Sorry, she raised this person.
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Thatās the issue of lesser included charges. If they are going to consider a lesser included charge like assault, I think that would happen as a menu of charges (attempted murder or assault, but not both) at the conclusion of the original trial. If assault is not included as a possible option for the jury in the original trial, I donāt think they could bring it up later.
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Hmm? Who raised what person?
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^ Interesting, thanks.
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In a prior post I think we determined NJ for a murder charge wouldnāt include assault with a weapon as a lesser included offense due to the Elements issue of a weapon not being a necessary part of the definition of murder.
If Iām wrong please someone correct me.
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Well, I didnāt agree to that statement; weāre not talking about murder here.
The main charge is attempted murder. If itās proven that he stood there and shot her, but they canāt prove intent to kill, that sounds like the elements of assault to me. But IANAL.
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they are referring to your post about our guestā¦
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Thatās not how it works.
The places that use the Elements standard maintain that a charge includes a lesser included offense if that offense is a necessary component of a crime. Iām thinking murder and attempted murder would be similar. The element in question is that a weapon is not a necessary element of murder. Meaning the definition of murder (and/or attempted murder) does not necessitate a weapon being used. The weapon isnāt included in the definition of murder.
The definition of murder is causing someone intentionally to die or acts that are done in order to get the desired outcome and intention of having someone die.
The weapon part isnāt part of the definition therefore using Assault with a deadly weapon would NOT be a lesser included offense using the Elements standard.
Likewise Attempted murder would follow suit as itās just the attempted/tried to version of murder which is already defined above.
If I have this wrong please correct me.
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Sorry, was responding to KK post - I mean parents have a responsibility - I am puzzled that a mother would support this kind of behavior -and support the outbursts on SM.and go on line and support her daughters outbursts - I find it bafflingā¦ MB was wrong to shoot her -I have no idea what happened - but am shocked by LK responses and the response from her mother. i say it repeatedlyā¦āwho raises these peopleā btw: on both sides.
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The family dynamics of any family is usually not understood by others.
Iām personally more curious about the trial and those dynamics. I look forward to seeing how our justice system deals with all the nuances within the story and progression of events.
So much is outside the norm in this situation!
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There is no āassault with a deadly weaponā in NJ, as Iāve said before. There are ways to get a conviction of assault where a deadly weapon is involved, but itās not required for assault. In NY, it is clear that certain lesser offenses are included within certain crimes. I am certain that attempted murder canāt be a lesser included offense within a first degree murder charge in NJ (per the jury instructions). It didnāt seem that aggravated assault would be either, but I may be incorrect about that.
I am not qualified to be the criminal law, criminal procedure, or evidence professor. I mostly deal with federal civil suits and federal administrative proceedings (and, frankly, negotiating settlements far more often than getting very deep into trial), so Iām much more current on civil procedure than criminal.
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What is the purpose of all these snotty, sarcastic, belittling and demeaning responses? Literally every rely you post sounds like this, no matter who you are responding to. Surely there is a way to refute inaccuracies without sounding like you wear pink on Wednesdays? I donāt understand what you are trying to accomplish here.
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Where in NY? Processing takes a long time so in a city of any reasonable size it would be impossible to be processed so fast as to allow for all that to be released and do more crime.
Some states throw everything at the wall to see what sticks. I think that might work better in some ways for the public safety.
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Iām more civil oriented myself as my criminal law days were long ago.
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well, you guys know how to read legal talk.
My question is how much of this depends on the interpretation of the DA for filing charges and the ruling judge who presides over the case?
Is that not a matter of interpretation?
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NJ has laws/statutes that are written out with definitions and they charge according to that though there may be some wiggle room.
I donāt know how much wiggle room NJ prosecutors have and I canāt answer why they wouldnāt have charged a laundry list of stuff.
I need someone way smarter than I in NJ criminal law. I can research and read but sometimes reading the law and application of the law somehow differs.
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Apparently he got a pretty good jump on the day, starting shortly after midnight. According to a different article, he did several thousand dollars worth of damage to the stolen vehicle. Not to mention the other vehicles.
And in the video of his arrest, somehow he still had a cigarette in his mouth after he was handcuffed. At that point, a policeman finally yanked it out of his mouth and threw it on the ground.
The bail reform laws in New York that took place within the last couple of years seem to be a huge failure in my mind, but Iām no expert on the subject.
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Yikes! Thatās a heck of a story!
No idea about bail reform. Pile those charges on!
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Who said anything about a weapon? You can attempt to murder someone without a weapon and you can assault someone without a weapon. Seems to me the difference is whether or not there was an intent to kill.
The weapons charge is a separate charge.
