I’m currently looking to cross a lovely TB mare to Clainfair Mirabeau? Thoughts?
A couple of thoughts come to mind. One, what type of foal are you looking to produce - hunter, dressage, etc.? And two, are you looking to produce a pony hunter (foal stays under 14.2 HH) or are you fine with a foal that ends up going over?
Depending on how you answer those two questions will determine what will be the best cross for your mare. If your mare is 16.2 HH, you will not have a chance at producing a foal that stays under 14.2 HH when crossed with a Section B Welsh Pony stallion. 
Below are some of our Welsh/TB crosses from our own pony stallions. The Welsh/TB crosses make lovely pony hunters and tend to be the most sought after in the hunter ring.
The other thing to keep in mind, if your goal is to produce a pony hunter, is temperament. I cannot comment on Mirabeau, as I don’t know him at all, but there are a few pony hunter stallions out there that I would not breed to unless I had a super quiet mare. Babies are super fancy, but hard to get to the ring!
We have what looks like she will stay a LG pony out of a 17 hand mare and the welsh stallion Rosmel’s Creme de Mint. She is 3 years old now and just at 14 hands. The funny thing is, her breeder and I we both hoping for a small horse from the cross so go figure LOL.
I also bred my pony mare to Gatsby who has a high percentage of TB in hopes of making a small horse. He is only a week old so only time will tell but he came out with legs literally longer than his mother.
[QUOTE=alliekat;7570675]
We have what looks like she will stay a LG pony out of a 17 hand mare and the welsh stallion Rosmel’s Creme de Mint. She is 3 years old now and just at 14 hands. [/QUOTE]
Creme de Mint is a Section A stallion, so that can make all the difference in the world, when crossing pony stallions with larger mares. The Section A’s are bred to be a lot smaller than the Bs.
Of course!! You guys need more information. Sorry I shouldn’t be posting while being sleep deprived.
I would be breeding for the hunter ring. My mare is 16.1h, beautiful head, nice conformation, good hunter type gaits. I would be completely happy getting a 14.2h or under version of her. Since I got her last year I have really wanted to cross her with a pony.
The foal would be for resale, seeing how I’m a hair under 6 foot & have no kids. Temperament is a must!! I’m a little concerned crossing her with a pony stallion of non-traditional colors, only due to resale but it does seem that the pony ring is much more open to that. Secretly I love color!
I would love to get a little more information on Clanfair Mirabeau. He really is he a lovely mover and think he would only add to my mare’s gaits. However, he is very young himself and not a lot of information out there on him yet.
I am definitely open to pony stallion suggestions!
As far as resale for pony offspring…… How hard are pony weanling/yearlings to sale? Or is it easier to wait until they are three/four years old?
I have no idea how tall Mirabeau is, so hard to comment in regards to how he would cross with your 16.1 HH mare. That being said, I know his parents/lineage and I’m not sure that you will be able to get a large pony out of that cross. My fear is the foal will end up a hony. It should be noted that Mirabeau is more “traditionally” bred. Meaning, bred for the Welsh Pony show ring, not for hunter ring. So that is something to keep in mind if you are looking specifically at breeding for a pony hunter resale project.
You are right, the single dilutes seem to be more accepted in the pony hunter ring…but they can still be a bit of a harder sell, as they stand out so much more in the ring.
If it were me and I was specifically wanting to breed for resale on the pony hunter circuit, I would choose a really typey pony hunter stallion who is well promoted and advertised, and has proven babies showing over fences, as that will provide you with the best chance of selling the foal early on, rather than having to wait until they are 3 & 4 and started under saddle. With your mare being 16.1 HH, you are going to have to go with a very small stallion, like Blue Who (11.1 1/2 HH) or maybe even something a bit taller like *Telynau Royal Anthem (12.2 HH). It’s going to be a gamble any way you look at it…so the smaller the better. Has your mare had any other foals, that would help estimate what she throws, height wise?
[QUOTE=Daventry;7570885]
I have no idea how tall Mirabeau is, so hard to comment in regards to how he would cross with your 16.1 HH mare. That being said, I know his parents/lineage and I’m not sure that you will be able to get a large pony out of that cross. My fear is the foal will end up a hony. It should be noted that Mirabeau is more “traditionally” bred. Meaning, bred for the Welsh Pony show ring, not for hunter ring. So that is something to keep in mind if you are looking specifically at breeding for a pony hunter resale project.
You are right, the single dilutes seem to be more accepted in the pony hunter ring…but they can still be a bit of a harder sell, as they stand out so much more in the ring.
If it were me and I was specifically wanting to breed for resale on the pony hunter circuit, I would choose a really typey pony hunter stallion who is well promoted and advertised, and has proven babies showing over fences, as that will provide you with the best chance of selling the foal early on, rather than having to wait until they are 3 & 4 and started under saddle. With your mare being 16.1 HH, you are going to have to go with a very small stallion, like Blue Who (11.1 1/2 HH) or maybe even something a bit taller like *Telynau Royal Anthem (12.2 HH). It’s going to be a gamble any way you look at it…so the smaller the better. Has your mare had any other foals, that would help estimate what she throws, height wise?[/QUOTE]
Great information!! Her first foal is due in a couple of weeks so no clue what she throws. I wouldn’t mind waiting for a couple of years to see what she produces before putting her to a pony. She has plenty of good years in her, she only five.
With the market the way it is, I don’t know if a hony has much value around here? We are still a bit behind the times for sport ponies in the dressage ring & I would be afraid a hony would make the distance in the Children/Adult Hunters.
How I love a cute little fancy pony hunter and with all these great pony sires, I’m still very tempted.
I agree!
I’ll also suggest you go with a purebred welsh. There is more “control” on resulting height of the foal going with at least one purebred parent. Since your mare is a crossbred (warmbloods are only crossbreds), there are unknowns with her own height as well as what she will pass on.
I’d suggest a nice Section A Welsh stallion. Have you considered Heavenly Final Revelation? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3VwGPo3xgg
(*Pendock Larkspur was a fancy, fancy Section A and this son is just like his daddy!) 
I had a foal last year by Heavenly’s Final Revelation.
My mare is 15.3 but produces very large foals out of warmblood stallions.
Her two foals by Roc USA (17 hands) are 16.3 and 2 year old will easily finish at 17 hands.
Her a Ralando Foal this year is huge so I for see him being 17 hands as well.
Here is a photo of her Rev pony baby. He is a medium now and I think he will stay a large. Good mover, great personality and people are already trying to buy him from me!!!
Doesn’t get any cuter.
I’m not sure how tall Mirabeau is, but you will get an A+ temperament. I have the full brother to his dam, and have been around many of the ponies from that bloodline. Obviously, I am a fan.
How much size is in your mare’s pedigree? That has a lot to do with the equation. Mirabeau is a very nice pony. He comes from strong bloodlines that are TRUE Welsh type, but are also doing well in the performance division
Can you link to your mare’s pedigree?
Here is my mare’s pedigree.
http://www.pedigreequery.com/boxing+lady
Thanks for all the suggestions, I’m definitely open.
How does Heavenly Final Revelation cross with TB? I really like him.
Alliekat, What made you decide to breed to Rosmel’s Creme de Mint? He stands here in Colorado I believe & not far from us.
Beautifully! Look at Samotis’ foal. Samoits, is your mare a TB?
I’ve asked Samantha to come tell you ALL about him!
Yes my mare is a tb. She is by Candis Gold out of a mare by Advocatum.
Great cross for me! In fact after her year off this year (mare had 3 babies in a row so I am giving her a break) I will probably breed her back to Heavenly’s Final Revelation.
Maverick got the beautiful welsh face, great feet, great personality and a really good mover.
He has been very easy to handle, great with my little niece and every time someone sees him they are in love!!!
Now it’s wait time to see how big he will get!!!
[QUOTE=jenbrin;7573302]
How does Heavenly Final Revelation cross with TB? I really like him.
Alliekat, What made you decide to breed to Rosmel’s Creme de Mint? He stands here in Colorado I believe & not far from us.[/QUOTE]
I actually got both mares from their breeder. He does stand out in Colorado now. Well worth the look
.
Thank you VirginiaBred and Samotis for the lovely comments on our little stallion Heavenly Final Revelation He is definitly “little” and just barely reaches 11hh… on a tall day. He is a Sec A Welsh and the ponies in his pedigree are mostly under 12hh as the UK standard for Sec A height is smaller than ours in Canada & the USA. As far as crossing him onto TB mares I personally LOVE the cross, at his RPSI stallion inspection the judge commented that he would recommend breeding him to mares who are either full TB or a high percentage of TB as he is rather compact and also VERY laidback. So far he has produced very good hunter type movers, has definitly thrown the gorgeous welsh head but most importantly (to me) he consistently passes on a great temperament! He really is considered a family pet around our farm and can easily be handled by anyone, anytime. Overall his foals are easy peasy to handle and the ones we have had are fun and simple to work with. All of these foals have also sold prior to their yearling year. His oldest foals are only 2 this year so are still too young for a performance record.
Thanks Samantha!
Since you first mentioned a cremello, I thought I’d bring up Goldhills Love The Blues. I believe his dam had some success as a hunter and his sire has hunter offspring as well. He is linebred on Sleight of Hand (#5 Pony Hunter Sire in 2013), and his sire was #42.
[QUOTE=Peaches;7576208]
Since you first mentioned a cremello, I thought I’d bring up Goldhills Love The Blues. I believe his dam had some success as a hunter and his sire has hunter offspring as well. He is linebred on Sleight of Hand (#5 Pony Hunter Sire in 2013), and his sire was #42.[/QUOTE]
Those particular Welsh bloodlines tend to throw a lot of height. There is likely no way the OP would get a pony when crossed with her 16.1 HH mare. But, there is always an exception to every rule…it just ends up being a gamble to test the boundaries. We have a Gayfields Call The Cops daughter and she is one of my favorite ponies!
