A message to the Halt Police of COTH

[Coreene]

@Mardi;3463037

OK, fair enough. I was not aware that she said that. It wasn’t included in the Anky quote that was posted earlier.

However, from what I understood from the same quote, she purposely omitted the halt, because she knew she had won.

Is that correct ?

No, absolutely not. She said "Toen ik de ring ik reed viel er toch wel spanning van me af. Toen wist ik dat ik het kon. Ik ben helemaal vergeten af te groeten naar de jury. Ik zat al te juichen op mijn paard. Ik dacht, ja hoor, het is binnen.’’ Which translates to “When I rode into the ring, the stress dropped. Then I understand that I could do it. I completely forgot to salute the jury at the end. I was already crying with joy. I thought, yes, that should do it.”

Forgetting is different from intentional, ya know?

And if Debbie had medaled with the same halt, she would have been elevated to sainthood. Same with Isabell, same with Steffen, etc.

[Coral]

@Coreene;3463082

No, absolutely not. She said "Toen ik de ring ik reed viel er toch wel spanning van me af. Toen wist ik dat ik het kon. Ik ben helemaal vergeten af te groeten naar de jury. Ik zat al te juichen op mijn paard. Ik dacht, ja hoor, het is binnen.’’ Which translates to “When I rode into the ring, the stress dropped. Then I understand that I could do it. I completely forgot to salute the jury at the end. I was already crying with joy. I thought, yes, that should do it.”

Translation really makes all the difference, huh? Subtle nuances turn an innocent statement of excitement into an arrogant statement of challenge.

[Coreene]

@Coral;3463093

Translation really makes all the difference, huh? Subtle nuances turn an innocent statement of excitement into an arrogant statement of challenge.

Which is why I asked where she had said she had left it out intentionally. Because in every Dutch paper I read and interviews I saw online (in Dutch), she never said she left it out intentionally.

http://www.brabantsdagblad.nl/sport/peking/3585816/Anky-van-Grunsven-gelukkig-en-opgelucht.ece

[dressagetraks]

No, actually, if Isabell, or Debbie, or Steffen, or Nicole Uphoff, or Reiner Klimke totally failed to salute for whatever reason (including forgetfulness) at the end of a test, I would also feel equally that they had shown disrespect to the judges and believe that they also merited disqualification, since that is the defined end point of the test.

To take it further, if I myself ever fail to salute at the end of a test all the way from training level clear up through Olympics for whatever reason, including incredible joy at winning a gold medal, I believe that I should be disqualified.

And if I ever do make it to the Olympics, COTH is welcome to hold me to that. Or to a regional championship, or to any show whatsoever, including schooling shows, at any level at which I show.

My objection is based on a rule and also, as Mardi said, on the reasoning and respect behind that rule. You should always show respect to the judges, whether you agree with them or not, whether you are too excited, too stressed out, or already know you won. It doesn’t matter your emotional state. You should always end a test by saluting the judges. And the rule book agrees with that statement.

[grayarabpony]

[QUOTE=Sabine;3463060]
why is it that ANY Anky thread immediately attracts the most sour, bitter, rejected- but know-it-all arm chair dressage queens???

Could it be that she is really just the total opposite of those folks…pretty, succesful, competent, wealthy, genuine and HUMAN!

Be it that she forgot to salute, Sal didn’t stand still for 10 minutes, she didn’t do 100 flying changes in the victory round, she held too much, she leaned back too much, she creates tension in the horse, the horse is ALWAYS tense, etc…its all really bad and she won the gold and we are dressage riders and now we are all so very distraught about it…complete insanity-if you ask me![/QUOTE]

This is the second time I’ve described one of your posts this way: What a bitchy post. So you’re saying that everyone who didn’t like Anky tests are ugly, unsuccessful, incompetent, poor, false and alien? :lol:

It could just be that some think Salinero looks tense because he IS tense.

If you don’t like that opinion, fine. But I am sick of people on this board who attack others who don’t agree with them.

[Ambrey]

@Coreene;3463082

And if Debbie had medaled with the same halt, she would have been elevated to sainthood. Same with Isabell, same with Steffen, etc.

But Anky never does a clean halt at the end.

Which begs the question… why are we still surprised when she wins without a halt? Obviously the only people who care about the halt are here posting, not sitting in judge’s booths.

No, if Isabell had won with the hissy fit AND no halt, there would have been MASS HYSTERIA!

[Coreene]

@Ambrey;3463298

But Anky never does a clean halt at the end.

Well, that’s a big sweeping generalization. She does show more than one horse. Sallie doesn’t always have a fab halt, but “never” is also not true.

[freestyle2music]

[QUOTE=Ambrey;3463298]
But Anky never does a clean halt at the end.

Which begs the question… why are we still surprised when she wins without a halt? Obviously the only people who care about the halt are here posting, not sitting in judge’s booths.

No, if Isabell had won with the hissy fit AND no halt, there would have been MASS HYSTERIA![/QUOTE]

First: The halt in the freestyle never had a mark untill the rules (on request of the Germans) were changed a few years ago. Second: Anky scored very high marks for her initial halt at the beginning of the test. Third: It wasn’t difficult to see that Anky already scored much higher than Isabell did.

I remember a guy from the Bahamas (?) running backwards at the last 10 meters of the 100 meters during the athletics.

[Equibrit]

Maybe [Theo] can come up with a freestyle to Judy Garland show tunes for Anky, and she can mysteriously get Sadinero to halt. They will live happily ever after in Never Never land and we can all prostrate ourselves on the altar of “Show Dressage”.

It’s such an honour to just take part!

K?

[freestyle2music]

[QUOTE=dressagetraks;3463184]
No, actually, if Isabell, or Debbie, or Steffen, or Nicole Uphoff, or Reiner Klimke totally failed to salute for whatever reason (including forgetfulness) at the end of a test, I would also feel equally that they had shown disrespect to the judges and believe that they also merited disqualification, since that is the defined end point of the test.

To take it further, if I myself ever fail to salute at the end of a test all the way from training level clear up through Olympics for whatever reason, including incredible joy at winning a gold medal, I believe that I should be disqualified.

And if I ever do make it to the Olympics, COTH is welcome to hold me to that. Or to a regional championship, or to any show whatsoever, including schooling shows, at any level at which I show.

My objection is based on a rule and also, as Mardi said, on the reasoning and respect behind that rule. You should always show respect to the judges, whether you agree with them or not, whether you are too excited, too stressed out, or already know you won. It doesn’t matter your emotional state. You should always end a test by saluting the judges. And the rule book agrees with that statement.[/QUOTE]

Gggggggggggg grow up; in the time when Klimke or Nicole rode a freestyle to music the halt wasn’t even scored.

[canticle]

Why is it so hard for Olympians to halt their horses? In the U.S., even beginners can stop. Is something lost on the way to the top?

[Mardi]

Where did COTH get this quote from Anky ?

[QUOTE=Coreene;3463082]
No, absolutely not. She said "Toen ik de ring ik reed viel er toch wel spanning van me af. Toen wist ik dat ik het kon. Ik ben helemaal vergeten af te groeten naar de jury. Ik zat al te juichen op mijn paard. Ik dacht, ja hoor, het is binnen.’’ Which translates to “When I rode into the ring, the stress dropped. Then I understand that I could do it. I completely forgot to salute the jury at the end. I was already crying with joy. I thought, yes, that should do it.”

Forgetting is different from intentional, ya know?

.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I agree.

The quote I was referring to was posted on 8/19 by Dressagetraks, on the “Anyone Watching The Freestyle ?” thread. It went like this:

"Interesting quote on COTH coverage from Anky herself, in light of the above rule cited about halt being required. She admits that Salinero did not halt, says she waited for him to do so and realized he had not halted, but knew that she had already won and thought, ‘Oh, he doesn’t have to do this.’ "

So, she did not say this ? Or she did ?

[Moderator_1]

Discuss, disagree, etc., but please avoid the personal commentary directed at other posters and keep it productive.

Thanks,
Mod 1

[nero]

[QUOTE=ise@ssl;3461023]
Nero - I don’t need any education to know what I’m seeing. And the great thing about youtube is that it not only has videos of competition - it also has videos of WARMUPS. And the horrid riding in the warmups isn’t justified for what happens later in the ring. And of all the riders at FEI - she’s the only one I wouldn’t even want to meet. So many others are approachable and show a great enjoyment when riding - IMO - she never does. It always looks stressed, strained and PUSHED.[/QUOTE]

OK, so here’s some additions to your education. Tests with Anky’s horses halting. So you can SEE what you are claiming (that none of Anky’s horses halt) is actually wrong.

Painted Black http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKWcpYKH_cg

Krack C http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKFzUxB_gDI not square in first halt, but square at the end of the test

Bonfire http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rt6kGv-3xNc&feature=related

Nelson http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGsbyyjnHRk

Partout http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUGZ6mjKrHo

Please watch these and THEN tell me none of her horses halt.

[Mardi]

So there is no misunderstanding, here is the excert from the COTH coverage of Anky’s freestyle. This is from an article on the COTH home page.

“The only low scores she received were for her last halt, which came shortly after her last piaffe, and Salinero never stopped moving his feet. Van Grunsven had already ridden that last piaffe with a huge smile, and although she waited a moment for him to halt, in the end she just dropped her reins and wrapped her arms around his neck, knowing she’d already won. “I thought, ‘oh, he doesn’t have to do this,’” she recalled with a laugh. Her scores for the entrance and final halts ranged from 5 to 7.”

[Sabine]

it’s become like pushing buttons…those that feel attacked will drop their mask and reveal themselves…and really it has truly nothing to do with good dressage!! or how to ride a halt !!
It sadly has everything to do with good conduct, ethics and proper behavior…( and this is solely pointed at this thread and the comments made in regards to Anky’s lack of training or riding capacity).

grinnin from ear to ear and saluting Anky = one more time!! Prost Anky- you’re a tough lady, mother and wife- and I salute you for doing the best you can- over and over again…more than a lot of us- me included can say for themselves!!

Go Anky and Congrats to your 3rd Gold Medal…wayy to go dear lady!!

[nero]

[QUOTE=grayarabpony;3463252]
This is the second time I’ve described one of your posts this way: What a bitchy post. So you’re saying that everyone who didn’t like Anky tests are ugly, unsuccessful, incompetent, poor, false and alien? :lol:

It could just be that some think Salinero looks tense because he IS tense.

If you don’t like that opinion, fine. But I am sick of people on this board who attack others who don’t agree with them.[/QUOTE]

And I’m so sick of people who attack a public figure incessantly too.

I think its more that some people here (i.e me and possibly Sabine - can’t speak for her) actually find it more rude to continually attack a high profile rider when they (the poster) are either just bitter or misinformed or decide they must oppose all she is and has achieved because they don’t like a few photos on the internet. To me THAT is bitchy.

I find that sort of attack, and it has been going on for at least six years now, really distasteful - its anonymous, gutless ( I mean it’s no secret her website, why don’t all those continually discrediting her send her an email instead of hiding behind here) and so, so pointless. What Sabine wrote wasn’t that bad, toughen up - if the shoe fits…if it doesn’t then it wasn’t directed at you anyway, so no sweat!!

In the meantime I’m just so happy she won. She deserves it, and the horse deserves to be up there with the greats as well. Well done, if only her achievements could be more universally appreciated.

BTW I find that Salinero is not tense, he’s hot and excitable, a positive energy, not a negative one - so you say tomato and and I say tomato I guess

[Bats79]

And I think that it is “garbage talking” that says not liking the way Anky trains or rides or the way Salinero goes is an “Attack on Anky”.

Anky puts herself out in the arena like an artist puts their art on display.

I don’t like this. I don’t like that the judges like this. I think this judging is crap. I think that this training is crap. I think the judges are one eyed and the other has Anky written on it.

These statements are NOT ATTACKING ANKY.

It might be attacking what she does but ask Anky if she would prefer to be judged only in front of judges (no spectators) or if she would rather the publicity and notoriety that goes with being judged in front of her peers (and the rest of the smelly public). I bet she’d rather have us with our disagreements, bitching, arguing, pointing, sneering, laughing and loving than a sterile judging environment.

Therefore I don’t care if you don’t like what I say. Blah.

Above post must be read quickly to cause tongue tie.

[grayarabpony]

[QUOTE=nero;3463964]
And I’m so sick of people who attack a public figure incessantly too.

I think its more that some people here (i.e me and possibly Sabine - can’t speak for her) actually find it more rude to continually attack a high profile rider when they (the poster) are either just bitter or misinformed or decide they must oppose all she is and has achieved because they don’t like a few photos on the internet. To me THAT is bitchy.

I find that sort of attack, and it has been going on for at least six years now, really distasteful - its anonymous, gutless ( I mean it’s no secret her website, why don’t all those continually discrediting her send her an email instead of hiding behind here) and so, so pointless. What Sabine wrote wasn’t that bad, toughen up - if the shoe fits…if it doesn’t then it wasn’t directed at you anyway, so no sweat!!

In the meantime I’m just so happy she won. She deserves it, and the horse deserves to be up there with the greats as well. Well done, if only her achievements could be more universally appreciated.

BTW I find that Salinero is not tense, he’s hot and excitable, a positive energy, not a negative one - so you say tomato and and I say tomato I guess[/QUOTE]

I wondered when my post would bring out the rotten tomatoes.

How do you know that anyone is criticizing Anky based on a few photos? You’re way off base about most people who don’t think Anky deserves the high scores that she gets.

What Sabine wrote WAS very bad – talk about gutless, bitter and misinformed. :rolleyes:

If you think that Anky epitomizes the best of dressage and cannot recognize tension in a horse, I find that sad. I think she deserved the gold in Syndey but that’s it.

[grayarabpony]

@Sabine;3463937

it’s become like pushing buttons…those that feel attacked will drop their mask and reveal themselves…and really it has truly nothing to do with good dressage!! or how to ride a halt !!
It sadly has everything to do with good conduct, ethics and proper behavior…( and this is solely pointed at this thread and the comments made in regards to Anky’s lack of training or riding capacity).

Yes Sabine, you’ve certainly revealed yourself.

My own critiques of Anky’s riding have everything to do dressage, and nothing else.