What exactly are you wanting in a sales video to show temperament and rideability?
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This is just me, but I look at a lot of sales videos of OTTBs who are recently off the track. There are many flipper who ride horses in that phase of training day-in and day-out, and they can can make pretty much any horse behave under saddle well enough to get a 4 second clip of a walk, trot, canter and a couple jumps.
That’s a great skill. It displays the horse’s gaits. That’s totally important, but it doesn’t usually show me what that horse is like to ride beyond having those W/T/C buttons installed. I think some flippers might get desensitized to what a buyer needs to see because they’re so used to churning out horses with similar training levels.
The written descriptions will say that a horse is light or easy to work with and the videos look like that horse is being strong armed just as much as a horse they say is struggling. Again, this is just me, but especially if there’s a seller who has a reputation of discouraging second rides for prospective buyers, I’d like to see how the horse is on a looser rein in order to see their steerability, transitions. If you look at the Secretariat Center’s video, for example, I can generally get an impression of how rideable that horse is, not just what their gaits look like.
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She has videos of the horses being tacked up and ridden for quite some time (not just a 4 second clip). Why are you not able to test the loose rein or whatever else on the first ride?
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Riding on a loose rein isn’t a universal skill. I think on the rare fresh off the track baby capable of going around on the buckle, that’s always highlighted in the benchmark description and video. Realistically, I’d assume any 3-5 year old fresh off the track doesn’t really steer in a standard sense or understand how to ride on a loose rein. If I had reservations about my ability or my trainers ability to teach these fundamentals, I don’t think a fresh OTTB is a logical choice. I find the benchmark videos and descriptions to be uniquely comprehensive.
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I have stayed mum on this thread, but I can’t bite my tongue any longer with statements like this one.
You have to compare apples to apples.
A 501(c ) 3 non-profit that retrains and rehomes thoroughbreds for some of the wealthiest benefactors in the industry is totally different than a reseller sourcing upper level prospects straight off the track as a business.
A horse with 90+ days retraining at the Secretariat Center is not the same as a horse who raced Friday and is being taken over its first fences on Wednesday, which is often the case with Benchmark horses.
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I can appreciate that – but this isn’t a retrain – and prices reflect that. She has seen bunches and bunches of these guys, and she offers her opinions of what they will probably be like under ideal circumstances. 
I’d rather have an educated “eye on the ground” that can help me select something that is more likely to be appropriate for my needs than paying a bit more for a substandard “retrain” that I may need to undo.
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Sure. I’m not criticizing her pricing at all.
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I think I get what you’re saying–light contact vs. being chased into the bridle. I don’t think anyone expects a freshly off-track TB to be loping around on the buckle, but my own OTTBs were re-started on a much lighter contact. I think it’s just a matter of training philosophy.
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I agree “upper level prospects” wasn’t the best choice of words. I didn’t mean it literally that it’s upper level prospects all the time.
What I meant she is sourcing horses that will be monetarily valuable to buyers, usually because of competition potential. Or at least that is the goal. This is a different goal than a nonprofit that is trying out to place horses into long term homes. Even somewhere like the Secretatiat Center who is more selective for a nonprofit isn’t sourcing the same type of horses.
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This sort of struck me, too. I do not know what Benchmark’s definition of upper level is–the only thing that makes sense to me given how often horses are listed as being UL prospects is if it’s Training. I don’t think of Training as UL (maybe Prelim? more probably I and A), but I know some people do. If that is the case, then sure, most decently sound and trained horses can get around that level. After that, things get more exacting and the field begins to narrow. I don’t think the majority of her clientele want to do/will end up doing UL stuff, either, even if they also think of that as Training.
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Oh, that makes sense. But she does list many of her horses as UL prospects, so it’s her meaning I was thinking about.
ETA: I would add that she has a great eye and knows what the market is interested in. I think her videos are good at showing horses working positively and doing various things within her particular program, and that has a lot of value. There are plenty of other resellers out there, so if her sales structure and approach doesn’t work for someone, it’s not like there are no other options! I’m not sure why this is a problem- people can present themselves and their horses however they wish, and if a buyer doesn’t like it, they can buy from someone else.
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Oh, I wasn’t critiquing your use of the word. I agree. I was replying to @Amberley saying she isn’t sourcing all upper level prospects. Fair enough. When I used the phrase, I wasn’t thinking anyone would interpret it literally to imply she has a barn full of upper level prospects. I think most people understand how it works.
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I mentioned the content of SC videos because I thought they’d be a familiar reference. I didn’t mean to suggest that these are identical business models. I understand that it is different population of horses than what a flipper can typically access, but they’re in the same phase of training. SC shows first rides, second rides etc. if the horse sticks around for 3 months, they might get a 90 day video update. I’ve seen Benchmark videos of rides 90 days in too.
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oooo I have a video sortof like what @anonevent was talking about.
We made this before he became the “Not fit for resale due to increased liability” when we saw he was symptomatic to KS and had broken a previous owner’s tailbone.
However… handling with my hubby, FABULOUS. And he’s pretty to look at and LOVES to be fed treats.
But yea…NOT safe for me to sell.
Em
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@Xctrygirl. The face your husband gave you when you asked if he could bring the horse in was priceless. 
When my hubby would help me I always had him catch-up my big gelding. However wrong the halter was put on or whatever way he was led in that horse would take it all in stride. He never took advantage or reacted badly. A total saint of a horse.
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Aww your DH is adorable 
I did want him to stop dragging the lead rope but what a sweet video 
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Yea the internal twitching it causes in me… LOL 
But “Lad” is a good soul. We’re currently trying to find a field board place as he needs friends and MORE space to play.
Em
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He obviously doesn’t have my ‘foresight of disaster’ gene. I probably wouldn’t trip over the lead, but I can picture myself doing so.
Eons ago at my old job they had one of those spike things you could push receipts down on (not a diner, but that’s the only other place I remember seeing one) and I had very vivid images of tripping and having go through my eyeball into my brain 
I know I’m messed up in the head, and I’m not really super clumsy, but sheesh, I always imagine the worst!
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Buyer beware.
Jessica talks a good game. I purchased Final Deception from her. I am now 7 months after purchase and KS post-op and have never even ridden my boy. Options were surgery, pasture ornament, euthanasia. Worst case my vet has ever seen, hands down. Almost killed my trainer within weeks of arriving. She was clearly not upfront with what she passed as minor and resolving issues. She passes health issues as “behavioral.” Stated my horse was “sound” in many sale ads. Feel free to look them up. Looking back, she told me her “friend” owned this horse but didn’t have time to work with him and when asked, she could not even tell me his barn name.
“He raced 3x and retired back in 2021 sound, no injuries and has no vices. He has since been a casual use pleasure horse. My friend LOVES this horse but she simply did not have the time to keep him in the program that he needs and she thought he deserved to shine.”…Your “friend”, you don’t know barn name and can’t find out?
Jessica told me her friend (previous owner) rode him without issue. Had him for over 2 years OTT. Told me his bottled up behavior seen on video was minor, nothing more. Denied more explosive behavior. Told me her “friend has a tendency to back horses off. She’s a timid rider.” She told me these “training issues” were resolved with a new bit. Such nonsense. This horse almost killed my trainer within weeks of him arriving. To clarify, he is a LOVE of a horse with a huge fan club at my barn. He was in pain. Pain Redman passed as “behavioral.”
Sales ad: “Now look I really hate saying things that might sound like I am being critical of others but I try to talk about horses the way that I see things. I think riding a horse like this is very difficult which is what I say about a lot of my very athletic super huge moving horses. This horse is simply incredible but right now he totally doesn’t believe he can go forward without getting punished. He kept popping to the canter but then wanting to go up and down and buck because he was just “stuck” and really worried he was going to get popped in the mouth or disciplined. When people tell me about horses that buck/rear/etc this is often exactly why. You can so see these things in the video but Stacy does a masterful job of just allowing in all the ways she can. I put some of that in the end of the video because honestly it is a good example of what happens when horses get bottled up and become afraid to go forward. You don’t want a horse just going up and down because at one point he ripped a huge buck and almost unseated her. He wasn’t being mean he just honestly didn’t believe we really meant forward.
You sort of have to tactfully work this out and it will take us a few rides. I also go to a softer bit (I like a nathe/duo/etc) to encourage him to take the bit/bridle and have less worry in the mouth.”
My take, this broker oversteps with her opinions. “Doesn’t believe he can go forward without getting punished” and “worried he was going to get popped in the mouth or disciplined”
…Facts = 7 dorsal spinous processes. Degenerative, sclerotic, cysts you could put a thumb though. Hello, this horse was in pain. Such a reach in her opinions.
Lesson…a horse with “behavioral” issues is ALWAYS in pain until proven otherwise. Light horses up no matter what the vet says. Never listen to a brokers take on things no matter how reputable you think they might be. I trusted the history I was provided about her friend owning and riding him for over 2 years OTT without issue. Who’s lying? Will never know. But definitely someone was. There is no way this horse was ridden for 2 years without issue.
I used an area vet she recommended, she is known to all of them because she sells a ton of horses per year. I told him I wanted to get radiographs. He told me no need for them. Told me, this horse is solid, “I would have loved to buy him for my wife.” I trusted him. Bad move. My vet found this questionable. Why would
a vet deter a client from getting XRs? Lesson, light all her horses up. Make them glow. My vet who diagnosed KS looked at the sale videos and told me straight that she would have started with the back. Hindsight 20/20.
To boot, Redman posts about KS all the time…how it’s no big deal, take a chance on a KS horse. So says the broker with the unsaleable horse. She refused to return my phone calls. I think I was pretty clear I actually wanted to speak to her. I’m still waiting on the call back.
“Hi Jessica, this is xxxxx. I purchased Final Deception from you. Please give me a call when you have a moment.”
“My reception is bad here at the farm. Can you text me?”
“I’m heading out to dinner. Is there a time tomorrow when we can talk?”
"Text me anytime! "
End game. This horse is 7 yrs, 17.3. Young and powerful. If her close friend was really riding him this severe a pathology would have been experienced under saddle, the same way my trainer experienced it within weeks of him arriving. THIS BROKER ALMOST KILLED SOMEONE WITH HER PERCEPTION OF “BEHAVIOR.” BUYER BEWARE. LIGHT THAT HORSE UP. THIS BROKERS END GAME IS QUANTITY, NOT QUALITY.
Jessica, clean your ads from your opinions. If a horse shows dangerous behavior, look into it. You almost got someone killed. Do better. Return phone calls.
“Text me anytime!”
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QFP. Have some thoughts here that I’m too tired to articulate right now… Manana.
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