So as detailed in my ongoing thread over on the HJ side of things, I just found out, 4 days before the three month anniversary of me getting my first horse, that she has Kissing Spine. I’m pretty crushed and could really use some success stories so I have something to look at when I start to feel hopeless as I am prone to both awfulizing and fatalism. Thanks, gang.
2 Likes
Tons of success stories on this FB group, it was really helpful to read through when my horse was diagnosed with kissing spine. There is a lot you can do for it!
3 Likes
This is very helpful. If your horse does need surgery, Dr Honnas is amazing. https://youtu.be/FqdIYrtt6DU
Edited to add that my horse is going well and seems pain free now after surgery.
Step 1 is to make sure there are no other underlying issues. KS is not always clinically relevant, and if it “is,” make sure the back pain is not secondary to something else like NPA, PSD, or stifle pain. Don’t ask me how I know lol.
That being said, if your horse’s back hurts, you have to treat that, but don’t assume the back pain results from KS, even if you see them on radiographs. Lots of other things can cause back pain.
Welcome to the journey, you can learn a lot and there are success stories!
5 Likes
KS is not a death sentence. A lot of times it’s a secondary/compensatory issue to something else. My horse has a few points of true impingement and then some questionable touching (bony remodeling but no contact on X-ray). His symptoms were relatively mild compared to your horse but still significant enough to be concerned. We did injections and Ophos, no dice. Surgery is not an option for him because I’m not comfortable putting him through it.
Over the years we injected almost every joint he has, tried various shoeing changes, chiro, meds, with mixed results. What fixed the issue? Frog support pads. NPA/caudal failure are the root of a LOT of issues and until recently was overlooked or just not known about by the general owner population. In 24 hours, all of his odd anxieties/stresses disappeared. All of his tension/anxiety/guarding/hotness under saddle was gone. A good resource for learning about this is the FB page “Progressive Equine Services and Hoof Care Centre.”
So my advice is to not panic/be doom and gloom and investigate the cause of her problems before jumping into surgery. If she were mine I’d be starting with her feet. There is a LOT that can be done more conservatively to help KS as well.
5 Likes
That is really interesting.
In another thread, OP mentions their horse is also pretty footsore. And the KS is mild. I would start with the feet. And continue with behavioral work you are doing. You can’t rehab the back until these issues are addressed. You may not know right now how much of the behavior is actually from the KS and not the feet. With mild sclerosis and closeness in the dorsal spinous processes, initial pain management might include injections and shockwave. Working on correct carriage and core strength will help. But you can’t do that with sore feet.
9 Likes
I would caution any owner with a KS diagnosis to be sure they’ve investigated all other contributing potential factors- I’ve heard a lot of anecdotes of people doing KS surgery and rehab only to find it did not fix the problem; it was actually the feet/SI injury/neck causing the horse to carry itself poorly.
However, there are also stories of the bone shave surgery being a godsend. What I haven’t seen is a lot of horses remaining sound long term following surgery. I’d really like to see more stories of people who did the procedure years ago - I don’t have sources but I can remember reading that the lig snip hasn’t shown long lasting results? I’d have to google.
I’m following this thread hoping some people with post surgery horses will chime in. Kissing spine isn’t a career ending issue for some. It’s a constant maintenance thing, though, IME.
6 Likes
I did the bone shave surgery on my gelding just about 4 years ago and he came back performing at a higher level than before the surgery. He requires other “normal” maintenance that isn’t unusual for a horse of his age (early teens) on his second career (raced 24 times) - mainly annual hock injections.
After he rehabbed from surgery I haven’t found that he needs any particular extra ongoing rehab work, but I do aim to ride and work him appropriately over his back. It’s easier for him to carry himself correctly now that the pain is gone.
My surgeon stopped doing lig snip years ago because of the relapse rate. I tell people that for my particular horse, surgery was the best thing I ever did for him. But you need to understand each particular case and what other factors may be in play.
4 Likes
My mare had the DSP shave done by Honnas before I purchased her with a relatively clean PPE (surgery considered), and about 6 months after I brought her home, she was still struggling at the lope. She was later diagnosed with chronic desmopathy of the SI ligaments and that vet believed the KS diagnosis was possibly chasing those symptoms. Time off and rehab back after the surgery had allowed the SI inflammation to subside, but the issues still existed once I had her back in hard work. She’s still gaining strength since the SI rehab, so I can’t say how she will do in the long run.
She doesn’t seem to have any setbacks because of the surgery. Texas Equine was patient with my questions during the PPE and I’d even contacted them after and they were kind enough to advise.
ETA, I had a vet say that the rads showing minimal DSP space depend a lot on how the horse is conditioned or postured at the time of the imaging - so that alone isn’t necesarily a smoking gun.
3 Likes
I’ve had two; one has been sold, the other I still have currently.
I will say up front that I agree with the other posters that you need to get her foot soreness fixed first. KS requires work, some physical exertion, and the ability to use themselves. This won’t happen with sore feet. I would also make for damn sure her hocks are good. They can’t use their core without good hocks…
First one was a horse I sold as a low level hunter. Kid rode him inverted and hollow, caught him in the mouth after every jump, sat hard on his back mid-jump, jumped unsupervised, etc. Horse had 5 or 6 over-riding processes with lesions, was understandably violet under saddle. I was asked to take him back. He was horribly under-muscled from how he was ridden and lack of turn out.
I threw him out in a pasture on a hill for a year and didn’t touch him because I had to deploy shortly after getting him back. I came home to find a sound, pleasant, and well muscled (albeit pasture condition) little horse. I started slowly legging him up, making sure to ride him low and round. He was lazy and preferred to plod around with poor posture. He required a very attentive ride to keep his back up, but he never bucked again for me. I admittedly never had X-rays done again, but rode the horse that I had each time I got him out. I was able to sell him, with full disclosure, to someone who had a great deal of experience with KS. She then placed him in an upper level lesson program and he is still trucking around as a 2’6" eq master. Though he does make it known if kids sit down on him too hard or at the wrong time. So he went from severe and deemed to never be suitable for jumping again (without dedicated intervention) to maintaining a competitive and useful career.
Current horse has mild KS, no touching, just a closeness of a couple processes. He came to me as practically a rescue case, malnourished at a young age, and ridden in to the ground too soon for his growth pattern and size. His hocks were trashed and required tarsal arthrodesis at age 5; they were trashed when he came in to my life as an early 3 yo, but took some time to diagnose and attempted to let him fuse naturally. So it’s hard to tell what came first; the KS, or the fusing hocks. But I do know that he couldn’t go in an appropriate long low frame and use his core to lift his back with the state that his hocks were in. He had some back tension before surgery. Once he went back to work after hock fusion, the tension in his back was gone. So I don’t foresee having back issues with him at this time.
Since you mention insurance concerns, you don’t exactly have time to do the “kick out to pasture” method. But I can assure you that proper work will help. But I also assure you that the horse will not be able to work properly if her feet and other joints aren’t good…
4 Likes
This is how I was told my horse was ridden before I got her. She showed some closeness on her back X-rays and was also footsore. I decided to focus on fixing her feet first, coupled with correct work as her foot comfort allows. It’s been a long ongoing road (and full of potholes) but I can absolutely see we’ve made big improvements.
OP I know it’s not what you hoped for for your first experience of horse ownership. I look at it this way, we have plans for our horses but sometimes they have plans for us. My current one is giving me an education in feet. And making me a softer, more tactful rider. I’ve found for me it’s best to embrace the journey they present us and make the best of it.
2 Likes
You’re not kidding. The first one I had was to be a stallion prospect. Obviously not the case.
The second one has been to hell and back. It’s taken three years and I still have yet to show him (hopefully next month, fingers crossed). But he’ll never jump. Fused hocks, a chip in a fetlock, a spur in a pastern, KS, a mild club foot, an arthritic/remodeled knee, and who knows what else. He’s sound for the flat and such a happy horse who tries so incredibly hard. It’s heartbreaking because he loves jumping. But his knee won’t allow it. I knew when I took him on that he would be a project, but man it’s been a dumpster fire of a situation. I now have a flat eq horse. I didn’t want a flat eq horse. But I won’t let him end up somewhere bad again.
1 Like
My now 8 year old OTTB has severe KS. I got him when he was 4 and he was diagnosed a few months after I got him. He was a little off in the hind, vaguely, so I had him seen. He is not a candidate for surgery.
He is now going well as an Eventer. We have gone Modified and are hoping to go Prelim/2* in the next couple seasons. He was Area II Training horse of the year in 2022.
I ride him in equibands to strengthen his core, and virtually all his work is connected and through (ie never inverted or hollow, thankfully this is easy for him!). He gets mesotherapy and is shockwaved about once a quarter. He gets adjusted by a chiropracter a little more often than that. Twice a year he is seen by my vet to evaluate his soundness and receives whatever she recommends. In February she said he back felt great and, if she didn’t know him, wouldn’t recommend any back treatment.
Mind you, much of the above treatment I do for ANY of my competition horses- the chiro as needed, the twice a year vet visits, etc. But through all of this he is just the most athletic fantastic horse. My vet says she treats some 4* and 5* event horses that have TERRIBLE back radiographs and go just fine with maintenance (as any upper level event horse needs)!
Another note- out of curiosity I had my vet radiograph my former upper level horse’s back. He completed multiple 2* events and dozens and dozens of clean Prelim runs. He has mild KS, too, and I never knew and he had a great career with no back therapy. Many many KS horses are not clinical. Like the others said, treat the obvious stuff first!
3 Likes
