A message to the Halt Police of COTH

[Ambrey]

@Siswai;3460780

Yes, “bobbles” aren’t supposed to be penalized unless they disrupt the movement in a way that violates the rules, but they can also lower the submission score (I thought). Wasn’t SPs score for his one-tempis docked because of Ravel’s tiny kick, even though it didn’t alter the movement in any other way? (Or was that just a BB rumor?)

I think the problem is judges slamming one competitor and then letting it slide for another (Anky’s failure to halt, for example)?

Exactly, the problem isn’t with the overall concept but with uneven application.

If they were marking down for bobbles, it seems like a hissy fit would be a big one. But they are marking some riders down for some bobbles, letting others slide, etc.

It’s basically what everyone has been saying for so long (that they turn the other way when their favorites mess up), but finally got some public exposure. You’d think they would have understood that doing such things while in the olympic fishbowl would mess up their little system, but clearly they thought they were above reproach.

[mickeydoodle]

I liked the pink horse, looked like a sturdy guy, but everything was a little frantic in his test I thought.

That reporter for the Guardian (isn’t that a tabloid?) thinks it is ok to make horses run fast or jump high? How come?

[STF]

@Equibrit;3459688

Unfortunately Feo does not help Anky’s case at all.
Why does he afford himself bragging rights. Did he once lick her boots?

I thought he was the one she paid 80K to for her fresstyle configuration??? He IS the best, he is not?

[Coreene]

@STF;3462725

I thought he was the one she paid 80K to for her fresstyle configuration??? He IS the best, he is not?

Wibi Sjoeradi did her music.

[STF]

I was being extreamly sarcastic.

[Coreene]

@STF;3462733

I was being extreamly sarcastic.

No, really? :lol: But in the meantime, people would be stupid enough to read it and believe it is so, hence pointing out who the correct person was.

[grayarabpony]

I need to see this pink horse everybody is talking about.

[Minaret]

[QUOTE=grayarabpony;3462851]
I need to see this pink horse everybody is talking about.[/QUOTE]

Not the best quality of video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5nCBAks6WY

[Mardi]

@TeddyRocks;3459656

Some horses just can’t halt, and I’ve complained about Salinero’s halt and Anky’s lack of salute. BUT IMHO, in any dressage test… it is just one movement, one score, then it factors into the test…

As you said, the halt is just one movement out of many. So let’s choose another for a moment. Like the canter half-pass. Let’s say Salinero can’t do them. He’s too hot, and can’t manage them. Sometimes his rider makes a half-hearted attempt to do them, and other times, there’s no attempt at all. In any case, the horse just doesn’t do canter half-passes so they are left out of his test. But everything is else is great. Now what do we say ?

Seriously though, IMHO the halt and salute, ESPECIALLY the final halt and salute have more meaning than some of the other movements. Not only does it demonstrate that the horse still has brakes and submission after all that forward work, but the final halt and salute is a sign of respect to the judges, no matter what show. That is the one of the backbones of equestrian sports !

Sadly for international level dressage, Anky’s purposeful omission of the final halt/salute in her test tells me that she knew there would be no negative consequences for her decision.

Later on she admitted it herself, when she said that she knew she had already won the gold, and so didn’t bother to complete the final and required movement of her test.

As the saying goes: Sports don’t make character, they reveal it.

Yes, she is an excellent rider ! But as sportswoman, with all due respect to the gold medal winner, she lags behind.

[InsideLeg2OutsideRei]

[QUOTE=J Swan;3458793]
Plus, a good halt is necessary to be able to sip from one’s flask without spilling. :D[/QUOTE]

:lol: best reason for a good halt I’ve heard all day! :yes:

[Mardi]

That’s why there are TWO halts !

[grayarabs]

Whitewolf - agree with you totally. I would hate for someone whom has never seen dressage to see her and think that is what it is all about. Where are the very basics of the training scale? Relaxation? Doing as if of own accord? I feel so sorry for that horse. I wonder what he would be like under a different training style/rider?
I don’t like how AvG trains nor how she rides. I still cannot believe that all the judges are so bowled over by her. I will never get it. She is so far from my idea/ideal of dressage.
Will she continue competing Salinero? Possibly sell him? Wonder what he would be worth and who would possibly buy him? I think AvG’s true calling would have been in Saddlebreds and saddleseat. I can sooooooo see her there - and I mean that in a good way. For dressage - it breaks my heart. It truly does.

[Coreene]

@Mardi;3462903

Later on she admitted it herself, when she said that she knew she had already won the gold, and so didn’t bother to complete the final and required movement of her test.

I’d love to see that in Dutch. Because what she said was “Ik ben helemaal vergeten af te groeten naar de jury,” which translated means “I completely forgot to salute the judges.”

[grayarabpony]

[QUOTE=grayarabs;3462923]
Whitewolf - agree with you totally. I would hate for someone whom has never seen dressage to see her and think that is what it is all about. Where are the very basics of the training scale? Relaxation? Doing as if of own accord? I feel so sorry for that horse. I wonder what he would be like under a different training style/rider?
I don’t like how AvG trains nor how she rides. I still cannot believe that all the judges are so bowled over by her. I will never get it. She is so far from my idea/ideal of dressage.
Will she continue competing Salinero? Possibly sell him? Wonder what he would be worth and who would possibly buy him? I think AvG’s true calling would have been in Saddlebreds and saddleseat. I can sooooooo see her there - and I mean that in a good way. For dressage - it breaks my heart. It truly does.[/QUOTE]

:lol:

Salinero is improved over the last Games, which was a joke, but he always looks tense.

[grayarabpony]

Thanks for the link Minaret.

[Graymaresrule]

@BLBGP;3459279

So someone else posted that not saluting the judges at the beginning and end = elimination. Did they make that up?

I haven’t read all the thread so perhaps someone else has answered. I have a PDF of the FEI rules and on page 56 it says that the halt and salute at the beginning and end are compulsory but does not specify the penalty for not performing them.

The judges would have needed binoculars to see the halt at the beginning which on my 50+ inch flat screen looked quite crooked and no where near 5 seconds. Both halts are supposed to be averaged for mark #16. Darned if I can figure that one out.

[grayarabs]

A lot of those horses are “hot” and were scared. But didn’t they all halt where required?
Surely there has to be a way to get a nice halt out of Salinero at the end of the tests.
Is one of the explanations for his lack of halting is his anticipation of the crowd cheering?
So that would be considered a “conditioned response”. Ooh - maybe Anky needs to do a little clicker training!!! Well at least come up with some way for him to be rewarded for halting - make it pleasurable for him. Not only for scores etc but for his brain - a kind of cue to relax.
Also I am remembering reading last year all the discussion about “happy” horses.
What happened with that? Wasn’t that going to be a big deal? In HK - which horses appeared happy to be doing the work - and which ones obviously not?

[Mardi]

[QUOTE=Coreene;3462976]
I’d love to see that in Dutch. Because what she said was “Ik ben helemaal vergeten af te groeten naar de jury,” which translated means “I completely forgot to salute the judges.”[/QUOTE]

OK, fair enough. I was not aware that she said that. It wasn’t included in the Anky quote that was posted earlier.

However, from what I understood from the same quote, she purposely omitted the halt, because she knew she had won.

Is that correct ?

[dressagetraks]

[QUOTE=KSevnter;3459402]

Edited to Add: The FEI Rules
Article 430

10. Salute.
    Competitors must take the reins in one hand at the salute.

11. Beginning/End of test.
    A test begins with the entry at A and ends after
    the salute at the end of the test, as soon as the horse moves forward.

12. Leaving arena during competition.
    A horse leaving the arena
    completely, with all four feet, during a dressage competition between the time
    of entry and the time of exit at A, will be eliminated.

13. Details to the Freestyle Test
    At the beginning and end of a Freestyle Test a halt for the salute is
    compulsory. The test time will start after the rider moves forward after the
    halt.

Reading the rules together, she should have been eliminated. A halt “for the salute” is compulsory in the freestyle at the end of the test. The test does not end until “after” the final salute, so technically she did not finish her test because she never saluted. And of course, “A horse leaving the arena completely, with all four feet, during a dressage competition between the time of entry and the time of exit at A, will be eliminated.”[/QUOTE]

Here is the FEI definition of a salute, which Anky clearly (and by her own admission) did not do. Thus the test, clearly defined as ending when the horse moves forward after the salute, did not in fact end. Thus Anky, leaving the ring at A, left the ring before the test was over. Nearest equivalent I can think of in other sports is failing to touch home plate in your base running after hitting a home run. Sorry, if that is defined as the end of your base running (test), no matter why you didn’t touch home plate (excited, just “forgot,” whatever), you did not officially end your lap of the bases.

The paragraph where she knew she had already won and decided regarding the final movement, “Oh, he doesn’t really have to do this,” is from COTH own dressage coverage, link on COTH homepage.

Waving at the audience is not a salute to the judges.

And I still think saying, “Oh, he doesn’t really have to do this,” has no place in the concept of dressage training.

[Sabine]

why is it that ANY Anky thread immediately attracts the most sour, bitter, rejected- but know-it-all arm chair dressage queens???

Could it be that she is really just the total opposite of those folks…pretty, succesful, competent, wealthy, genuine and HUMAN!

Be it that she forgot to salute, Sal didn’t stand still for 10 minutes, she didn’t do 100 flying changes in the victory round, she held too much, she leaned back too much, she creates tension in the horse, the horse is ALWAYS tense, etc…its all really bad and she won the gold and we are dressage riders and now we are all so very distraught about it…complete insanity-if you ask me!