XXW jumps saddles

[CHT]

Looking for brands of saddles to keep an eye out for that are XXW (thinking 38 cm?) for a flat backed Arabian with big shoulders. Hoping to find something under $2000 (used is great), as I will eventually also be needing a dressage saddle for her and I really didn’t plan on needing a new saddle so soon!

Was formerly in a 34cm Duett Allegro, but it is too narrow, and the saddle fitter doesn’t think he can make it wide enough to fit.

Someone mentioned Kent & Masters as possibly suitable for a dressage…does anyone know how their jumping saddles fit? I like that the billets are moveable, it is reflockable, and uses changeable gullets.

[Ceylon_Star]

What about looking for a used Black Country or County with a hoop tree?

I’ve also had luck with Bates/Wintec’s Wide range. The 2nd widest (it’s either an XXW or XXXW, I’ve gotten mixed responses about which it actually is) fits my tabletop cob nicely. I like the shape of the Bates saddles better, they don’t have as wide of a twist.

The other one that was suggested to me was UK-based Fairfax Saddlery. Apparently their XW/XXW is super wide, which would make sense since the UK has a lot of broad-built cobs and cob types.

Good luck, and I feel your pain! I actually was forced to go with an AP type for jumping (an oooollllddddd Collegiate Event) for my guy because I was having a helluva time finding a CC with points that didn’t interfere with his shoulders. He’s easy to fit a dressage saddle to with the more vertical points, but anything too forward just will NOT work for him. I guess I should be glad that he has no withers to make it even more interesting to find something for him?

[soloudinhere]

My wide horse (welsh/Connemara/QH x) goes in a Black Country Ricochet on the Wide hoop tree (so I guess technically it’s a ricochet x).

Before that he wore a Fairfax AP saddle which is really a CC saddle. That one’s for sale. It fit him fine but he loves his black country so much it’s not worth keeping. He went in the W/XW (orange) gullet and when really fat, the XW (white) gullet. There were 2 sizes available above that. I really need to get on listing this thing, I keep forgetting.

[JB]

Assuming you need a hoop tree, or hoop tree-like saddle, then the Black Country Quantum X is a hoop tree, and you can get it XW (which might be all you need given the shape), or XXW.

Prestige is not a hoop tree, but it’s shaped more like one than a typical A-frame. County is as well. New, those are a lot more than your budget, but used might be doable. The trouble will be finding the #5 County, or the 36+ Prestige.

Why not a wider Duett? Not making that 34 wider, but a whole different saddle.

[OveroHunter]

You’re pretty limited to Black Country and County from what I have found. My gelding measured somewhere between XW and XXW and his Black Country Ricochet fits very well.

ETA: It has taken me awhile to get used to a wider twist. I still get sore in my thighs from that saddle if I haven’t ridden in it in awhile. My mare is much more narrow and her saddle is so much more comfortable to ride in.

[JB]

Do you have a picture of the 34cm Duett on her - no pad, girthed up? It would help to know if it’s the right shape but just too narrow, or not quite the right shape.

I briefly had a Black Country Quantum X XXW for my WB, and it fit nicely. I demoed a #5 County and it was a wee bit snug but the overall shape was correct - needed just a bit wider.

What also fits him very nicely is a 39cm Prestige (his current saddle). So you’re not limited to just the hoop trees. That’s what I meant by some other saddles - County, Prestige, probably a few others - being able to fit some of these horses as well.

[horsepoor]

I’m also one to suggest the Black Country hoop, or “freedom” tree. I had a BC Quantum X in XW for my flat backed warmblood with huge shoulders and it was a good fit for him. When you go to the super wide trees like that, there is no avoiding it feeling wide for the rider, which takes some getting used to. County does not, to my knowledge, do a hoop type tree. The Innovation is a bit closer to hoop-like than the Stabilizer, but wasn’t as good a fit for my flat guy as the BC.

[jaybird660]

It really depends on whether you need that size in a hoop tree or more of a hybrid or A shaped tree. BC’s hoop trees can be ordered in that size but finding wider than xw is a lot more challenging. They can be widened a size though. The Kent and Masters Jump and Thorowgood jump saddles are not going to fit like the rounder pommel arch of the BC hoop trees. Duett makes wider than 34 so that is also a thought.
If you just need a very wide tree with flatter panels, they are easier to find used. I would just make sure the gullet channel is suitably wide and that the panels are flat enough laterally so as not to dig into the outer edges of the back.

[CHT]

I would consider a wider Duett, I just find it to be a slippery saddle…particularly if I don’t have full seat breeches on! I don’t have a picture of it on her without the pads, but the saddle guy who was going to widen it did think it was the right general shape, just much too narrow.

Trying to find an independent fitter locally, but the ones I have talked to have a limited number of saddles they seem to represent, so I want to get a feel for good options.

[Brutus614]

Have you looked into the Albion brand at all? I had a [stupid wide] jump saddle for them for a Halter-Bred QH.

[Posting_Trot]

Balance saddles are quite wide: http://www.balanceinternational.com/The-BALANCE-Saddles_B23RS7.aspx

[CHT]

This is proving harder than I thought. Rugbygirl brought over her Clydesdale’s saddle to try on her (Scheese)…but too narrow and just not the right shape. I think it was a V tree, while Dani definitely needs a hoop tree, as her barrel just isn’t that wide as compared to her shoulders.

Local shop had a wide saddle, but again, too narrow at the tips of the three, but then gets too wide as you go down the flaps.

I know part of the issue is that I want to stay under $2000 but I just have an issue spending more than that on a saddle I doubt will still fit her in a year.

Saddle fitter out east has a demo Kent and Masters, so I sent her the tracings of my mare…really hoping it is a match. Also posted on the Arabian groups on facebook.

Also waiting to hear back from Nancy/Duett…thinking she is away maybe?

Not sure where else to search.

There is a saddle shop in BC that sells a “flex tree jumping saddle” with changeable gullets. Its their answer to something close to treeless, but suitable for jumping. Leary, but maybe worth considering? I found them while looking for a bareback pad.

[alto]

Take note of the 20% restocking fee + shipping (makes it tough to have 3 saddles sent out to sort out the 1 that will fit).

I spoke with Nancy a couple years ago, she refused to send any trial saddles into Canada, suggested I work with a local shop - when I explained there were none selling Duetts, she remained unimpressed … hopefully you have better luck.

Can you get County & Black Country fitter’s out for demos so you can suss out what if anything will fit, then look at used …

(FP of the wide shoulder (and straight back) does best with County)

Local shop had a wide saddle, but again, too narrow at the tips of the three, but then gets too wide as you go down the flaps.

This was actually much the problem with FP at 3 1/2 - 4 1/2, his shoulder needed a W, but the rest of him just needed a M or MW tree …
at 5 we finally ordered a customized W County Stabilizer, initially it was slightly “over-flocked” which was “reduced” as he matured (no apparent stretching of the leather etc - panels look pristine).

With the clarity of hindsight, I wish we’d started this horse in a made-to-order saddle at 4, we had major issues develop as horse decided that his right shoulder didn’t have enough room in the used saddle which was supposed to take us through to 5 … he never palpated sore, vets/ trainers/fitters all judged the saddle fit to be fine … finally, at a loss for better ideas, I insisted we just start doing saddle demos … rep put on the Stabilzer and … new horse!
Of course he’s not that simple, it took a fair bit of time for him to trust the saddle again.

Most horses are not as sensitive (or suspicious) as FP, but do watch (I would’ve saved a lot of money and angst just buying that custom saddle at 4, then replacing the tree or saddle as needed): of course we all thought we were paying attention.

[CHT]

I emailed a somewhat local Black County saddle fitter. Will see what they say.

I know what you mean about saddle issues. My gelding was like that, and I wasted a lot of time before finally getting a custom Frank Baines! This mare is less picky, and I think has a lot more changing to do, so hoping I can make do with an “off the shelf” jumping saddle for now, before splurging on a custom saddle.

[Ceylon_Star]

The BC based Rocky Creek Hill flex tree jump saddles are great but the points seemed a bit narrow for the gullet size when I tried one on my guy. The forward angle didn’t help either. That said, lovely saddle for the price and great company to deal with!

[ZELLA]

Thornhill is another brand to check out.

[CHT]

[QUOTE=ZELLA;7793972]
Thornhill is another brand to check out.[/QUOTE]

Are they hoop trees? The interchangeable gullets looked did not look like they are. It is unfortunate we don’t have much for saddle dealers in my area. So many brands I have never seen.

[Punkie]

Smith Worthington custom made a XXXW jump saddle for my witherless large pony back in the late 90s. I sold the saddle recently, but it held up incredibly, was gorgeous, and fit her like a glove! They will make practically anything, so if it’s in your budget, check them out!

[alto]

Yes talk with SW, they did have a Canadian rep in Sask (Regina area maybe) - at any rate, they were willing to look through their demo & discount stocks, then adjust the tree & panels based upon back tracings … I ended up not following through as we realized that a saddle that fits according to human code was not working with this particular horse so I wanted a local rep.

The downside to SW sadldes is that they are not “hot” resales - now make it a wide hoop tree, and you’re better off with short term investments in County & Black Country saddles.

You might be able to find an Antares/CWD to fit (which are easier resale) BUT it would likely need to be customized so you’re unlikely to get it at your price AND your resale market is still going to be very narrow.

Talk to Liz Weir (Bahr Saddlery, I think) about Prestige - we chatted a number of times, but she concluded that she really had nothing she believed was going to fit well enough to justify shipping out.

ETA check with Cordia Pearson re the Thornhills (though I’m sceptical).

You might also chat with Ann at Equestrian Imports re Vega & Amerigo as those trees can be widened/narrowed … they certainly came closer to fitting FP than any Prestige.

In this line, we did get an Equipe adjusted to fit (through Equi -Products, I’m not sure what they’re doing these days, they were indifferent when I visited their booth at Thunderbird the last few times), again it was fine per human standards, just a complete fail by horse standards.

[CHT]

Emailed the SW dealer in Saskatchewan. Thanks for the idea. Looking at the SW pictures though, it doesn’t look like the panels will be flat enough, but perhaps they can alter that?

The shape of the Prestige saddle tree will not fit this horse. Vega are way out of my price range, as I am sure would be Antares/CWD and Equipe.

Surprised there aren’t more used XW saddles for sale.