I don’t know if it was going off steroids or not, but the horse definitely didn’t look the same. As soon as he swapped leads in the last turn, it was most definitely over. I am glad that it seems he’s ok.
Why are steroids legal in the first place?
[QUOTE=J. Turner;3272171]
Now start the dreams for Nicanor to start where Barbaro left off! Wouldn’t it be wonderful if Bobby’s little brother did it! Or at least finished it![/QUOTE]
I was thinking just this morning about this… but to have a horse as great at Barbaro only a few years later sounds almost impossible to me. But no one deserves it more than Matz and the Jacksons… great people.
I agree with acertainsmile. If it aint broke, why fix it? Why off steroids now, and I also heard that they decided not to tube him with electrolites either. Me thinks this was the wrong race to try new things.
Dick Dutrow tempted the racing gods and got exactly what he deserved. Sorry Dick, but I enjoyed watching you sweat your ass off on the way back.
Wait, I thought there was no reason to run the race since it was a forgone conclusion. All the other horses were inferior? Dutrow got what he deserved. I hope Big Brown is OK. That stud fee just went down the crapper really fast.
I watched a Triple Crown show on ESPN last night, in which Bud Delp was interviewed. He gave a detailed accounting of the pin. It was in the horse’s hoof in the morning, not in the frog but in the lamina, and it was removed. The horse did not race with a pin stuck in his hoof, according to Delp.
[QUOTE=Drvmb1ggl3;3272275]
There is no way in the world the jock can be blamed. There was no horse under him. Anyone with a pair of eyes can see that. He was in trouble in the turn, and being pushed and then got a crack of the whip and there was no response.[/QUOTE]
Oh, I totally agree. I saw it. But as “outspoken”, shall we say, as the trainer has been, and with the comments earlier in the week about morning works, it was just the very first thought that crossed my mind - that’s all.
A horse who’s been on steroids as regularly as BB probably was needs to get off steroids gradually, not cold turkey. So it could have been a factor no doubt. Couple this with the fact that BB may have not taken well to the sudden heat and humidity, without any chance to acclimate; and getting scrunched up and tangled in other horses as he was trying to get off the rail - which he obviously didn’t react well to (he was throwing his head up and looked pretty upset)- all of this could certainly have been contributing factors. I suppose there could be more, who knows at this point.
I have to echo everyone’s kudos to Kent. I think his decision not to keep asking BB to try when he knew his horse was not himself, was heroic. I put him in the same category as Edgar on Barbaro, same keen caring wise behavior by a jock in an extremely high-pressure situation - in a not so dramatic and obvious scenario.
[QUOTE=Iride;3272753]
A horse who’s been on steroids as regularly as BB probably was needs to get off steroids gradually, not cold turkey. So it could have been a factor no doubt. Couple this with the fact that BB may have not taken well to the sudden heat and humidity, without any chance to acclimate; and getting scrunched up and tangled in other horses as he was trying to get off the rail - which he obviously didn’t react well to (he was throwing his head up and looked pretty upset)- all of this could certainly have been contributing factors. I suppose there could be more, who knows at this point.
I have to echo everyone’s kudos to Kent. I think his decision not to keep asking BB to try when he knew his horse was not himself, was heroic. I put him in the same category as Edgar on Barbaro, same keen caring wise behavior by a jock in an extremely high-pressure situation - in a not so dramatic and obvious scenario.[/QUOTE]
There’s that “Barbaro” word again… 
It’s fate! Bring on Nicanor!
Just saw something that hinted at the possibility of a flipped palate…?
Don’t know, of course…
[QUOTE=Huntertwo;3272333]
I don’t understand why they would have taken a chance taking him off the Steroids for the biggest race of his career. 
Could Steroids possibly be the result of his previous wins? And how will that affect his breeding? Will mare owners be willing to breed knowing this Stud cannot perform unless on Steroids? IF that is indeed the fact?
Just quite a coincidence Kent had no horse compared to the Derby and Preakness.[/QUOTE]
Are there fertility issue linked to equines and steroid use? Maybe with the financial agreement w/ Three Chimneys they wrote in a no steroid clause? Just grasping at straws …
[QUOTE=J. Turner;3272776]
Are there fertility issue linked to equines and steroid use? Maybe with the financial agreement w/ Three Chimneys they wrote in a no steroid clause? Just grasping at straws …[/QUOTE]
That would be a stupid business move on Three Chimneys part. If it’s not broken, don’t fix it. Three Chimneys had just as much invested in BB winning the tripple crown as his owners. If they put in that clause, all they can blame in themselves for this loss… and the loss is stud fees.
[QUOTE=Ashby;3272658]
That child horrified me. I have seldom seen anything so vulgar.[/QUOTE]
I swear, the Belmont’s music has gotten worse and worse ever since they switched to “New York, New York”. This was the absolute nadir.
Regarding Barbaro’s little brother, I’ll definitely wait and see, as frankly I wasn’t remotely ready to crown Barbaro as great, either. In fact I can’t think of any recent Derby winner worthy of the title. (And in a thoroughly shallow vein I wish that camp would come up with better names. Barbaro is as bad as Giacomo. They don’t sound like classic names. Silver Charm, War Emblem, Charismatic…those were good names.)
[QUOTE=danceronice;3272827]
I (And in a thoroughly shallow vein I wish that camp would come up with better names. Barbaro is as bad as Giacomo. They don’t sound like classic names. Silver Charm, War Emblem, Charismatic…those were good names.)[/QUOTE]
The Jacksons name each of their horses after the hunting dogs in a painting that hangs in their home.
They said that Big Brown had been off steroids since April - I doubt that would have affected him if that was the case. He looked sore in behind in the post parade and especially as he was eased. I doubt that was the cause or the total cause , but seemed like a combination of the weather, being somewhat sore, the terrible start (he came over and bumped the 2 horse badly and bumped him again later in the race, was rank, clipped heels, got yanked around and then got outside and was pushed further outside by the horse running beside him). As a matter of fact, if this were any other race and he had won it, he probably would have come down for interfering with that horse (moot point now). Seems to me that everything caught up with him and maybe his running style won’t allow for that much contact and direction. I’m sure Kent and Dutrow are 2nd guessing everything - probably should have let him run a bit when hegot that clear spot on the inside, but it was a bit too early to tell waht the pace was going to be like. If he HAD put him on the lead that early and lost, we’d be calling Kent stupid for putting him on the lead lol! The bottom line is that, if yu win you are a hero and if you lose everyone second guesses, but we’ll just never know.
Stud fee is not down the drain - this horse still won the Derby and the Preakness, and maybe they will change their plans and point him to the Breeder’s Cup (if he’s not injured and has time to heal that quarter crack). Yes, the stud fee will be much less, but still pretty high.
If I’m the owner of BB, I am grateful for Kent for pulling him up to prevent any further injury. It was very obvious that coming off the back stretch BB had no more to give. Look at Eight Belles who broke down AFTER the race. Kent took preventative measures for a horse he loves and I respect him for that.
Now I LOVE a great conspiracy theory…;)…who knows…Rick Dutrow being the gambler he is/was could have bet against BB, talked him up in the media (something he had not done before), guaranteed victory which brought the odds down making a bigger payoff for him when BB lost and then not talking to the press afterwards so as to not give anything away…and then Dutrow and Kent split the profit!!! I choose to believe this didn’t happen though!!
I like those names. Now, Lil E Tee, that would have been an embarassing name for TC winner (yes, before someone tells me the obvious, I know he didn’t win the Preakness). Smarty Jones also likely offended the racing gods with his name.
Do you think a jockey on BB in the Belmont is under so much scrutiny that it would affect his decision whether to push for home or not? I’m not sure I’ve ever heard a jockey give up just because ‘he had no horse’, especially in such a huge race, I mean he might have been third… who knows? But with all of the uproar with whip usage, Eight Belles, etc leading up to this, I feel like he was really under the microscope.
[QUOTE=Iride;3272753]
A horse who’s been on steroids as regularly as BB probably was needs to get off steroids gradually, not cold turkey. [/QUOTE]
I seem to vividly recall Dutrow telling the press during the pre-Preakness interviews that BB received his monthly Winstrol shot on the 15th, as did the rest of his horses (he also said, “it’s good for them” :rolleyes:). That would be May 15th, two days before the Preakness. Those statements are what lead to the current steroid controversy.
Now Dutrow claims the horse hadn’t received a dose since April 15th? Call me a “Doubting Thomas”. 
My take on the race is that BB got boxed in early and gave up when strongly reined in. He got PO’d and gave the jock a “the hell with it” attitude. He obviously needed a position further from the rail.
While he may have been under the microscope, I don’t think he made a poor decision here. I watched him use the whip and he got NO reaction at all. Nothing. Nada. That’s NOT normal for Big Brown. After a couple of tries, I think he was right to assume something was wrong.
If he got the shot on May 15th, then how can steroid withdrawal be to blame? His next scheduled shot wouldn’t be until June 15…
ETA - Everything I have read, however, says April 15 was his last shot.
