That’s my question. Perfect ty. I’ll figure out what Sam is technically
Yes. Which book the foal will be in will depend on several factors but the foal can be registered for sure and NAS is a full WBFSH member studbook, you can get a FEI passport for the foal, USEF registration is included, etc. Feel free to send me a PM or contact me through NAS and I’d be happy to talk you through the specifics.
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Oh ty!!!
I’ve just looked up the AES website and Weatherbys GSB (i.e. TB) is one of their recognised studbooks. I then looked up some TB sport stallions e.g. Future Prophecy and he is full TB registered with AES.
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Ugh so Sam is 75% tb . Dam is heraldik x godehard.
However it sounds like weixiao has a possible solution so thank you very much!!!
Hhhm. Ok that’s good to know.
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A breeder friend had 2 full siblings. Both by a TB stallion and out of a TB mare who had raced but no papers because owner pulled them. Stallion was accepted by GOV based on his stellar race record. My friend was able to get both registered GOV because they had the pedigree and DNA for the mare. One is a gelding so no worries about approval but mare should be able to be presented.
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I mean if you’re not pursuing live cover and jc registration. Then you need to pursue outside registration.(approval) Not different from each other. Sorry to be unclear.
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Is the stallion registered or inspected anything other than hockey club? It seems like even if you could get her in somewhere she would still have been bred to something you can’t register and might be kind of stuck?
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I skimmed through most of the replies, but, if I understand correctly that you own the mare, getting her registered as westphalian seems like the most straightforward way to get registerable babies (presumably *AWSSR).
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So the idea is to get the mare approved for a WB registry and then breed her to.a stallion approved for the same registry, and then register the foal.as a WB despite being pure TB genetically?
I don’t think it works like that? There is going to be an asterik or appendix or some kind of qualifications on the TB in the European based registries?
The sport horse or American or Canadian WB registries might do it.
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No, they will not. If you want to register it with the jockey club, it has to be live cover.
But i don’t want it to race!
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@Simkie It is Sunday evening and I’m listening to a programme on the radio, so of course I had to look up whether a horse must be TB to race. It has a history! In the UK the horse must be registered in the General Stud Book (GSB) i.e. a TB, the AQPS registry (French) or The Weatherby Non-TB Register (which before the arrival of European WB was where people registered their field hunters). So yes, non-TB can race. Mainly they don’t because full TBs are just faster. Which is why AQH and Arab racers both have gallons of TB blood. Gallons and gallons.
The “Jersey Act” was passed by the British Jockey Club in 1913 to prevent the registration of American bred horses in the General Stud Book. There were two reasons. A number of US states banned gambling in the early 20th century, which depressed TB racing in America, and considerable numbers of horses were then exported to Europe. Second, the Civil War destroyed breeding records and the registration of TBs began quite late in the US (1873) so the British racing establishment had doubts that the American horses were “purebred”. Nonetheless, many American horses had proved they were top class racehorses and won classic races prior to 1913. This regulation remained in force until 1949. It was relaxed because French TBs were unavailable to British and Irish breeders during and after WW2 and by 1949 any “impure” American blood was in the distant past.
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Not in the US, at the US tracks, in races that are written for Thoroughbreds.
Arabs do most certainly not have gallons of TB blood. Perhaps you’re thinking of anglo arabs.
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That’s too bad. Thems the rules. You don’t have to register it with the Jockey Club but if you want to register it has to be live cover.
Just something to keep in mind to add to your ever growing bulletin of questions - for most registries worth their salt, the TB mare must show she’s worth being bred – usually by scoring better in final marks (movement, type, conformation, etc) than a mare born into that registry. It’s different from registry to registry and not all share reciprocity with one another.
A good TB is worth a kingdom! But it sure is hard these days to fight the tide.
KPWN, the mare doesn’t have to be inspected at all as long as she is JC registered. HAN and HOL, I believe they have to score 7 or better in all (?) marks - its been a while since I’ve looked into it seriously. GOV may look at performance.
I can’t take Westfalen seriously since their hot potato blame game with TBs being the origin of WFFS. It’s supremely ironic to me to consider them a registry choice for a TB after that.
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You’re correct of course, but it doesn’t sound like the OP necessarily cares if the foal is registered as a WB. She just wants it to be eligible for breeding approval with WB registries, like any JC registered TB would be, only she’s planning an AI mating. It’s highly frustrating, hopefully the NAS option pans out!
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What full TB stallions are standing with WB approvals? The only registry that comes to mind is Trak and that will require a mare registered with the Trakehner registry. Possibly a stallion with Oldenburg NA as there are several approved stallions, but that will limit your stallion selection to a handful, and if you are breeding for a potential stallion prospect, pedigree selection and breeding direction are going to need to be more selective than what 1 or 2 prospective stallions can offer. You also are not guaranteed your mare will be approved in the mare books with inspection. It is more difficult to have TB mares approved bc they are looking for a specific type.
Your best bet is to breed live cover to produce a foal that can be registered with JC. You will have way more stallion selections this way. Then if you are lucky enough to produce a colt worthy of being a stallion, have the colt tested and granted approval with a WB registry. Keep in mind that the registry is going to take much consideration into the pedigree and what the mareline has produced. If you have your stallion proven in sport, they can approve based on performance but that is also a costly and risky route.
Also meant to add that registries look for genetic diversity amongst pedigrees and if using the son of an already approved TB stallion, that may work against you since the sire is already standing and offering those bloodlines. Registries are also looking for diversity amongst bloodlines proven in sport so choosing a TB stallion for your mare that offers that is important.
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