I have no idea how to reply to this and also tag a previous post so forgive me for that, but I have answered something similar
But I have clarified that using it at home, or off property, or at shows, or just generally at all, will need to stop and she will need her own. I tried to put it nicely and used shows as an excuse to bring up the topic, but I HAVE put it quite plainly
I will once more, and I will make sure to be extra careful and cover everything, this could all just be a massive misunderstanding, but if not it becomes a house saddle. And bridle and brushes. My husband will be thrilledš¤£
IIWM, she would either stop using my stuff or Iād ask her to leave. Thereās no way Iād be willing to hide my own stuff on my own farm to stop a grifter from using it.
Itās not a regional thing, itās an upper-level show barn thing. Programs where most people are in full training and itās easier for the barn to manage supplies themselves than to chase down each individual owner when they run out of fly spray. Iām not sure where you are but there are almost certainly some barns in your general area that do this.
My barn is not that kind of program but does a kind of hybrid - everyone has their own supplies, but the barn also has its own stash for one-off medical issues or a la carte grooming services and will just charge a small fee for the supplies if the boarder canāt or doesnāt want to provide their own to use instead.
āWhen someone shows you who they are, believe themā.
Oh, and consider not to charge for any use of your stuff you really donāt want her to use.
It sets a bad precedent on using that stuff, keep all off limits.
I would not be surprised if she leaves once she canāt grift, for grifters, the fun is in grifting and it seems to be to that point, especially when advertising the competitor shirt, incredibly tone deaf.
I am the one who brought this up, IME it is an upper level barn thing. My clients who have had this expectation have big home barns that go to WEF, summer circuits, travel a ton, etc. it just isnāt practical to have 40 sets of brushes and 40 fly sprays at shows, etc. they were used to paying a fee and using the barn supplies.
No problem at all, just sent them links to the things they needed and they had them shipped to the barnā¦great clients, just used to a different way of doing things. I loved them because any time their horse needed something I just asked and it showed up in a couple of days. Very much NOT like OPās client it sounds like! I just wondered if the client was used to that type of barn as I know a couple of AQHA programs that do the supplies fee thing too.
Yeah, no, for real. From dressage barns to cutting horses to a lot of in betweenā¦now Iām not talking BIG barns at all, but 6 to 20 stalls or so, yeah. Fancy not fancy, new and old. Boarders have their areas/saddle racks etc and x area is the owners or trainerās. And the OP hasnāt had issues before she loaned her stuff out. Respect keeps peopleās hand-off otherās stuff. She needs to claim her stuff back and Iād leave it right there where I want it to hang. If Suzie Stickyhands picks it up and starts using it again she gets ONE pass before I kick her out of the barn. Itās not her fault that sheās still using it ā¦it darn sure will be a problem if she borrows it again.
I do not understand the sponsorship thing. Can a rider have multiple sponsors? Is there money involved? Or just free clothing? Could someone please post a brief description.
Yep, same experience here. When you take 40 horses on the road and trainers/grooms/assistants are doing everything, itās just easier to have communal stuff and bill for it. No asking people to freaking wash their saddle pads, no storing Susieās 87 matchy-matchy sets in the tack stalls, no client forgetting tack at home, no arguments over whose black nylon lead rope got used to walk Pookie to the wash rack. Some barns do everything but the tack - consumables like fly spray and shine spray, towels, saddle pads, wraps, etc - but expect the owner to provide tack and blankets. Some barns use communal schooling gear like girths, bell boots, even bridles and coolers, with the owners only providing show tack and personal gear. A lot do something in between.
IME these are big, high end show programs that spend a lot of time on the road and are set up to accommodate clients that do things like fly in for a Sunday classic. This is not typical for smaller boutique programs or places that cater to your āaverageā earner.
So, even here youāre saying it āwill needā to stop. As in, it will need to stop at some point in the future. What you need to say is that it does need to stop, right now. Or to be nice, on a certain date no more than a week from now, in writing. Just based on your posts Iām not convinced youāve been as clear as you think you have.
Best case sheās a bit ditzy or doesnāt read people/situations well. Worst case, sheās deliberately relying on you not wanting to make things uncomfortable in order to mooch for as long as possible. You might as well find out which!
Okay, so Iāve been around horses my whole life and seen this drama play out a million times. Itās tough being a barn owner and trying to be friends with your boarders. Without knowing the specifics, itās hard to say for sure, but generally, youāre NTA for setting boundaries. Itās your business, and you need to protect it. Friendships can complicate things, especially when money is involved.
I didnāt say anything about this above, youāre thinking of another poster. I was just answering your question about whether this is a thing. OPās friend has been using OPās tack which OP told her she could, but sheās also been borrowing grooming stuff and other supplies apparently without OPās permission. The communal supplies was raised as a possible explanation for her helping herself to all the other stuff. A lot of lesson barns also share supplies, and not unusual for them to share saddles between horses too.
My batting average sucks today.
I assumed (silly me) that since you were responding it was you that said it. I just went back up and it was Fordtraktor.
And at the time, we were talking about tack, mainly the saddle.
This is the post I was responding to, which in the context of the rest of the conversation certainly makes it sound like āeverything is communalā is talking about saddles, not just fly spray and first aid equipment. I was not the only one who took it that way.
And yes, lesson barns share their lesson saddles with various lesson horses. That is very different.
Besides us dying to know, many people read these threads and find them very helpful in navigating the intricate customs, rituals and ethics of boarding/training barns. There can be much similarity but sometimes being in a different barn can be like being on a different planet.
āNever attribute to malice what can be explained by ignorance.ā I remind myself of this a lot and I think itās relevant here too. It is a little surprising seeing so many quick to call the boarder a grifter. Itās way more likely that sheās socially unaware or just doesnāt care enough to think itās a big deal. Not that either excuses her, but I think calling her a grifter is an overreaction for sure!
@S_Shea , it really bothers me to see someone taking advantage when a friend is being kind and generous with them. My earlier post was kind of outraged and I apologize if it came across as harsh. That wasnāt my intention.
I am now thinking that one of the communications failures with your boarder is that you are a very polite person. And that you probably come from a culture that does not confront people. And that you probably assume that most other people are as nice and as good a friend as you are. But those assumptions are not working out with this āfriendā.
Knowing that my posting history on COTH makes this is hard to believe ā but I come from a culture that frequently will not state things directly that might remotely make someone else uncomfortable.
In that bubble world the indirect phrasing and delivery is like a code to understand the real intent. It is expected that people will interpret ā and in this little corner of the world for the most part they do. They know that if someone says politely but quickly āif you have time could youā actually means āplease do this right awayā. They easily interpret the urgency. But ā people not inside this bubble donāt interpret the meaning at all. They would think this request is unimportant and optional, because that is the way it is worded.
As a young adult when I was job-transferred to gawd-amighty NEW YAWK CITY I quickly learned that the code didnāt work there. At all.
Anyway ā Considering this possibility of a background culture of indirect politeness, I can understand that you may believe that you have told her what you mean. But that there is a good chance that she heard your indirect wording and didnāt make the interpretative leap.
I donāt know for sure that this culture framing is the case. But maybe that explains why you think these snippets below would have clearly communicated your meaning ā¦ but your friend is not acting as if she understood.
OP I think itās possible that you may not realize why what youāve communicated to your boarder is not being understood by many in this thread, as well as by the boarder.
OP, that message is not blunt at all. Itās not clear what you intend. You made assumptions about what would be obvious to her. With other people, what we think is obvious, seldom is.
You told her ā but then by saying āshowingā, you implied that using it at home is fine, and also that later is fine since you didnāt give an actual date. Adding the justification of āshowingā completely sidetracked the message.
You donāt need to cite a reason or justification. Just that as of [date] you are taking your tack back. It doesnāt work for you to share your tack. Nothing else needed.
Realize that if you start justifying, giving reasons, this could be an opening for her to start wheedling. Donāt waffle, because that makes her think you donāt really mean it.
Donāt ask her to give it back ā sheāll see that as at her own discretion ā rather, tell her that youāll be taking it back. Be specific about the exact date your saddle will āno longer be availableā to her (adding weeks before āshowingā for your prep time). If she does her own date calculation, it wonāt land on the timeframe that you intend.
Also: very important, and where this may be going sideways ā¦
It seems that you are very concerned that she isnāt buying her own tack. But thatās not your problem. Sheās had months to get it. She didnāt. You donāt need to chivvy her to buy her own tack, directly or indirectly.
Be distant and unconcerned, even dismissive, about whether she shows or not, if she canāt show without your tack. Understand that sheās using your concern to keep manipulating you. Donāt worry if she does or doesnāt understand any implications - sheās a grownup, she can manage herself. If she does hastily buy bad tack and then canāt show in it, again, not your problem.
You can adopt a cheerful weāre-all-friends-here tone, and deliver your message as informational. No pressure on her to buy tack, show, or to do anything. Itās still a polite but much more clear, and firm, message.
No fringe details, reasons, or justifications ā it just muddies the real message. Avoid a big conversation about it as it tends to lead to an unclear message. Avoid any negotiation, thatās just manipulation.
Put it in writing in an email. That way no misunderstanding or mis-remembering. Also tell her verbally when time is short and you have to leave and canāt get into a conversation.
And the most important thing ā follow through. Take your tack back when you say you will, no matter how much pressure she puts on you. Donāt fix her problem of not having tack.
If she gets upset, and/or pressures you, and/or rage-quits your generosity ā thatās ok. Now you know.
Below are all indirect statements with a lot of assumptions ā¦
āhopefully she understandsā because you arenāt telling her specifically. You are leaving it to her to interpret your implication. Probably you donāt realize this ā thatās my guess.
You are saying you want your saddle back ā without saying you want your saddle back. You are telling her to get her own saddle ā without telling her to get her own saddle.
This is saying two contradictory things. So the entire vibe behind it is confusing your erstwhile loyal group.
They should understand by interpreting the tea leaves that they are being highly inappropriate to get outside sponsors. Now you are (justifiably imo) put out that the implied control wasnāt effective. But you never directly told them your real feelings and thoughts.
Make a barn rule that there are no outside sponsors or sponsor material ā including wearables ā in your barn. Itās disrespectful to your own sponsors and undermines your sponsor relationships. Itās also disrespectful to you. Hopefully youāll consider what that really means that they donāt get that, or donāt care.
Contradictory, again. It is not a ādumb little thingā. Itās disloyal to you and to your sponsors. Plus it is critically important because it has helped you see an exploitive situation.
That matters. Because you matter. Calling this a ādumb little thingā is not respecting yourself. They are picking up on that.
Nope. Itās a fair assumption, but in practical terms no assumption can be relied on, when it comes to peopleās behavior.
The kind of friends you really want, and that you deserve, probably would understand all of this. But not everyone is that kind of friend.
You deserve: Respect, consideration, fair play, honesty, and at least some degree of the loyalty that friends give to each other. Please ask yourself who you know who does these things to the degree that you offer them to others. Those are the people to bring close to you in life.
You sound like a good person who deserves much better friends, OP. Make room for truly good friends by allowing this āfriendā to stomp out of your barn door when you take back your saddle. Hopefully, though, sheāll apologize and put the situation right.
@OverandOnward Wins the Thread!
The only thing I can add, after reading your awesome reply, is - again - IIWM,. Iād tell the leases & the entitled āfriendā that you wonāt permit wearing the other companyās shirts when they show with you. End of Sentence.
Would an Eagles player show up at a game wearing a Chiefs jersey?
Better add āor on my propertyā or sheāll think she just canāt wear the competing logo apparel when showing with you. She sounds pretty tone deaf if you gave her your shirt but she got the other anyway. Really? Who does that?
OP, your dense boarder sounds like my sister.
I sent her an email after I heard impending plans to throw a birthday party I didnāt have time for and didnāt want. I was ridiculously busy at work and travelling over 50% of the time. The email went something like āPlease donāt do anything for my birthday.ā I thought it was pretty clear. She ignored it and continued making plans.
Eventually, I told her exactly what she could do with her plans (which had also grown considerably ). She then complained the I was disrespectful, mean and she didnāt have to put up with this. I pointed out that when I had been polite, she ignored me. OOPS.
ā but I come from a culture that frequently will not state things directly that might remotely make someone else uncomfortable.
Look at me, making a FOOTBALL reference!
). She then complained the I was disrespectful, mean and she didnāt have to put up with this. I pointed out that when I had been polite, she ignored me. OOPS.