can.
I have a English brand saddle for my tank. I can’t remember the name right now. The English have many more options due to them having so many cobs.

[vxf111]

Also good brand suggestions

[vxf111]

From photos I think a hoop tree might be what you need. Really cute. He has a very kind eye. And a really cresty neck! I am glad you got him and are getting his health under control. That change from the first to second photo was shocking.