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WWYD about a saddle for this horse?

How do you know if a horse needs short points for their back or not?

I would just like to add a caution to this. Changing the width of the front doesn’t necessarily mean the overall shape will stay the same, especially if you change 2 sizes up or down. It can work better on some models/brands than others. I don’t intend this to mean it didn’t work for you, I just wanted to put that caveat out there in case someone else who doesn’t really understand saddle fit well, doesn’t think they can just buy wide and size down 2 and have it still be the 'same" saddle.

Personally, I think it’s much easier, and cheaper, and faster, to size a saddle to a horse’s heaviest healthy weight (ie don’t size it to an obese weight), and then if/when he loses weight due to going into (heavier) work, you can use a thicker pad, or shims, to fill in. If he gains muscle, the shims can be moved around, or use thinner ones, or just remove them.

That way there’s no having a fitter come out, or sending the saddle off, for width changes, and shims allow as close to a custom fit as you can get without a total re-flocking.

Lots of big wide Warmbloods and Baroque breeds.

Even then, many of the brands that have these wide trees, also come fairly wide in the CC models. But the brands that are all or almost all about CC saddles, no, they don’t tend to get as wide as brands that do both to a fairly equal extent

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Are you doing this via a tree press? My fitter will only adjust the tree ONE time, one size. She says every time the tree is adjusted it is stressed and weakened. Technically, you are adjusting 2 tree sizes if you eventually go from a wide to a medium (from an original MW). That sounds iffy to me. (I am an accountant, not a saddle fitter, but I try so hard to educate myself on these things)

And I am talking fixed treed saddles (I think that is what they are called?). There are saddles with the swapable gullets (Thorowgood/K&M/Fairfax, Pessoa XChange, Wintec) and adjustability (The Genisis system I think). But even my fitter cautions: these are not changes to swap between horses several times a day. Rather consignment barns, large lesson barns that may turn over their lesson horses often, and horses that we know are going to fill out or change over time (young, out of shape, new discipline).

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Typically, the lower the wither the shorted the points. However the topline can be deceiving. The tough part is know what is a short tree point and which models have them.

Spanish horses are really tricky sometimes to fit. It is really hard to find a saddle that they are really comfortable in for optimum performance. They come in all the different back shapes They tend to be very mobile in their backs and throws their saddle around. My poor sister can tell you all about it and her horse is one my my toughest horses to fit.

I am going to start another thread on hoop trees and Spanish type horses to answer some of the questions. I don’t want to derail this thread from the original topic.

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My fitter had a two adjustment rule. There’s only so much you want to do to the tree. Flocking adjustments can help about 1/2 a tree size (IME).

What I do is ride treeless on my mare when she gets “fluffy” until she fits into her treed saddles again.

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Are you doing this via a tree press? My fitter will only adjust the tree ONE time, one size. She says every time the tree is adjusted it is stressed and weakened. Technically, you are adjusting 2 tree sizes if you eventually go from a wide to a medium (from an original MW).

Yes, with a tree press. Different saddle brands differ in how much tolerance they have for adjustments. The SMS recommends a maximum of two adjustments in a saddles lifetime as a general rule, however some manufacturers have tested their own products and confirmed that they are durable with more. For example, Harry Dabbs saddles have been adjusted over 30 times without an issue AND they offer a lifetime warranty on the tree which is not voided by tree adjustments so there is little risk.
In some brands, yes, going from Wide to Medium is two sizes, other brands do not recognize MW as a size so one size narrower than Wide is Medium.

Antares AO tree is 5”. A AO2 is 5.5. My horse is pretty broad in the shoulder and the AO fits him great. I have that tree size in both my jumping and dressage saddle.

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I had my friend send me the codes on her wide Antares that was too narrow for him and it’s marked AO so I must need the AO1 or AO2.

He’s losing weight already, though!

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My Antares jumping saddle is a 2003 model, so maybe the codes have changed a bit since then.

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UPDATE: My tank of a horse has slimmed down so much that my saddle fits him now! I’ll have the Voltaire rep come by to check the fit, because he does have huge shoulders and may need less foam there, but it fit him reasonably well, he moved well in it, and best of all, I am able to sit his canter and trot in it.

:boom: :dancer: :champagne: :tada: :confetti_ball:

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And my saddle has the Voltaire rep’s blessing! :pray:t3:

However, I need a little lift in the back for balance, but I should have something around that would do that.

I’m just so relieved that I don’t need to shell out for a new saddle.

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If the Voltaire is no longer an option or you need a back up plan, my VERY similarly shaped horse is very happy in the Prestige Paris Classic in a 35-36 cm width, with the bonus that I can open or close the tree if needed to accommodate weight and muscle gain/loss. :slight_smile:

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Thank you! So good to have that information! :grin: