At Wits End with OTTB Mare

[sassymares]

I have a 15.2 OTTB mare that for almost a year in a half was a very pleasant to ride and was coming along very well working primarily on basic lateral work and stretching down to accept the bit. Over the winter she was ridden in a smooth d ring snaffle and did great. We moved to the outdoor ring smoothly without much fuss but once we started jumping more seriously (3’-3’3") and training for the competitive season she has become an absolute hot mess. My trainer and I are the only people that have ever ridden her (had a 4 year laydown directly after coming off the track) I’m a strong believer in good flat work but I can’t even flat her without my arms basically falling off. Her main problem is she is a very forward thinking horse, but when I ask her to keep a consistent, relaxed pace she gets very frustrated and flips her head around which has lead to many rears or grab the bit with her teeth and throw her head down which gets me off balance and then she takes off.

Right now she is jumped in a happy mouth single jointed dutch gag (double reins on the first two rings) and a figure 8 noseband with a running martingale. I try my very best to flat her in a copper alloy french link lose ring with a regular cavesson but she yanks my arms out even with my best attempt to ride her back to front and hold her with my seat. I have tried having her go in a Hackamore which was a bad idea, she took off and with no means off stopping her I had to jump off. I have tried all sorts of regular snaffles, gags, and pelhams. She hates chains even though I have tried leather and vetwrap covered ones. Lately I have been very scared to ride her instead of my usual extreme confidence. I don’t enjoy our early morning hacks like I used to and at this point she would be sold if it weren’t for the fact she is an absolutely fabulous jumper that has one lots of jumper derbys and events. Should I just deal with the fact that she always be kooky and try to work with her? I have had multiple conversations and we are both out of ideas and I decided to try COTH for a fresh perspective. Any ideas/critique welcome! Thanks!

[supershorty628]

Have you tried a waterford?

[sassymares]

I have not and didn’t think of that. I will have to try it my next ride! I think the boarder next to me has one.

[enjoytheride]

It sounds like you might need a different program. Sometimes OTTBs are so naturally forward and obedient that it can be pretty easy to push them up the fences in height while forgetting some of the relaxing and methodical work that helps them relax. If you can’t even flat her you might have to back off the jumping until you fill that gap.

[GraceLikeRain]

Do you have a video available?

[Cherry]

What enjoytheride said!

You may be in high school, but your horse is still in kindergarten! Patience is the key when training TBs.

Try your horse in a loose ring French snaffle. Nothing to grab hold of to yank out of your hands.

If you are having trouble with your balance that could be setting the horse off. The horse is trying to tell you “get out of my mouth!,” with that yanking–learn to use your seat to slow the horse down and to stop. That yanking will stop!

[mjs8]

Do you mind if I ask what height she was jumping before? And was she going quietly, calmly, etc?

My gut on what your post was saying, is that since asking her for more height, she’s rushing and getting really strong. In my opinion, the bit isn’t the problem; insecurity with the new requests is perhaps the issue.

When she is jumping, do you feel now with the new height you’re having to wrestle her a bit more? You mentioned feeling like your arms were being ripped out. What happens if you let go and don’t give her anything to lean on? Sometimes I’ve found that especially with sensitive horses, if you grab their mouths upon approach or landing, they start to anticipate it. Jumping = two point = racing maybe in the OTTB mind? If you don’t give her something to grab maybe she’ll chill?

(I worked with a 5 year old OTTB not long ago with similar issue. Bolted after fences and threw head, stated bolting at approach. I starting releasing the contact a TON, and patting him on the neck after each fence, and he actually starting breaking to the trot after fences, even with his 100 pound teen owner when she tried this method).

Just my two cents. Might be worth a try if nothing else?

[sassymares]

All winter we were jumping the same height of 3’-3’3" and it was not a problem. She actually is easier to handle the higher the jumps are which is not good in my opinion. She is really hardest on the flat and over 2’-2’6" fences. My trainer and I a couple weeks ago did an excercise where I jumped without hands to make sure it wasn’t me accidentally hitting her in the mouth and making her anxious or having to much contact making her angry and it was the same result, directly after the fence I had to give several big big woahs to get her cantering in a more organized fashion.

[BLBGP]

Have you tried using your weight to slow her instead of your hands?

[sassymares]

Yes. I have been working on at the walk to the halt stopping her with only my body and no hands on the reins while we warm up. Once we start jumping and I try to hold her with my weight she does this up and down kind of canter-rear.

[yourcolorfuladdictio]

[QUOTE=sassymares;8653589]
Yes. I have been working on at the walk to the halt stopping her with only my body and no hands on the reins while we warm up. Once we start jumping and I try to hold her with my weight she does this up and down kind of canter-rear.[/QUOTE]

It sounds like she gets behind your leg. You need to work on expansion and compression of the canter without having jumps involved.

[skipollo]

[QUOTE=mjs8;8653554]
Do you mind if I ask what height she was jumping before? And was she going quietly, calmly, etc?

My gut on what your post was saying, is that since asking her for more height, she’s rushing and getting really strong. In my opinion, the bit isn’t the problem; insecurity with the new requests is perhaps the issue.

When she is jumping, do you feel now with the new height you’re having to wrestle her a bit more? You mentioned feeling like your arms were being ripped out. What happens if you let go and don’t give her anything to lean on? Sometimes I’ve found that especially with sensitive horses, if you grab their mouths upon approach or landing, they start to anticipate it. Jumping = two point = racing maybe in the OTTB mind? If you don’t give her something to grab maybe she’ll chill?

(I worked with a 5 year old OTTB not long ago with similar issue. Bolted after fences and threw head, stated bolting at approach. I starting releasing the contact a TON, and patting him on the neck after each fence, and he actually starting breaking to the trot after fences, even with his 100 pound teen owner when she tried this method).

Just my two cents. Might be worth a try if nothing else?[/QUOTE]

^^^^all of this. My OTTB started bolting/dragging me to fences and taking off on the backside after a few months of being totally relaxed about it. I was catching him in the mouth, and it’s very offensive to a sensitive forward OTTB. They’re not going to forgive you for it. It got to the point where I could trot to the a tiny crossrail on the buckle, and he would STILL anticipate and bolt.

I spent months walking over tiny jumps on the buckle and making a big to-do after the jump (“what a good boy!” tons of patting his neck, etc.)

He was also a hot head on the flat and wanted to go go go, and a lot of it was rider error. I liked to perch/pose, which made everything stiff and braced feeling for him. I had to relearn the basics of w/t/c properly, and he was a much happier horse after that.

I’ve used these videos as examples before, but here’s the before/after. The first video shows everything I was doing wrong (it’s a pretty embarrassing video…)

Braced, stiff, trying to perch…

Same lead, same everything two years later:

Relearned how to ride correctly

Same lead, just this past winter:

He’s a little out of shape, but you get the idea

One of the biggest changes between all of these videos was me: no longer bracing, riding with a stiff ‘hot’ seat, giving him somewhere to go with my hands. The last video was in a halter with a rope.

A video of your horse under saddle would be helpful for other posters to give you suggestions!

[pinkpony321]

Two things jump to mind:

I’ve noticed many TBs have a relatively shallow palate. I find that French links, etc, work better than traditional snaffles.

Have you had her teeth checked lately? In your OP you mention she flips her head around…could this be a pain response?

[LookmaNohands]

I would look for pain. Have you checked saddle fit? Have you had Chiropractor or Osteopath look at her? Have you had her teeth done lately?

I always start with the body. Locally, most people will check for Lyme and EPM. Are they a problem in your area?

Is her top line well muscled?

[enjoytheride]

Another thing I wanted to comment on is you’ve made the move from the indoor to the outdoor. Indoors naturally back a horse off because of the space and having solid walls so it’s likely a problem that has been lurking in the woods all winter.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

[QUOTE=sassymares;8653427]
I don’t enjoy our early morning hacks like I used to and at this point she would be sold if it weren’t for the fact she is an absolutely fabulous jumper that has one lots of jumper derbys and events. [/QUOTE]

Just out of curiosity–were the derbies and events outdoor events? How long ago was this and what bit was she ridden in when she was being shown in them?

[Small_Change]

I also wonder about hormones - lots of mares will get a little loopy when they begin to cycle again in the spring, and some will even get sore through their backs. We’ve got one in the barn who MUST go on ReguMate as soon as the mild weather hits in the spring, or she’s an anxiety basket (thankfully, the rest of the mares don’t even blink with the seasons changing).

[FLeventer]

This is my mare 100%. I got her because she was such a looney tune after her polo training. I put a year of flat work into her with lots of poles. I took her out at training level (3’3) to back her off with height and she did 2 events then bumped to prelim (3’7).

Horse is a got mess over fences in SJ. Its a lot of deep breaths. She shakes her head, pulls, and canters in place when nervous. Its a lot of making sure you are in balanced as well as keeping the horse calm. Dont yank but dont let her hang.

I give my girl Depo monthly, doesnt really make much difference. Shes hot hot hot and no matter how much turnout, vet, massage, feed, hay, and whatever changes its all the same. Either you can deal with it or not. The more the fences go up, the better she backs off. I cant jump her under 3’ without her becoming uncontrollable and hot.

I personally like it, a lot of people hate it. Shes a beast on XC and fun to hunt. Love my hot mare but its not for everyone. If you aren’t having fun maybe its time for a change.

[crosscreeksh]

Increase her turn out time and CUT out her grain!!!

[snowrider]

We had this happen with a horse this spring. Turns out she was footsore which was making her back/ hock sore. Going back into the indoor with softer footing turned her back into a nice rideable horse. The outdoor footing had dried out so quickly it set up really hard this spring, it’ll get fixed and mare will possibly get pads for a round of shoeing and hopefully that’ll be it.

I’d try taking her back in the indoor for a week or to the arena or grass paddock with the softest footing you have, and see if she gets better. Also have the farrier or vet throw some hoof testers on her. I would hold off on anything like injecting hocks or x-raying feet until you see if the footing fixes the issue. If they are foot sore they will become body sore too but it’s not the ultimate issue.