Arghhhhh!

[Sunflower]

But why post this video anywhere? What is the point? To sneer at the person riding? Even more puzzling given the age on this video. It did not happen yesterday. And now it is being posted that this is making the rounds of Facebook (which I do not do…) plus COTH plus Horse Show Diva. Really? Why?

While excoriating someone’s riding over the internet is not a laudable thing IMO, it is sadly an unavoidable part of the (over) use of social media. You might expect to see a video where “OMG, Fred Bloggs had a horrible round last night in the Big Bucks Grand Prix, OMG, OMG!” where something just happened.

But this video is not from yesterday or last week or last month.

It is an old video.

I don’t get why post it-- is there a constructive reason? Across all that media?

[findeight]

[QUOTE=Ponytoes;8505890]
So agree - my respect for his mom has gone - and watched her in the 70s with Chase the Clouds. Was one of my idols - not anymore regardless of when this was made or under what context- no excuse for this behavior ever in the show ring and would tolerate just a portion of it in the schooling ring.[/QUOTE]

I thought Leslie rode Chase the Clouds? Not Katie?

[BeeHoney]

The video is posted by shownet, so it is and probably has been public since around the time of the show. I also am mystified by the posting. There are many horse welfare issues out there, and I’m not particularly struck by this video as something we need to jump on to address. The horse was spanked twice after the refusal (perfectly reasonable), and received some firm hand corrections. I think it is really easy to judge a ride from the sidelines when you aren’t the one struggling with a strong or inattentive horse.

OP, your horse welfare energies would be better spent donating time or money to a reputable horse rescue.

[Sunflower]

So what on earth does the rider’s mother have to do with anything? Curiouser and curiouser.

[TRIPLEBAR]

Let me preface this by saying I am in no way a pro rider but here is what I see.

I watched that stop about a half a dozen times, and from what I observed that stop was HIS fault and not the horses fault. Coming to the fence it was very handsy and disorganised. But the horse got the spanking.

The hauling on the horses mouth and backing him up was also not necessary. He could have retired and went and schooled outside the ring. In fact, that poor horse needs a little more schooling in general, and not by him.

Same rider, different horse:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esVJbZ1H8FU

It seems to me that this rider knows nothing about being a soft or quiet rider. If you watch this course you will see he is very handsy, and the horses head is giraffed so far up from trying to get away from him ripping the horses face off.
He’s a butcher with those hands.

His seat is also all over the place.

And excuse me, but what the heck was that to the water?

[AmmyByNature]

This is all about the horse’s welfare, people.

Absolutely.

http://www.tinygif.com/data/media/8/blanche_not_sure.gif

(That gif indicates sarcasm, by the way. Somehow I feel like that needs to be explicitly mentioned.)

[Sunflower]

And if this is about horse welfare… then surely the responsible officials, etc, at the time had a full view of what was going on, as well as the video, to decide if there was some kind of rule violation. Is that the point of trying to viral this video, to say there was a rule infraction that was ignored? If so, no one seems to be saying this. If so, wouldn’t the thing to do be to contact the relevant official body and ask them about this? Posting it all over the net isn’t going to get that done.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=TRIPLEBAR;8506388]
Let me preface this by saying I am in no way a pro rider but here is what I see.

I watched that stop about a half a dozen times, and from what I observed that stop was HIS fault and not the horses fault. Coming to the fence it was very handsy and disorganised. But the horse got the spanking.

The hauling on the horses mouth and backing him up was also not necessary. He could have retired and went and schooled outside the ring. In fact, that poor horse needs a little more schooling in general, and not by him.

Same rider, different horse:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esVJbZ1H8FU

It seems to me that this rider knows nothing about being a soft or quiet rider. If you watch this course you will see he is very handsy, and the horses head is giraffed so far up from trying to get away from him ripping the horses face off.
He’s a butcher with those hands.

His seat is also all over the place.

And excuse me, but what the heck was that to the water?[/QUOTE]

That was a bad ride? I mean, it didn’t look like a winning equitation round… but that was a bad ride?

I think what happened to the water was… a mistake. It… happens. Apparently not only to him since he still won the class?!

The softest rider I know has one horse who really like to go go go and she does the same thing with her head even when his hands are soft as can be. Those are big jumps, he’s just supposed to float the reins and hope the distance comes?! Really? Or retire because the horse seems a bit fussy?

That first video isn’t one I’d put on my website as evidence of my best riding but I don’t get the torches and pitchforks over this guy.

[ybiaw]

This video is 3 years old.

[nu2u]

[QUOTE=Sunflower;8506375]
So what on earth does the rider’s mother have to do with anything? Curiouser and curiouser.[/QUOTE]

Ummmmm in this instance it is quite relevant…her name is Katie google is your friend

[m_m1]

I don’t know the ins and outs and whys and wherefores about this particular video surfacing on this particular day in multiple places.

However -

why is this type of thread valuable? Because, in my opinion, there is some value to these discussions.

Many years ago, before the internet, I had a friend who had the good fortune of having a horse worthy of sending to Florida to do the big-time hunters. She had the option of sending him to Margie (then) Goldstein. She flat-out refused. I thought she was nuts. A big name like that, willing to take on her horse?

But people she knew, and later, people I knew, said that Margie is pretty rough on horses. To this woman, winning was not the only important thing. She wanted her horse to have a good time, while winning. Which he did, with someone else.

So, if I had a horse that I was looking to send to someone, wouldn’t this be important information?

SendenHorse, the direct answer to your question is, in my opinion, if you are a public figure, it is understood that you are going to be critiqued. If you are riding in a Grand Prix that is being televised, therefore subject to everlasting life on Youtube, you know that you will be evaluated, discussed, critiqued and criticized. In my opinon, there is no moral dilemna. Even if it is supposed to be spelled “dilemma” these days.

[trubandloki]

[QUOTE=nu2u;8506428]
Ummmmm in this instance it is quite relevant…her name is Katie google is your friend[/QUOTE]
Please explain how instead of sending everyone to google.

Should your parent’s be tarred and feathered if you do something others do not like?

[Sunflower]

[QUOTE=nu2u;8506428]
Ummmmm in this instance it is quite relevant…her name is Katie google is your friend[/QUOTE]

I didn’t ask WHO the mother was. I asked what on earth she has to do with anything? How is it relevant? In trying to understand why this video has any relevance to anything unrelated to pitchforks, what the mother has to do with this is seemingly out in the ether.

[Sunflower]

[QUOTE=m&m;8506498]
I don’t know the ins and outs and whys and wherefores about this particular video surfacing on this particular day in multiple places.

However -

why is this type of thread valuable? Because, in my opinion, there is some value to these discussions.

Many years ago, before the internet, I had a friend who had the good fortune of having a horse worthy of sending to Florida to do the big-time hunters. She had the option of sending him to Margie (then) Goldstein. She flat-out refused. I thought she was nuts. A big name like that, willing to take on her horse?

But people she knew, and later, people I knew, said that Margie is pretty rough on horses. To this woman, winning was not the only important thing. She wanted her horse to have a good time, while winning. Which he did, with someone else.

So, if I had a horse that I was looking to send to someone, wouldn’t this be important information?

SendenHorse, the direct answer to your question is, in my opinion, if you are a public figure, it is understood that you are going to be critiqued. If you are riding in a Grand Prix that is being televised, therefore subject to everlasting life on Youtube, you know that you will be evaluated, discussed, critiqued and criticized. In my opinon, there is no moral dilemna. Even if it is supposed to be spelled “dilemma” these days.[/QUOTE]

Yes, people can certainly dig through Youtube and Instagram and whatever social media they want to find videos of people riding horses, and they might like the ride and they might hate the ride, or they might not have an opinion.

But let’s say I wanted to send a horse to Trainer X. Then I see a video of Trainer X on Youtube and I decide I do not want to send my horse to Trainer X after all.

Should I start a thread about that, splashing the video all over social media, or should I just move on?

No one has really explained why after being asleep for several years, this video has been revved up across COTH and Horse Show Diva within moments of each other, and now apparently Facebook.

Or what the motivation to do this is.

[findeight]

Nothing like an agenda…Sale go bad? Get beat? something more personal? See some trashing of other emerging young riders over on Diva too but don’t care to stay there too long. Reminds me of the bathrooms in high school.

No, it’s not a great example but without knowing the horse or circumstances? Not going to judge. Could be a remedial session after it took of off with a Junior or Ammy, these horses live on the road and learn they are pretty much immune from correction in the show ring. The only way to fix it is in the show ring under a Pro, that’s what they get paid for. And we don’t know who the owner/leaser was at the time or what they wanted done in that ring.

[nu2u]

First off I NEVER even commented on the riding, hypothesized about the possible scenarios/details we could not possibly know about let alone suggested “tar and feathering” anyone. I am not going to play jury or judge when I can not possibly know all the facts. One fact I (and many many others) do KNOW is that his mother is an extremely well known, high profile professional rider so many would expect that his worst day would be much better than most riders best day. Not going to debate, just stating the fact is mother is quite an accomplished professional so therefore mentioning her is relevant.

[Beam_Me_Up]

[QUOTE=Sunflower;8506553]

No one has really explained why after being asleep for several years, this video has been revved up across COTH and Horse Show Diva within moments of each other, and now apparently Facebook.

Or what the motivation to do this is.[/QUOTE]

On the conspiracy, I think that’s how social media works–someone digs up a video, posts it somewhere (here, FB, a blog), people share it. It is quite possible that whoever was searching for this video initially had ill intent, but I don’t think it necessarily follows that the OP of this thread is part of some plot. It’s not a shock that once it resurfaces people might be discussing it on multiple boards.

Think about the video of the (pentathlete?) on the gray show jumper, or Ed the naughty pony, or the 52 TBs needing homes. They just keep circulating.

Personally I think this video is much ado.

[Sunflower]

[QUOTE=nu2u;8506647]
First off I NEVER even commented on the riding, hypothesized about the possible scenarios/details we could not possibly know about let alone suggested “tar and feathering” anyone. I am not going to play jury or judge when I can not possibly know all the facts. One fact I (and many many others) do KNOW is that his mother is an extremely well known, high profile professional rider so many would expect that his worst day would be much better than most riders best day. Not going to debate, just stating the fact is mother is quite an accomplished professional so therefore mentioning her is relevant.[/QUOTE]

Relevant to what?

[nu2u]

Good freaking grief… of course it is relevant to mention (just mention, not make assumptions about how they felt) a rider’s trainer/close connections in the horseworld/people who have most definitely influenced and will continue to influence their physical and mental ‘skills’ when “commenting” on rider’s performance, especially if it is their mother who happens to be a high profile professional in the exact same discipline.

[Sunflower]

[QUOTE=nu2u;8506765]
Good freaking grief… of course it is relevant to mention (just mention, not make assumptions about how they felt) a rider’s trainer/close connections in the horseworld/people who have most definitely influenced and will continue to influence their physical and mental ‘skills’ when “commenting” on rider’s performance, especially if it is their mother who happens to be a high profile professional in the exact same discipline.[/QUOTE]

Which all begs the question: relevant to what?