Announcement of Helmet Study Result Release Date

[Xctrygirl]

Ok so if you scroll up this thread you could see the more recent updates and videos.

Specifically this one released by the VT folks:

GMT20220908-161959_Recording_3440x1440.mp4

Now, part of what I know comes from having sat through and listened at Virginia Tech to our August Symposium that the team gave to Helmet brand reps, Alphabet Org reps and little old me.

In the whole multi hour presentation we could see which tests were being done and at what levels and where it matched to existing certifications. I am unsure if that’s in this abbreviated version for the general public. I do know it was mentioned in at least 2 tests when I was sitting there.

If you would very much like to know more you can email Dr. Miller and ask. He is a very open and receptive person and is always happy to receive an email like this.

His email is listed many places publicly which is why I don’t mind posting it here.

BMiller21@vt.edu

Em

[Xctrygirl]

Ok… update… from the Google Drive video I just posted, around the 7 minute mark is this chart.

It does show that the VT team have decided to test for Rigid impacts at 6.3 m/s and 5/0 m/s. Snell’s test is done at 6.26 m/s normally. So they’re going a bit above SNELL’s speeds. And at 5.94 m/s which for flat rigid tests is the same for ASTM, PAS015 and VG1. So the VT team is pushing a hair beyond what the current acceptable limits already are.

Likewise there is further discussion about the various shape impact devices used in the various certification tests and how they chose what shape devices to impact the helmets on and why. SNELL is mentioned within this context due to being the only certification group using a certain hemisphere shaped anvil as opposed to the various different shaped anvils used by ASTM and PAS015.

That’s at around 9mins 22 seconds on this video.

Em

[pluvinel]

@Xctrygirl

Ok… update… from the Google Drive video I just posted, around the 7 minute mark is this chart.

Thank you for the update…I will look at the video to see if it answers my questions.

[Xctrygirl]

I would also point out that we will be having a live webinar with Dr. Miller again soon after the results of the first round are released.

It’s not scheduled yet but when it is I will be sure to provide links in as many different public places, like here, that I can. So there are more opportunities for explanations and Q & A.

Em

[pluvinel]

@Xctrygirl

I would also point out that we will be having a live webinar with Dr. Miller again soon after the results of the first round are released.

It’s not scheduled yet but when it is I will be sure to provide links in as many different public places, like here, that I can. So there are more opportunities for explanations and Q & A.

Thanks again. I will research the VT technical publications on this work, but if you have any input into this talk, it would be helpful to have the speaker clearly articulate the problem their research is addressing.

For background, I teach at an engineering school. I am familiar with the principles of energy dissipation. I have spent a career looking at (and preventing) failures. I used to have my racing license (auto) until I decided I could only afford one expensive hobby. Horses won out. I gallop young horses and after 2 concussions, have an interest in TBI and helmet safety.

It is not clear what VT is doing that is different from Snell. Every motorsport association, from F1 on down, requires Snell certified helmets. I figure using the body of knowledge developed for auto racing can be used to understand equestrian helmet performance.

A brain is a brain is a brain…the only difference is the “conveyance” (auto, motorcycle, bike, sulky, horse) taking that brain to an immovable object. I personally ride in a CO 4-Star helmet (Snell certified).

The Snell Foundations does work to develop empirical models to reduce brain and also spinal cord injury…so again, what is VT doing that is different? I figure Snell has a 60-year head start studying TBI and the effects of helmets, so why not partner with them? Those are the questions I have.

[Xctrygirl]

I think you’re not quite understanding the origin of this study nor the roles involved.

In the USA for English Sport disciplines the only standards that affect competitiors to this point are SEI/ASTM. The orgs require a helmet with these certifications only. Beyond this fact recent other studies have helped to show us that while the ASTM standard is not a bad standard the lack of transparency in how a helmet does in ASTM testing is causing people, orgs etc to want to know more and see (in print) which helmet is the safest in the market of all the helmets we could buy.

This is where The Virginia Tech Helmet Safety Lab comes in. They have successfully developed “Starr” tests that independently test helmets for sale to consumers for Bicycling, Football and other sports. In an effort to clarify for people beyond the ASTM certifications what is safest and will be most likely to reduce your chances for a concussion or worse.

Their website can help guide you to see how their system works.

Virginia Tech Helmet Ratings

The national orgs went to them to see if they could do the same thing, create Starr ratings, for Equestrian helmets as well.

Now again, I am a layperson who dove into this with no prior research knowledge and I try very hard to ensure that what I share/say is accurate. But beyond this you should really email Barry. He can better answer many of your queries.

But the lines are simple.

ASTM cert not transparent ~~~~> People want to know more ~~~> Va tech has done this before ~~~~> USEF/USEA/Etc ask them if they can study US based helmet to determine what is safest so people can have transparency in helmet purchases. And as a side benefit, helmet brands can likely improve designs from their feedback. (That’s worked VERY well for Bicycling and Football)

Em

[Janet]

@pluvinel

It is not clear what VT is doing that is different from Snell.

I THINK the difference is that Snell certification is pass/fail. Either you get it or you don’t.
It is my understanding (and I may be wrong) is that VT is working on ranking helmets among the ones that “pass”.

[enjoytheride]

There are only 3 Snell rated helmets available for sale in the US, where the only requirement is the ASTM standard. There are a hundred or more ASTM helmets. I’d love to know which helmets, that are available to me to try on and return if necessary, are safer.

[pluvinel]

@Janet

I THINK the difference is that Snell certification is pass/fail. Either you get it or you don’t.
It is my understanding (and I may be wrong) is that VT is working on ranking helmets among the ones that “pass”.

I’m starting to arrive to that conclusion. My question is Why?

Do the national organizations think there is a problem with current standards that the pass/fail system doesn’t address?

Maybe I’m slow, but my simple mind would just like to understand the goal of the VT work and why it is needed.

[pluvinel]

@enjoytheride

There are only 3 Snell rated helmets available for sale in the US, where the only requirement is the ASTM standard. There are a hundred or more ASTM helmets. I’d love to know which helmets, that are available to me to try on and return if necessary, are safer.

The ASTM standard and the Snell Standard are different standards. That begs the question of whether one standard is superior to another.

I know that in motorsports, having a DOT helmet is not considered acceptable for racing. For racing you need a Snell certified helmet.

[Xctrygirl]

Are you familiar with the 2 (smaller) Equestrian helmet studies conducted by Folksam in Sweden in 2018 and 2021???

2018: https://mediaarkivet.nu/Sites/A/Folksam+Mediaarkiv/4168?encoding=UTF-8

2021: https://mediaarkivet.nu/Sites/A/Folksam+Mediaarkiv/5492?encoding=UTF-8

In these it was VERY clear that across of ALL of the (approved) tested helmets there is a wide disparity in what will help you and keep your brain safe, versus helmets that did very little to keep you safe.

Ask yourself this… Is a triple certified Champion or Charles Owen safer??? If it is, how do we know?

Is a triple certified helmet WITH MIPS, safer than one without??? What about a plain old ASTM/VG1 approved helmet? How do we know?

We also don’t have proof that an approved SNELL helmet is better or worse than a non-Snell helmet. This study should help clear this up.

There are endless questions, I know I have had MANY come up in the MIPS group. I don’t think you can blame people and the associations and the related families and trainers for wanting MORE transparency and to know which is safest when compared against the others. Especially given the rising costs of all equipment out there.

This study is NOT new. It got funded in 2020 and has been in discussion since 2019.

And FWIW, they’re going to be testing all equestrian helmets from now on. It’s not a one shot deal. The first round starts it but it is ongoing from here.

Emily

[RAyers]

No standard is better than any other standard. Each standard addresses different aspects of both helmet design and anticipated impact. No one standard, Snell, ASTM, EN is actually any better than the other if all impact types are averaged.

Unthread there was a reference to horse racing and requiring Snell. The only reason is because the DOT there established the requirement and they only accept Snell powersports standards.

In any case, it is the acceleration of the brain that is most important and both Snell and ASTM acknowledge that any acceleration below the range of 260-300g (depending on the standard) is acceptable.

[Jealoushe]

I believe Champion is also doing some new testing. They had a whole Podcast series on Horse and Hound Podcast about how helmets are tested and what not and what they’ve learned. One takeaway was that helmets that push your head out if crushed are better than ones that don’t. They are studying helmets from riders who have had terrible falls. Super interesting.

[Xctrygirl]

Yep. Great point. All helmet companies have in house and independent testing labs that they use in their process. Once they have results from VT, and likely before since most everything was laid out for them at the August symposium in Virginia, their testers can start mimicking how VT tests and they can work on improving their helmets for future tests with VT, ASTM, etc.

Em

[evtrmom]

@Xctrygirl Emily, thank you for all the great information!! I love my new CO MIPS, and so thankful for the wealth of knowledge provided by you and Kim from Fair Hill Saddlery. D

[Marigold]

@Jealoushe

One takeaway was that helmets that push your head out if crushed are better than ones that don’t.

Helmets that…what? What does it mean for a helmet to “push your head out if crushed”? I’ve never heard of this technology.

[Jealoushe]

lol I dont think it’s a technology, just that when a horse lands on your head, your head slides out of the helmet somewhat. That’s my scientific explanation haha

‎The Horse & Hound Podcast: The Champion Safety Series: episode six | A...

[TXnGA]

Rating Helmet Safety

[TXnGA]

Where the ratings for each helmet will be available when published:

Virginia Tech Helmet Ratings

[drop_shot]

First round of results are up! https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/equestrian-helmet-ratings.html?fbclid=IwAR3E4tcNg3NMosbv1T0QXwRJA77tBUNParWQuE9gIiKWvi2Z0aPYizQ8NNw#!

I was surprised to see OneK ranked so low. Very thankful for this independent study.