Bitting Suggestions For a Tough Cookie

[Blueeyedroan]

OTTB mare, 9 years old, came off the track at end of her 7 year old year.
Currently going in my all time fave bit : french link hunter D with the JP Curve (mouthpiece on thinner side, curve in the bar pieces so it sits real nice). Most horses go beautifully in this bit. Not this mare.

This mare has tongue issues. She was definitely tongue tied at the track.
When she’s nervous, and when she standing or being ridden on a softer/looser rein her tongue is OVER the bit and out the side of her face doing acrobatics. Both sides, she’s not picky. Doesn’t matter how high you set the bit her tongue is going over it, unless it’s cranked so far up it’s inhumane which I will not do. This tongue flapping is not accompanied by any other negative behavior. I’ve also noticed her tongue often has a bluer hue than it should when there’s no reason for it to look that way so I do suspect some scar tissue and circulation issues.
The funny part is when you ask her to go to work and push her up onto the bit she stuffs her tongue back under the bit where it belongs and goes right to work. She’s actually completely polite about this. I’ve never seen a horse put their tongue away on command.
She curls away from the bit and and tucks behind the vertical as her general way of going. It’s a nice break from the classic head in air and hollow OTTB way of going, but indicative of a different issue.

I have her in an open face bridle, noseband removed completely.
I’m not putting her in a figure 8, flash or crank. Not open for discussion. No.
She had her teeth done at the track, had an oral exam last spring, and is booked to be floated again at the end of March.

What bit would you recommend that relieves her tongue a bit, but also doesn’t interfere with her low palate ? And is also hunter/jumper/eventing legal?

[Simkie]

Have you tried a boucher? I’ve often found them useful for these touchy types of horses. Just that hanging cheek seems to really help, but you can also play around with tongue relief type mouthpieces.

You could also try a Pelham. A straight bar with a wide port is often fab for these guys. I know it’s strange to recommend a curb for a horse that curls, but sometimes they just really like the way it sits in the mouth.

[Christa_P]

Check the fit and maybe try a simple racing Dee Bit. My OTTB only raced for 1 season as a 4 year-old, but she is picky about how the bit fits - she likes a 4 1/2" single joint or a mullen mouth pelham. A double joint bit or one that is too wide will cause her to play with her mouth and be very inconsistent with contact.

[Posting_Trot]

Yes, I’d also suggest a baucher bit. Horses who are fussy with other snaffles will often go well in a baucher. My current horse is using a Stubben baucher with a central lozenge.

[jvanrens]

Maybe try something like this (without the hooks)?

[NoSuchPerson]

I had good luck with a Bomber Happy Tongue bit on a horse that was really fussy with most bits.

[Night_Flight]

I would also try a low-ported Myler, or a leather bit. The fun thing about leather bits is that they will essentially form to the mouth, which after a few rides will give you an idea of your horse’s mouth shape that you can use for future bit shopping, if needed.

Have you tried an Australian cheeker to help keep the bit up and off the tongue? My old mare with a tongue scar went well in that combined with a leather bit for quite a while.

[Texarkana]

A low port mullen was a life changer for my fussy horse who has a fleshy tongue and a low palate.

[dmveventer]

Mine goes in the Fager Maria. It’s thin and the titanium is really light which might help given your horse’s tongue issues. The lozenge is equally thin and sits flat against the tongue with no rings sticking out, and it’s a little ported for tongue relief without interfering with a low palette. I had him in the JP lozenge bit to start and it was too fat and didn’t sit right in his mouth. Fager will let you do a trial for a $15 fee if you want to test it out.

Fager Maria Titanium Hunter Dee Ring

Would really recommend only trying things you can return or are cheap enough to eat the loss. There were a few things I thought my horse would love that got soundly rejected (the baucher was one of these) so you really just have to do some trial-and-error until they tell you what works.

[Heinz_57]

@NoSuchPerson

I had good luck with a Bomber Happy Tongue bit on a horse that was really fussy with most bits.

I’ll second that. Although mine are knockoffs. I have a baucher happy tongue knockoff that is just the ticket for my sensitive ones. I’ve also had good results with the Fager Mullen mouths.

[CBoylen]

I’d put it in a Nathe or similar knockoff.

[NancyM]

Well, it’s always an idea to just try a lot of different options, and hope to stumble onto something that works. Bits with a big tongue groove would be the first obvious option. A mouthpiece with a tongue depresser option may help (there is such a thing). Other than that, a contraption called a “running W”, which goes on before the bridle does… W shaped, fits above the bit. The center part of the W makes it impossible for the tongue to get over the bit, like a tongue depressor.
You can also get a leather tongue tie, (I have one) which holds the tongue in the correct position without being tight… it’s just a loop, with a buckle that goes under the chin. Holds the tongue still, and in position. Your hope would be that in time, and with work, the issue would solve itself. This would not be legal for the hunters, but maybe OK in the jumpers??? IDK if anyone has ever considered the use of this thing in non racing competition. It’s hardly noticeable.
Any chance that you could try a bitless option? At least at home for a while?

[Ajierene]

I rode a horse like this - tongue over the bit and flipping all over the place if she was nervous. But she still steered and listened just fine and when more relaxed, tongue was where it should be. So I never worried about it. I guess if she were to show, you would have to do something.

The person I was riding for at the time saw this one day and did insist on a figure 8. It did keep the tongue under the bit but she had an absolute anxiety attack about it. I ended up getting off her and just lunging her a bit to get her used to the new get up and then she got better.

I always felt about that but she wasn’t my horse to make those decisions on and the figure 8 wasn’t to the level of “abuse”, per se. The mare did just like her self soothing technique of tossing her tongue about.

[StormyDay]

So my first thought would be try a hackamore for a while to see if maybe not having anything in there might calm the anxiety down and then you could return to a regular bit after a few months.

[fivestrideline]

The base level Myler (MB01) without hooks is a godsend for my fussy guy! I tried a low port Mullen, leather bit, Fager upward locking double joint, the same JP you are using, a hackamore, a basic racing dee, a Waterford, and a few others I can’t recall. He doesn’t get his tongue over the bit but he fusses and chews and plays. It stops when he’s focused and working.

The Myler is his favorite, the leather bit a close second. He seems to like stability but a true mullen (no independent side movement) is TOO stable. Agador bits make some interesting options including bauchers and Myler knock offs that might be worth a shot - $70-$80 to try vs $180+ for some of these .

I think ultimately he may like a Myler style Pelham - not for brakes but to move some of the pressure out of his mouth. He may one day go in a hackamore, but he seems to understand the bit better and we have work to do before I can trust the hack 100%.

[GraceLikeRain]

Honestly I’d put her in a thinline bitless bridle or rope halter until the next dental and confirmation something wasn’t missed at the last dental. Honestly honestly I’d go back to groundwork. Bit issues plus ducking is a full body challenge and I’ve had more luck going back to the ground and resolving brace and tension there before trying to fix the mouth. If I was determined to ride in a bit I’d probably do a leather bit. A horse that has tongue and contact issues is so far away from being ring ready I wouldn’t let legality be remotely a concern. Six to twelve months from now hopefully you’ll have a radically different ride who can go back in a more traditional bit if necessary.

[dmveventer]

Sounds like we have the same horse! “Stable but not too stable” is exactly what my guy likes. The baucher was also too stable for him. I tried a lot of the same things you did, I didn’t get to the Myler but that was next on my list before we landed on his current Fager (which is a normal ported double-joint, no locking). I was also curious about some of the Herm Sprenger and Neue Schule bits but had a harder time finding the thinner versions which mine really needs.

[Pico_Banana]

I use the Fager Emil - double jointed titanium - on my mare who is particular about bits.

Fager Emil Titanium Fixed rings

We went through a bunch of bits - HS, NS, Duo, etc. This is the one she likes by far the best. The titanium does make the bit quite a bit lighter than many bits and this particular one seems to have a very friendly shape. The titanium ones from Fager are, I believe, only 14mm or smaller, so it doesn’t take up a lot of room.

[fordtraktor]

I have a horse with an active tongue and he chose a MikMar eggbutt. I say “he chose” because I had been going the other way with titanium bits, Nathe etc, thinking lighter was better, but bought a used bridle on FB that came with this bit and put it on him to try the bridle without changing the bit…and he loved it. So heavy thick bit it is, with a lozenge but stable sides. Who knew….

[findeight]

Make sure the width of the bit is appropriate for the width of your mares mouth. Most bits you find in shops these days are 5 3/4 - 6”ish or even more and if you order without specifying, that’s what you get.
Average TB is finer headed then a typical WB, my TBs were 5” to 5 1/2, one was 4 3/4.

Or she could be needing something wider and yours are too narrow for her. She might be trying to spit the bit out because it is uncomfortable.

Umm…many, if not most race horses go with their tongues tied, doubt that caused any of your current issues.

You can take a piece of baling twine and place it across her lower jaw where the bit rests then mark, remove and measure. Probably need a friend to help with that but it is quick, easy and can allow you to fit her appropriately.