[QUOTE=Red Barn;8639159]
Now you’ve done it, Rodeo.
They’re really gonna get pissed off now. :lol:[/QUOTE]
They can get pissed off. Internet drama has 0% effect in my real life. It just amuses me, because people actually think I care about their opinions of what they think of me, but from where I’m chilling, it’s all just angry data and text.
Well without too much in the line of linguistic acrobatics, we could probably make it into REYNARD, smart like a fox.
[QUOTE=JoZ;8639436]
Well without too much in the line of linguistic acrobatics, we could probably make it into REYNARD, smart like a fox.[/QUOTE]
The REYNARD movement? A movement of REYNARDISTS? Either is pretty catchy.
Excellent!
:yes:
But, in the story, isn’t Reynard supposed to be kind of a dick?
I have an idea that will solve all the problems of the ‘they are not being honest’ group. The farm owner needs to post a sign near whatever bovine they have on display that shows all the cuts of meat that come from the various parts of the animals. I know the beef industry has such a sign, I see it every year in the beef barn at the state fair and in the beef tent at farm days.
Add a table of pamphlets, that I know the beef industry also has, that include yummy recipes made from various Moo parts.
I am not sure about the word Most in that sentence. In NY I am more than welcome to raise a horse and slaughter for my own use. I am just not allowed to sell it.
I second this thought. I would walk right by the darn picketers. Maybe eating a burger while I do it.
I basically never post anything on here but just have to dive in head first, especially since I live on the island. For the record I have never been to Brenners Farm or even heard of it until now.
Did you know that Nassau and Suffolk counties on LI were recently ranked the Most expensive place to live in America? We have insanely high property taxes, land prices, childcare, and housing costs. As an example, if I could ever convince my husband to move we could go out west to somewhere equally beautiful and buy a piece of land 4x what we have now, build a bigger house, a bigger barn and an indoor (which we don’t have now) and still expect to pay 12 times LESS in property taxes. The kicker is we would be able to bring in the same income we make now and have access to better schools and roads. So to say that the only reason the Brenners have opened their place up to the public is because they couldn’t hack it at being a “real” working farm is unfair and probably untrue.
At a time when people whose families have been farming and fishing this island since the 16 and 17 hundreds are being driven off the island due to the high cost of living many many of the those remaining have been forced to find additional ways to make their property and/or animals work for them in order to make ends meet. You can’t turn around here without seeing a kids adventure park/ come pet our dairy cows/hay ride type place so it’s hardly a novel concept.
I really don’t understand how one person could say that they knew better than to talk to kids about slaughter and then in the next breath insist that the Brenners do it. And go one step past that and say they should offer butchery classes?! He’d be out of business by end of day. If you look at the website the place is clearly geared towards pre-school and elementary children, no way would that kind of program work. During the season he’ll be packed with city people who come out to the “country” and DO NOT WANT to be forced to face reality and see where their steak actually comes from. Obviously, since this ridiculous petition is going on and I seriously suspect that this is what the issue actually is. That woman did not like being forced to have to think about where her food come from for 5 seconds.
As for being honest, I don’t see how choosing to show children (and their parents) about farming and self-sustainability to a point is dishonest. Dags said is perfectly, its the parents responsibility to teach their children about the circle of life not some random farmer. The website does state that they raise animals for self-sustainability and it’s really up to the people reading to make the connection. As far as having a named cow that people have a connection with I would venture to guess these people have maybe seen her one time, or perhaps once a year when they come out this way.
And as for gasp unknowingly being forced to pay to pet a cow on death row? It’s not like they were invited to come pet the cows and then taken into a slaughter house or feed lot geez. I take more issue with the local rescue that “cons” city folk into paying the rescue to do THEIR chores (turn in, feeding and grooming). But they found that people are interested in doing it so more power to them, I’ll just sadly have to keep paying my guys to come do stalls on the weekend 
[QUOTE=dags;8639160]
But that is the big giant spectacularly missed neon blinking educational opportunity we are talking about.
THIS cow is getting the most magnificent care (ie: animal management) of possibly any cow in this entire country. There is absolutely ZERO complaint about this animal’s care. Only that it is going to die. For food. Like the gazillions of other cows out there. Only they are in far, far worse situations.
You want pointed mentions of animal slaughter on the web site, and in the next breath point out it will ruin his business. So, what now? No kids get to visit a real live farm?
He does it right. He shows them the cow and then the parents can connect the dots if they so desire. For sure, some parents don’t wanna touch this with a 10’ pole, and so they don’t ask where the freaking farm cow ends up. Others might see it as an excellent opportunity to teach their child about respect for your food and the push for a humane food cycle. Either way, the parents make the call.
The parents define the perception these children gain, not the farmer.
And ignorance just cannot count. Everyone knows burgers come from cows. Steaks come from cows. Beef Tartare comes from cows. You do not need some degree in rural living to figure this out. If Minnie the Cow is slapping fast-food-loving New Yorkers in the face with a big sloppy tongues full of this is what dinner looks like, then good.
What’s done is done, and yeah, I don’t predict a huge impact to the bottom line. So alllll that matters now is the conversation you choose to have about it. You can foster and defend the ignorance, or you can stand up for the education you admit these folks don’t have.
And FWIW, city-folk are not idjits. And as a Chicagoan I certainly don’t need to be told about them. Geez.[/QUOTE]
I love love this so much.
[QUOTE=RodeoFTW;8638603]
Benner’s farm was supposed to be educational but he took advantage of people’s idealism and used it to make a living. It wasn’t honest or right. He could have been so much more forthcoming about Minnie the heifer, but he probably knew that if he said the truth, people couldn’t want to come anymore.
So how is that being honest in business practices?[/QUOTE]
Seriously? What, he’s a school now? That’s like saying when I took a class on Manet in college and I didn’t learn he died of Syphillis, my prof was dishonest.
And please explain how he ‘took advantage’. What did he offer that people didn’t get? Were these people ripped off somehow?
And, oh the scandal! He used his farm to make a living.
If he was dishonest, he would have lied to the people then they found out latter Minnie ended up on a plate. Honesty is telling the truth, which he did when the woman asked. There was no lie of omission.
[QUOTE=jps83;8639692]
Did you know that Nassau and Suffolk counties on LI were recently ranked the Most expensive place to live in America? We have insanely high property taxes, land prices, childcare, and housing costs. As an example, if I could ever convince my husband to move we could go out west to somewhere equally beautiful and buy a piece of land 4x what we have now, build a bigger house, a bigger barn and an indoor (which we don’t have now) and still expect to pay 12 times LESS in property taxes. The kicker is we would be able to bring in the same income we make now and have access to better schools and roads. So to say that the only reason the Brenners have opened their place up to the public is because they couldn’t hack it at being a “real” working farm is unfair and probably untrue.
At a time when people whose families have been farming and fishing this island since the 16 and 17 hundreds are being driven off the island due to the high cost of living many many of the those remaining have been forced to find additional ways to make their property and/or animals work for them in order to make ends meet. .[/QUOTE]
100 times this. My family is from a pretty well off area with very high property values and taxes. To keep the farm, over time hundreds of acres were sold, and now my stepdad struggles by with a tiny bit of property and leased land. I hate saying it but he kind of missed the boat - in places like this you need some kind of plan to keep smaller family farms afloat, because it’s exceedingly difficult (if not impossible) to do it on produce or corn alone these days. Even around here, there are some great family farms producing great food and products, but they ALL manage it by ALSO having other aspects to their business. One has festivals and invites the public and has kiddie rides and stuff on their property. Another has expanded into a garden center and popular lunch destination. Back home in CT the other four family farms in my stepdad’s area have all started ‘attraction’ things like what the Brenners do. I think without these approaches those last vestiges of agriculture and self sustainable life in these suburban areas would just be swallowed up and gone. Honestly my hat is off to the people running these small farms and trying to hold on to their family property and way of life for seeing the writing on the wall and coming up with a business plan that can keep things going. Evolve or die.
[QUOTE=amm2cd;8639368]
I wouldn’t know. I’m not name-calling.
Militant/radical/extremist COTHers… what should Red Barn call you guys?
Anyone?[/QUOTE]
Adults and educated, thinking young people
-should I add: under siege?
My response as to ‘What should we call you’ was deliberately generic.
Because we are all individuals stating our interpretation of history, gathered data and reality. Not trying to impose on others without justifiably humane or anti-criminal cause. And objecting to or acting against bullying, criminal and cruel behavior.
= NORMALS
After reading the helpful posts from people who live in that area, I still think poor Mr. Brenner made a PR error which might indeed backfire considering how much business competition he has for the same services.
By inviting people in, he became less self-sufficient and more dependent on agri-tourism dollars, from fickle people who want a charming time. They don’t want reality, they want farm pets. The fact that farm animals are not pets (named or not) doesn’t occur to the general public until faced with the stark truth that these animals are being raised for food. I think it wasn’t made terribly clear that Minnie was one of those.
It’s too bad, and hopefully it will blow over with the disappearance of the cow so the offended populace will move on to other causes. However, it may have damaged his business significantly if the tourists can go elsewhere. On the other hand, little kids grow up and there will be a whole other generation of toddlers and parents who won’t know about this drama.
For those who run these kinds of agri-tourism places, it would be a good idea to set expectations and understand when the cow/goat/sheep goes to slaughter that some people may not be aware that was the intended purpose.
We do have one of these places here in my area, they have goats and sheep but as far as I am aware, they are strictly for petting and not eaten, but then again, they haven’t sentimentalized them too much and they don’t have names. [shrug]. It’s an apple farm so the farm animals are sort of an addition to the operation.
On the other hand, we do have a working cheese maker with a goat dairy, city people go out there all the time, but I think it’s made clear the goats are for milking and then are slaughtered when their productive life is done. I never saw anything sentimental about it.
I think it’s an important topic to discuss here, only because as horse owners the same thing happens with misunderstandings about fly masks, what horses are used for (carriages in particular), and what happens to race horses when they are done racing. If misunderstandings occur then well-meaning do gooders can force legal and other issues on horse owners, as we have seen, with very serious consequences. It also impacts on some practices that many of us consider abusive the general public doesn’t know about, such as extreme shoeing and soring of show horses. Education works both ways.
Truly I don’t understand how people can eat meat and then have a problem with this farmer. I do remember when my brother took my nephews to a farm like this one in Arizona. After one of them asked what happened to the cows and was told about the connection between cattle and beef, he swore off meat for many years. My brother said he was holding his breath waiting for the day that my nephew made the connection between the chicken on his plate and the chickens he saw at the farm.
Personally, I think this is something all kids should be taught, so they don’t go around thinking that meat grows on tree like apples.
I think agricultural literacy should apply to all food, not just animals. Most people have no idea where any of their food comes from, vegetables and grains included.
When shoppers are buying fruits out of season, where do they think they come from? How are they grown? People have no idea, or care that these products are shipped thousands of miles, internationally. Not saying it’s wrong, but you should question fresh blueberries in February. Plants grown specifically to ship taste very different than grown in season for flavor. Many of the delicious varieties of fruits and vegetables aren’t grown because they aren’t viable commercially because they don’t ship or hold well. OK, off my soapbox.
These agri-tourism farms are important to at least show people where their food comes from, including meat that comes from a living animal that might just have had a name and a personality.
Isn’t there a law (well at least in my state) that they have to tell you where produce is from?
Unless you are not willing to read the print on the sign that says where that ear of corn is shipped in from you pretty much know it was not grown in upstate NY in February. Add that it being shipped in is why it costs so much.
[QUOTE=trubandloki;8641610]
Isn’t there a law (well at least in my state) that they have to tell you where produce is from?
Unless you are not willing to read the print on the sign that says where that ear of corn is shipped in from you pretty much know it was not grown in upstate NY in February. Add that it being shipped in is why it costs so much.[/QUOTE]
If it is, it’s being neglected.
And ‘land of origin’ has been removed from requirements for meat as far as I know.
But yeah, if you live in a climate controlled world, can’t tell what is dirt or soil, you probably have no idea that raspberries are not seasonal in December!
By submitting your email, you agree to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy. You may also receive promotional emails from The Chronicle of the Horse. You can opt out at any time.
For Customers
Company
Terms of Use
