Bloodlines in regards to dressage and dressage breeding

[Touchstone_Farm]

Prodomus, I like them big, well, not “Gifted” size big, but I like a horse that’s 16’3 to 17’. I have a lovely 16.1 Hanoverian mare who I have about six months under saddle and enjoy riding her very much. She’s light, moves big, but I feel too tall on her! I guess I’m use to riding the taller ones!

Yes, the Bolero I was referring to is Hanoverian, not the TB. (Sorry to disappoint you, sm!
Bolero (1979-1987). Known for producing suspension and elasticity, very good movement. His son is Bretano II, standing at stud since 1986.

Some of you seem to like Arabs. One of the most influential anglo-arabs in the Hanoverians was Matcho AA and was important as a refinement stallion.

[Dressage-ryder]

[QUOTE=Olympussporthorses;3772724]
I am currently working with a Ferro/Branco stallion (Deja Blue B) and today was his first day back to work in a couple of months and he was a perfect gentleman! He has a very active hind end, which I really like and his canter is fabulous (very uphill and balanced). From the work I have done with him, he seems to have a very good mind. He has mostly done jumper work but I think he should do quite well in dressage. Nice all around sporthorse.

I know a Ferro mare that moves pretty similarly and is just gorgeous.[/QUOTE]

Blue is a lovely boy! Our trainer has a mare that was recently Champion at Annual Championship- She is a Ferro daughter and is stunning!We are expecting a Ferro foal in April and I am more than excited. I have ridden a few Ferro kids and they have been very nice. I know people worry about the personality but I have never had any problems.

Of course there is also Rousseau- another lovely Ferro son!

[tractor_queen]

Contucci

I can attest to the rideability & temperment of Contucci - I have one who is coming 7. He has a fabulous work ethic, tons of personality and is a fabulous mover, perfect for an AA who wants to be competitive.

[RP1]

Everyone here only mentions the stallions as if they were the only factor in temperament. I have seen plenty of “hot” and nasty horses by some of the stallions mentioned. But what about the mare? The dam also contributes to the foal - maybe even more than the stallion. Don’t short change the mare in these discussions!

[DownYonder]

[QUOTE=sm;3772198]
I really don’t know who the most in-common sire (translation, successful) would be here amoung all USDF dressage horses… interesting question. Nearco is a possibility, would have to round up the other usual suspects…[/QUOTE]

Well, as I said way back on page 4 of this thread - the most frequently seen sire line on the USEF Leading Dressage Sire stats is that of Donnerhall. His descendants often have enough talent for professionals wanting to be nationally or internationally competitive at FEI, but are also usually tractable enough for amateurs to easily handle and ride. Of course, there is always the influence of the dam to consider, but Donnerhall and his sons have been bred to mares with all types of temperaments, and that famous “big D” trainability and work ethic comes through far more often than not.

[STF]

Amen Chris to the Donnerhall temperment.

[STF]

On that note, also…
Who would be considered one of the best Donnerhall sons?

[Oakstable]

DeNiro
Hano Verband Stallion of the Year

[nhwr]

I liked Dream of Glory an awful lot. He died so young that there aren’t a lot of his offspring around.

I have seen De Niro a couple of times. First time when he was 7 or 8 and school GP. I’d make sure the mare I put him to had a strong canter though. If I remember correctly he had a tendency to be a little down in the shoulder in that gait. But that is really just nitpicking. He is a fabulous animal, truly.

[blackhorse6]

As I posted previously(beginning of thread), I have a 4 yr old DeNiro…He has a wonderful uphill canter…His best gait… Out of a Feinerstern mare. Great attitude but slow in maturing… 16-3 and still growing both mind and body…So much personality and he really loves people. I love the D line…

[slc2]

I really like Jus de Pomme, myself. And Pion line.

[DownYonder]

[QUOTE=STF;3776302]
On that note, also…
Who would be considered one of the best Donnerhall sons?[/QUOTE]

A lot of folks consider Don Schufro the best Donnerhall son because of his own performance and breeding success (Olympic competitor and sire of numerous FEI offspring, including Diamond Hit).

De Niro hasn’t had quite as much success in the competition ring, but he was competing successfully at GP at age 7 (!) and, as stated earlier, is top of the USEF dressage sire rankings, plus also has a lot of offspring competing at FEI.

I also agree with NHWR - Dream of Glory was another very good one. It is tragic that he died so young.

[DawnJL]

[QUOTE=RP;3775788]
Everyone here only mentions the stallions as if they were the only factor in temperament. I have seen plenty of “hot” and nasty horses by some of the stallions mentioned. But what about the mare? The dam also contributes to the foal - maybe even more than the stallion. Don’t short change the mare in these discussions![/QUOTE]

The mares aARE absolutely critical. I select my mares based on their dam lines, their temperament, their maternal and reproductive qualities, and their conformation and movement. Even the sires that I use (both my own and outside ones) need to have dams that I think are high quality in desirable temperament, phenotype, etc. More than half of the photo examples I posted in my earlier sequence were of mares and fillies, and there was a link to a pdf article about the mare Silent Wings and her family’s influence on sport type Arabians

[STF]

Florstan, Fidermark also…

I want to breed one of my mares to Farewell III one day.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6X-ziob3BA

Not this year but maybe next Id like to try ET with him to my Diamont x Waldorn mare since we have that new super ET vet in our area now.

[nhwr]

My favorite Floristan son is Fürstenreich, I think.

I am toying with breeding him to my Ronaldo daughter (if I ever breed again).

A little Angelo line breeding for TB lover in me

So many nice ones and so little spousal approval :sigh:

[Crosiadore_Farm]

I took that video of Farewell III and think he is a very nice stallion. But his rider was working her butt off keeping his hind legs under him. Not that I would not use him at some point, but on something with an “electric” hind leg. Walk and elasticity was super as well as temperament. I adore the F line for this!

[wildswan]

Can’t argue with the Donnerhall temperament, but I’ve never bred to an F1 Donnerhall son because I’ve always thought the line tended to be a little too out behind for my taste. But, Daddy Cool has certainly impressed me, and I think I might be tempted to use him if he proves to produce true to his type.

[DownYonder]

[QUOTE=wildswan;3777175]
Can’t argue with the Donnerhall temperament, but I’ve never bred to an F1 Donnerhall son because I’ve always thought the line tended to be a little too out behind for my taste. But, Daddy Cool has certainly impressed me, and I think I might be tempted to use him if he proves to produce true to his type.[/QUOTE]

Yes, they can be as many of them have a tendency to be a bit long in the back and will push themselves onto their forehands, with hind leg motion going out behind them. Good training is needed to keep them balanced and the hindlegs stepping under. It is still hard, though, to beat their work ethic, willingness for the training, and dependability.

[Kmisschuck]

I had a Lauries Crusader gelding. Great brain, beautiful, wonderful movement. But, he was super tall 17.2 and all leg with not a lot of bone, long sloped pasterns. Very hard to keep sound. Ended up with career ending LCL injury and retired to pasture then had to euthanized bc he split P1 vertically just galloping around pasture. Dam was solid jumper with great rep and he was imported as a foal from the farm that owned LC. There are always one offs. Next young one I bought was out of Papparazo (successful Oldenburg) and he was super spooky and wouldn’t jump, he had OCDs in hock that at time found vets said not surgical and they didn’t suspect would cause issues, but do think his behavior was pain related. Then I bought a three year old KWPN out of Odin, and on dams side Pilot, Iroko. Just had to euthanize for severe wobblers. All had “normal PPEs”- Rood and Riddle, CSU. We found nothing on complete films of three year old (shot back, legs, it neck ) . Paparazzo gelding and LC both good films , no arthritis, just the OCds they felt would not cause issue. I’m beginning to have great doubts about bloodlines and PPEs after 0/3. All three were big, over 17 hands bc I’m super tall and I think it’s hard to avoid these issues and keep them sound when they start big young, grow fast and end up over 17.1.

[netg]

Interesting thread - thanks to those who put so much into their posts 13+ years ago, if you’re still around!

Having grown up with them, I’m a huge fan of the quarter horse breed. But since I’m in dressage now I look for dressage traits in buying a horse which are harder to find among stock types, though of course not impossible. My UB40 × Contango KWPN mare is the closest I’ve ever seen a warmblood get to a good QH temperament (there are definitely bad temperaments there, too!), except she is more willing and enthusiastic about hard work. I was worried for about 2 years she wouldn’t be sensitive or energetic enough for me, but then something clicked in her training and her responsiveness came out.