Best Inexpensive "French Type" Saddles (like CWD, Butet, Childeric, etc)

[buschkn]

My SO and his kids ride, and we need a new saddle. I wouldn’t mind having something I like to ride in too, as a second saddle when I am riding several in a row.

Any idea or suggestions for something that is decent quality but maybe a new or used one for under $1000? They don’t ride enough to justify a super high dollar saddle right now.

Any help appreciated!

[hunterrider23]

Pessoa or prestige.

[fannyeaton]

I have the Dover Special Eq Premier and I really like it. It is a great saddle first saddle and a great saddle for jumping due to its flat seat.

[GoodTimes]

I’ve got an equipe expression as my second saddle, I use it for breaking babies, or if someone is tacking up horses for me. You could probably find a used one in that price range.
It’s standing up quite well, the seat is comfortable, puts my leg in the same place as my childeric, and is just a nice saddle to look at.

[Anne]

If you can find a used Forestier Atlanta, they are very similar to a Butet and the leather quality (at least used to be) great.

[jn4jenny]

A hard question to answer without knowing your exact priorities. But FWIW…

1. Maximum overall quality for the dollar, but still with a French-ish feel: catch one of the British or Italian brands trying to fake like a French brand. The discontinued Dominus Close Contact and Dominus Showjumping saddles are kings of this, as are the much more rare Harry Dabbs Porsche 911 saddle, the Jaguar XJS saddle, and the practically-a-unicorn Cobra Close Contact saddle (I’ve seen ONE in my entire life so don’t waste your time Googling too hard for that one!)

Normally I would recommend the Dominus Bruce Davidson, which is a GREAT saddle under $1000, but it’s not one I would buy for kids…unless they’re built like Gumby. It’s truly a saddle for long-legged riders, as you can see from the flap angle:
http://www.stcroixsaddlery.com/Used_Close_Contact_Saddles_p/scj_con_12217.htm

Compare this to the more moderately forward flap on the Dominus Close Contact, which is suitable for the general riding public :
http://www.equinenow.com/english_saddle-ad-7076

The BdH, another discontinued saddle, has also fallen into the ranks of sub-$1000 used saddles and was a mean little knockoff of French tack. It’s getting harder and harder to find. http://www.allthebestusedsaddles.com/17-dover-bdh-1546.aspx

For something you might actually manage to find without too much pain, try a Prestige Red Fox (commonly available around $800-$1000, sometimes less) or bump your budget up to $1200-$1400 and seek out a Prestige Hunter Classic, Prestige Nona Garson, etc. Although for that matter, if the real budget is $1500, please say that because that’s a whole different conversation with other possibilities (like finding an older PJ, the rare Amerigo/Vega saddle, a used Equipe Expression, etc.)

If you’re serious about buying right now, this Frank Baines Reflex with foam panels is a SMOKIN’ deal and will remind you VERY much of a French saddle. This is a $3000 saddle, built to incredibly high quality standards, very much on par quality-wise with County/CWD/Childeric/etc. This gal’s been trying to move it for a few months now, so you can probably talk her down to perhaps $1000-$1100. I keep waiting for someone to notice it and snap it up. http://www.warmblood-sales.com/TackDetail.asp?TackID=32818

2. A high-end French feel is your #1 concern, and it better feel REALLY French not like an imitator, even if that means you’re buying something built to a $1000 MSRP standard at the expense of getting that French feel: this is a tough thing to build since high-end French saddles are largely a product of their quality workmanship, but a few brands have pulled it of. The older, now-discontinued lineup of Phillippe Fontaines by Stubben were, IMO, the king of this. Classic Saddlery still has a 17.5 PF Renee for $895 (www.classicsaddlery.com), and you see occasional used ones like this (she’s asking a bit more than usual for these–they typically go used for $800-$900, but to her credit, the Diane was the runaway hit of the PF lineup and suits long-legged riders nicely):
   http://gainesville.craigslist.org/grd/4137005442.html

Be warned that the tree on the Phillippe Fontaines ran narrow, so if you’re looking for that medium-wide width that’s common to much French high-end tack, you’ll want to buy your Phillippe Fontaine in a wide tree. And don’t buy the newer PF Lyon. It’s not even remotely French. It’s a Courbette wearing Stubben’s clothing.

If you prefer the luxury of availability, the Thornhill Paris II is the heir apparent to the Phillippe Fontaines. I’ve posted about it on other threads. Very nice saddle for the money, and structurally, they nailed that French, Antares/Delgrange like seat architecture, twist, etc. I also like the leather they’re using on it: a nice sturdy oil-pull leather that’s still supple and grippy. I picked one over with a fine tooth comb at a trade fair, and when I was done, I winked at the US Thornhill distributor and said, “You had a French saddler help you design this.” She smiled and said “Yes, we did.”
http://www.shop.pinnaclehorseware.com/New-Thornhill-Paris-II-17-33cm-tree-paris-ll.htm

3. If easy availability matters more than quality or similarity to a high-end French saddle: bump your budget up to $1200-$1400 and get yourself a used Prestige, as described above–or if availability and staying under $1000 is super duper important, ain’t nothin’ wrong with a Pessoa. The Pessoa Legacy lineup, IMO, hits a little closer to the French high-end mark than the GenX or A/O, but the GenX and A/O are perfectly fine saddles too. This one is sold, but to give you a feel for what $1000 buys you:
   http://www.equinenow.com/english_saddle-ad-6400

[Blackmare]

Used Crosby XL’s look good, feel good and go for $600-900 on eBay. My SO still has his for h/j. Others have been mentioned already. Also Beval lines.

[pattnic]

I would also suggest a BdH… I’ve seen several on eBay recently. I used to have one; it was quite a nice saddle, but truly didn’t fit me or my horses. There were a few variations; the older ones were more huntery Frenchy, the most recent ones more jumpery Frenchy. The BdH Paris was made with a nicer quality leather than the original BdH and the most recent BdH.

[Lucassb]

My suggestion is to see if you can find a Beval Salem. http://www.beval.com/Products/Salem-Saddle/1475000.aspx

A friend has one and I happened to ride in it when I was hacking her horse for her; I could not believe how similar it was to my high end french saddles. I absolutely loved it. And you can’t beat the price, although I noticed that when I went to the Beval site and just clicked on the saddle category, it did not come up. I had to Google the specific saddle to get the link above, so I am guessing it may be/is about to be discontinued. They are lovely.

ETA: Mary’s seems to have one for even less, if this size happens to be what you need: http://www.marystack.com/beval-salem-double-leather-saddle.html

[Bristol_Bay]

I found a used Pessoa on CL that would fit the description of French quality, low price. I love it and so does everyone who rides in it, including friends whose own saddles are CWD and Antares.

But I am bookmarking this thread in case my saddle ever dies or disappears.

[joiedevie99]

I’ll third the BdH.

[RugBug]

Anyone with experience of the PJ Premier?

I need something different for the new horse and would LOVE another Delgrange, but I just can’t spend that amount of money right now…especially since I will most likely change the panels for her on my current Delgrange when (if?) I sell the other horse.

I’m thinking that maybe the PJ’s are similar in design and that the Premier could be a temporary saddle…

[blondebates]

I had a Arc De Triomph Gazelle for years and loved it. Leather is amazing and it has held up beautifully. You should look them up they are wonderful saddles for the price.

[jn4jenny]

[QUOTE=RugBug;7277319]
Anyone with experience of the PJ Premier?[/QUOTE]

I suggest searching the forums for “Premiere Delgrange”. A search for “PJ Premiere” won’t get you the threads you need, but “Premiere Delgrange” will. I know because I posted on them. Long story short, the PJ Premiere isn’t even built by Bruno Delgrange, who built the original PJs that most people are talking about when they say “a PJ saddle.” The PJ Premiere is okay for the price, I guess, although I am far more impressed with certain other mid-range knockoffs from the French/Italian brands than I am with the PJ Premiere. (For example, the Beval Artisan, Arc de Triomphe Gazelle, Prestige Roma, etc.) <–(Note to the OP: these are all well outside your stated price range. You might luck into a used ADT Gazelle if you bump the budget to $1200-$1500.)

Old PJ Delgrange saddles, the “real” kind, can be easily found from $1200-$2000. That’s what I’d recommend to a Delgrange fanatic, unless it didn’t fit your horse (but honestly, if an old PJ doesn’t fit the horse, a PJ Premiere probably won’t either so it’s garbage in garbage out.)

[RugBug]

Thanks, jn4jenny. I actually have a decent budget…but not $5000.

I absolutely know that the PJ’s are not built by Delgrange any longer. I was just thinking that since the BD’s are based on PJ’s designs that maybe the new PJ’s would use similar designs and all would be perfect in my world. Ha! A girl can dream.

I’ve tried an older PJ on my mare, but I’m not sure what model or anything about the tree. It was too wide. Enough so that I didn’t even girth it up. Mare is narrow…but not as narrow as my gelding, or even my trainer’s mare that also has a BD that I use. I’ve tried one other BD on her and it was WAY too wide. I worry about the wide variety when thinking of buying a BD used. It’s actually one reason I went with a Tad Coffin. The older models had one tree size and it fit. However, I think because my TC is bigger than average (18" to accommodate my normal 17.5 self), it seems that possibly the tree is wider.

It’s very difficult to find a used Bruno Delgrange Athena, which is what I want. There are a number of Partitions available, which is the deepest I would go on the seat. and I also need a forward flap. I suppose I could compromise on a Partition with the correct flap, but then I’d have to have the panels redone which adds a not insignificant amount to an already top of the budget/over the budget saddle (budget is about $2200).

If my gelding wasn’t such a hard fit…I would just have the panels on my Athena redone and make him have to use a different saddle.

[jlphilli]

The Dover “special eq” saddle or the PJ Premiere

[soloudinhere]

I thought the PJ Premiere used really junky leather for its price.

I will second the Paris II, I tried it at a trade show and really, really liked it. I also really liked their Grand Prix model.

[luckeys71]

I, actually, got a very old ('95) Butet in remarkably good condition off eBay for $1,100. If you hunt on eBay long enough, you can probably find what you want for a price you can afford.

[eq3019]

I will second the Beval Salem. It comes in a very orange color but turns a nicer brown once it is oiled and broken in.

[alliekat]

I have a beautiful Beval Salem [edit] I highly recommend checking one out. They are a lovely saddle.