My older Doberman died from a torsion Bloat two weeks ago. The younger Doberman has an even deeper chest. The Bloat event was horrible for me and the dog. 
Once the stomach is twisted, the chances of recovery and costs are terrible. :no:
There is a preventive surgery called gastropexy. It attaches the stomach to the abdominal wall.
Anybody do the surgery and willing to post their experiences ? 
Perhaps answer some questionsā¦
A cousin of mine has a Weim and had this procedure done when she was also having her spayed. Keeping her quiet was the hardest part. If you have questions Iāll be more than happy to ask her and get back to you.
Iāve done the procedure many times, mostly on dogs that I have spayed. Kind of a āhey, while youāre in there.ā But itās not a really, while Iām in there procedure as the uterus is hell and gone far away from the stomach so the incision is greatly lengthened to get to the stomach. Because they are deep chested, I usually need a lot of room to get down in there to get my hands in there to do the procedure, so the incision is long. I do the belt-loop gastropexy. It takes longer, but it makes me feel more confident that it will hold. I ALWAYS recommend it for Danes, Dobermans, and the like. Just did an Airedale the other day.
Iām so sorry about the loss of your Dobe, Hosspuller. GDV is indeed a terrible thing. Iāve had two Irish Wolfhounds who bloated and torsed over the years. One was about thirty years ago at Cornell Vet School, and he pulled through. The other torsion was about ten years ago, and she did not make it. Another bloated but didnāt torse and was resolved non-surgically. In all of my cases, stress seemed to play a role in it, and of course they are deep-chested too.
I donāt do preventive gastropexies on mine, though I might consider it if I were doing an elective spay on a bitch. My repro vet can do gastropexies laparoscopicly. A friend of mine who breeds greyhounds does every single one of her dogs, either when they are neutered, or if they are kept intact, she does them at about a year of age. Her line seems particularly prone to GDV and she feels it is one less thing to worry about if she has them done.
[QUOTE=Houndhill;8271247]
Iām so sorry about the loss of your Dobe, Hosspuller. GDV is indeed a terrible thing. Iāve had two Irish Wolfhounds who bloated and torsed over the years. One was about thirty years ago at Cornell Vet School, and he pulled through. The other torsion was about ten years ago, and she did not make it. Another bloated but didnāt torse and was resolved non-surgically. In all of my cases, stress seemed to play a role in it, and of course they are deep-chested too.
I donāt do preventive gastropexies on mine, though I might consider it if I were doing an elective spay on a bitch. My repro vet can do gastropexies laparoscopicly. A friend of mine who breeds greyhounds does every single one of her dogs, either when they are neutered, or if they are kept intact, she does them at about a year of age. Her line seems particularly prone to GDV and she feels it is one less thing to worry about if she has them done.[/QUOTE]
Good grief, perhaps the line should stop being bred?
I think we need to take a hard look at what weāre breeding if the dogs need such invasive surgeries just to live a normal life.
[QUOTE=PlanB;8271351]
Good grief, perhaps the line should stop being bred?
I think we need to take a hard look at what weāre breeding if the dogs need such invasive surgeries just to live a normal life.[/QUOTE]
I should have said, this breed (greyhounds) is more prone to bloat, and as hosspuller has found, once you have been through GDV and have perhaps lost a dog, if you know there is surgery that prevents torsion, you might as an owner choose to do it.
There are many breeds at a higher risk of GDV than others, each person must make their own decision. There may well be a genetic component to the predisposition to GDV, but there are many social and environmental factors that also contribute.
My friend is very happy with her breeding program. Over the years, she has produced many dogs who have lived very long, happy, healthy lives. They are beautiful, have outstanding temperaments, many are Field Champion Lure Cousers, and AKC Champions, as well as being beloved companions. If people choose to have this surgery done, I really think that is up to them. For some people, their chosen breedās other attributes outweigh their bloat risk, particularly as there is a procedure that prevents torsion.
Last week I read a book about a military explosive-sniffing dog. According to this book, the military does the surgery on all their dogs, figuring they put so much money into training that it makes sense to do everything they can not to lose one to something preventable.
StG
Second question of many before I decide on the surgery (I am leaning toward it) and then the vet to do the job.
What gastropexy approach? incisional or laproscopy ? Cost of the procedure (+ Area of country since that affects cost) and recovery time, outcome ?
[QUOTE=StGermain;8271458]
Last week I read a book about a military explosive-sniffing dog. According to this book, the military does the surgery on all their dogs, figuring they put so much money into training that it makes sense to do everything they can not to lose one to something preventable.
StG[/QUOTE]
In thirty years of serial Doberman ownership, This Bloat was the first. While I donāt have the magnitude of expense the military has ā¦ Over the lifetime of a dog, gastropexy surgery is small compared to the feeding, care and emotional attachment.
Like Iāve posted before about microchipping. Cost is so low yet avoids potentially huge & serious consequences.
Iām very sorry for your loss.
I have worked in vet med 20 some years but am not a vet so take my thoughts w/ a grain of salt.
The tack down procedure that Iām familiar with is warranted when thereās a family history of torsion but I wouldnāt put a dog through that personally if there wasnāt a significant risk.
I too have a deep chested dog of a breed that is prone to torsion. However, there is no family history of it so I just do the usual stuff and keep a good eye on him.
Heās a SP and Iāve seen many SPs in clinic with torsion over the years. But again, I wouldnāt do a procedure like that as a precaution without history.
I am SO very sorry for your loss.
So sorry for your loss. I lost my last dog this way and it is absolutely horrible for both dog and owner to go through.
My mom had a male saint bernard who bloated when he was young, like 1 or 2 yo. He was young enough where they decided to do the preventative bloat surgery to avoid any future occurrences. This held up fairly well over the years. Then late last year, he broke my momās hip, she went to the hospital, he went to the breederās for a bit. While at the breederās, he went into bloat again. Even with the surgery having been done.
He actually survived that instance. They really didnāt think he would, but he did. He was around for a month or so after that (maybe less) before finally having another episode and going. The whole thing was really sad. It was pretty strange for him to have this second episode of bloat since his stomach was stapled to the wall. Not sure how, but it did happen.
He had a lot of issues with teeth because he had to eat soft food and his health was sort of just a mess. But he was a happy, healthy guy for a few years between all this.
I think the difference here between a healthy dog having it is that his body was already traumatized. Just sharing the one instance I know of happening.
āBloatā is a generic term for gastric dilatation, with or without volvulus (the twisting). So while is stomach couldnāt flip over, it could still become full of fluid / air.
A lot of the German Shepherd people I know do it whenever the spay is done. Havenāt known many who did it pre-emptively on males, but a lot who have it done, as sockmonkey said, āwhile youāre in there.ā
Obviously if you suspect bloat itās a red alert emergency, but if you do suspect your dog is beginning to bloat, Gas-X is a good thing to have in your emergency kit until you get to the vet.
Thank you allā¦ for your kind words of sympathy. My hand still reaches for his head sometimes.
My dogās Bloat was a case of torsion. As I learned, the torsion of the stomach also flips the spleen. The combination of twisted stomach & spleen lead to rapid metabolic collapse. The chances of survival plummet. Emergency surgery costs rocket upwards. $6 thousand plus ICU after care. My Doberman also had kidney function issues pre bloat. Euthanasia was a hard but correct (in the light of day) decision. Gastropexy prevents (maybe) the torsion at a tenth of the Emergency cost.
[QUOTE=hosspuller;8271504]
Second question of many before I decide on the surgery (I am leaning toward it) and then the vet to do the job.
What gastropexy approach? incisional or laproscopy ? Cost of the procedure (+ Area of country since that affects cost) and recovery time, outcome ?[/QUOTE]
I will ask my friend who shares the very experienced surgeon who does it laparoscopicly. She has never has one torse after the surgery, and has not had any complications as far as I know. Of course with any surgery there is always some degree of risk.
She is sort of in your neck of the woods so might be useful for you to know. Iāll see what I can find outā¦offhand Iām thinking $1k for greyhound-sized (and Dobe sized) og?
[QUOTE=hosspuller;8271746]
Thank for allā¦ for your kind words of sympathy. My hand still reaches for his head sometimes.[/QUOTE]
Iām so sorry. How heartbreaking.
Sorry for your loss. Gastropexies can certainly help prevent a torsion. Iād also recommend pet insurance as it will help you with costs if a bloat was to occur. Survival chances post gdv surgery are not usually low if caught early enough, most survive so knowing the $$ is taken care of definitely helps with decision time.
Laparoscopic Gastropexies are often done at the time of spay or neuter but can be done at any point. I would recommend a qualified surgeon and ensure your.Doberman has no heart condition before an elective surgery.
Sorry my post didnāt come off quite as I had hopedā¦ I meant many survive post gdv without pre existing complications (future dogs). Sounds like you made a very reasonable decision for your older dobe. Hugs.
Iāve owned many large, deep chested dogs in my lifetime and had only one bloat. My senior Ridgeback female had bloat with a torsion when she was 12 years old. We did the surgery and she went on to give us hell for another 3 years. lol I still miss that old girl and sheās been gone about 15 years. Iām due to get my 10 month old female GSD spayed soon (was gonna be sooner but she went into heat first) and I donāt think Iāll do it. I donāt agree that itās a āwhile youāre in thereā kind of job, and the I donāt believe the risks are high enough to do an elective surgical procedure.
We lost a Dane mix to GVD, and despite very proactive management, our pure Dane also had GVD. He survived the surgery and they did the gastroplexy while they were in there to prevent future torsion. I will do it preemptively on my next Dane for peace of mind.
So sorry about your Dobe.
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