Beware [edit]

[CanteringCarrot]

Our Cashel Blue

[alpine1]

@trubandloki

I have question on your video. What are they judging in that class?
Did I hear it right, one of the parts of the class is the judge gets on and actually rides the horses?

I do agree that these horses, though cute, would not place in a hunter class in the US.

As others have said, working hunter in Britain is not the same as American hunters. I’m not an expert by any means, we need a British person to weigh in, but my understanding is that it’s a more rustic thing for the jump phase, modeled on actual hunting in the field. The jumping portion is judged on style and having a clear round. I didn’t post it to show that cobs could win US hunter classes, just that it’s not true that their conformation would prevent them from jumping. Maybe not in the Olympics, but that’s not for cob people anyway.

[SillyHorse]

@Scribbler

Working hunter is not the same as American hunters.

I’m well aware of that, thanks. When I said these horses wouldn’t be competitive in the show ring, I was talking about in the U.S.

[SillyHorse]

@alpine1

it’s not true that their conformation would prevent them from jumping.

No one has said that.

[Scribbler]

@Warmblood1

@CanteringCarrot

I think you’ll find the Warmbloods in the US typically differ from the ones you’ll find at riding schools in Germany (that can vary though), or the ones kept at home as pets/occasional riding horses. A lot of the “average” or less than average ones are staying in country vs being imported into the USA. So maybe the USA doesn’t see them as much, or see the variety as much?

I think so. For example, there are prominent lines imported to the US which makes the gene pool much smaller as far as availability. The bloodlines tend to trend as well so many will import WBs from certain prominent sires. Most serious riders are not importing lower level pasture puff types and are often bringing in lines that are talented but known for being more sensitive or difficult. I don’t think the US WB pool is a very good representation of the WB population as a whole.

Yes. And another source of NA WB is breeding Big Name imported frozen semen to OTTB mares. It’s possible that many NA WB have more TB blood close up than in Europe, and that can mean they trend hotter.

[SillyHorse]

@alpine1

You said “in general, their conformation doesn’t lend itself to jumping fences of any considerable size”, so I guess “any considerable size” is all relative.

Not really.

@alpine1

I haven’t seen a single cob-type at any hunter/jumper/dressage barn.

At any rate, maybe you have a better explanation as to why you’ve never seen a cob type in any H/J barn.

[thereadinghorse]

Sorry. I wasn’t talking about Europe, but moreso about Germany. And I’m in a bubble of english riders and only know a lot of WB and GRP breeders, so my view is subjective and limited to my bubble. Of course we do crossbreeds in Europe. But I tend to say, not so much in Germany. At least if you stay in the “english world”

[thereadinghorse]

What do you mean by “have managed their culling”? I know next to no one who will do anything else apart from euthanazing their horse when it’s time. It’s quite common to have the “not suitable for slaughter” passage filled in the passport of our horses. Otherwise you would have to keep strict records about EVERY medicine your horse evers gets. From the 120 horses in my barn I know not one that hasn’t has the “not suitable for slaughter” passage in its passport. From my point of view and my experience the horses, which actually go to the slaughterhouse are few and generally not the average riding horses. I personally don’t know any horse without this passage.

[thereadinghorse]

Absolutely true. I think the US WB pool is very different to the WB population. At least this is what I get by reading all the comments here. Seems like the ones in the US tend to be hotter, fancier and have more gaits than the average WB aorund here

[thereadinghorse]

I’m not sure, if this is a good idea, but I’ll post a link to a video of my mare
https://www.instagram.com/p/C3LkN4HNjUx/
That’s us. I don’t think she would be difficult for any ammy to ride. I would say she’s kinda easy. And I know a lot of WBs easier than her.

Happend to find this clip from my local riding school. All horses (apart from the tobiano and the haflinger) in this clips are WBs. That shows how different they are: https://www.instagram.com/p/C3bMZ_4NvfH/ (And all of them are schooling horses).

[quietann]

That’s quite a range of horses. For a lot if us older adult ammys, the slightly fat chestnut would be a good choice. If I was still jumping, it’d be one I could enjoy, except it might be too wide. Many of us need a horse who can “take a joke” which is to say remain pleasant even when the rider does stupid things that make no sense to the horse.

One big difference with your videos is that the horses are going a bit fast for the US hunter ring, where huge, quiet, not too speedy horses do best.

[Warmblood1]

@thereadinghorse

I’m not sure, if this is a good idea, but I’ll post a link to a video of my mare
https://www.instagram.com/p/C3LkN4HNjUx/
That’s us. I don’t think she would be difficult for any ammy to ride. I would say she’s kinda easy. And I know a lot of WBs easier than her.

Happend to find this clip from my local riding school. All horses (apart from the tobiano and the haflinger) in this clips are WBs. That shows how different they are: https://www.instagram.com/p/C3bMZ_4NvfH/ (And all of them are schooling horses).

I see why you love your mare so much, she looks like a blast to ride.

The second video looks like the variety of horses the US would have with both WBs and various breeds showing lower to intermediate levels. Different breeding, of course, but a similar variety of “types.”

[thereadinghorse]

They were doing an eventing lesson, that’s why they go a bit faster. The trainer (olympic participant in the 90s) likes to have the riders go a good “eventing galopp”

[DownYonder]

I took a brief break from this thread after my earlier comments caused the OP to throw a hissy fit because I wanted to have a logical discussion about her breeding “dreams.” I’m catching up again and wow, there has been a lot of great input from various folks!

Regarding the comments upthread about people laughing if an adult showed up with a 15h horse at a show - I saw an article on Eurodressage about the recent Wellington CDIO and Astrid had this comment beneath the photo of a horse and rider:

I don’t know how tall this horse is but the fact that Astrid thought it interesting to see it in a Developing GP class makes me think that it is in fact much smaller than the other competitors. And no, I don’t think she was “laughing” at it - I certainly wouldn’t have laughed at it but would have smiled as it would have been wonderful to see!

[thereadinghorse]

I realised one fact Late, but I realised it. Another reason, why using for example QH crosses for anyhting not western associated is so weird to me, is because we have a very filtered base of QHs here. I was shocked the first time a saw a picture of a “hunter” QH (a big one, kinda looking like a WB). We only have Reiners, Cutters, some few pleasure lined horses. So only those specific types of QHs for specific purposes. So using a QH (cross) for something different seems off. But I get, that the variety of QHs is much bigger than those which represent the breed over here I’m a slow learner, forgive me

[thereadinghorse]

And just for fun. Another video from my local riding school. (We do have the tradition to jump into the new year. Is this a thing elsewhere?)

Not all of them are WBs, but maybe you can spot the ones not being WBs?
https://www.instagram.com/p/C1rYdMetAmj/

In addition this gives a quite good insight in which breed we have in our general barn and in which numbers/relations

[Arzny]

Anna is quite short - iirc Censational might actually be a pony.

[cristalle]

@thereadinghorse

And to be honest: Us germans tend to be very stiff and stick to our traditions You get massive side eyes, when trying to compete with let’s say a halfinger in M-level dressage. Many judges still tend to have huge “racism” problems, because anything that is no WB will be inspected quite thorough, beause “this ain’t a dressage horse!”

Many years ago I boarded my (quite spectacular) OTTB at a barn owned by Germans who were importing WBs. I remember them watching me ride him, and the man saying, “he is a very nice horse…(long pause) for a Thoroughbred”.

[thereadinghorse]

Yes, it is a pony. FS Don’t Worry is a GRP stud And Caramel FH, too.

FS is the prefix for Ferienhof Stücker, a very big GRP breeder and FH is the suffix for Freibeger Hof which also breeds GRPs

[thereadinghorse]

That’s indeed a typical german comment to make TBs over here are seen as high performance sport horses and nothing any ammy should touch without proper assistance from somebody that is used to handling TBs. Don’t know why this is the case, but people even tend to “not like” WBs with high TB percentages, because they “will not be ammy friendly” and “sport horses”.

Our general WBs have a TB percentage ranging between 20 to 40%. Always calculated 6 generations back. My own mare has about 25%, but the first TBs to show up in her pedigree are in 5th gen (Ladykiller xx, *1961, Rantzau xx, *1946, Tin Rod xx, *1964, Endspurt xx, *1941) and in 6th Der Löwe xx, *1944. So this is all way back