Broncing mare. I really need advice

If this was my horse I’d euthanize due to behavior.

I wouldn’t pass her on, and she is going to hurt someone.

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Have you pulled a full blood panel on her lately?
Just temporarily, I might try a
Magnesium/ calming supplement, does help some anxious, hot ones.
I wouldn’t do any work until the inflammation in the hooves is
Taken care of. That’s a huge symptom that needs off from use. addressed.
Navicular pain and inflammation can come and go, especially if given rest/time.
Whether her foot pain/inflammation is due to
Congenital causes (bad hooves) or bad farriery (neglect) she’s
The right age for hoof problems to start showing up once they get into regular work/use.
Dr. Green does wonders for navicular problems if there’s not too much damage already done
To the navicular area
But it may re-occur once back into regular work

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Can you just let her be for some time? 5 weeks is not a long time to get settled in, even more so for a horse with issues. I’m not surprised she didn’t love you trying to clip her. You can’t treat her like a “normal” horse given her background or you will most certainly get hurt.

Give her a few months at a minimum to just settle with no pressure, then start SLOW. If you decide to send her to a trainer, give her some time to settle with as little pressure as possible and figure her health issues out FIRST, otherwise that money will be wasted too.

If you don’t want to do that or are tapped out on finances, I agree euth is a fair option for you both.

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I will tell you what I and am sure many others have been thinking all along, this is not the horse for you right now.
What you do about it to get her out of your life is a different question that you posed.

In this situation, she is too much horse for you in your life.
Leave pride of fixing her go, of being her savior and be sensible and stay out of her way, broken hearted, is hard, but do it before she hurts you.
All along this has been a story of an accident waiting to happen, sorry to say, one of those learning experiences.

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OP, I am curious what your trainer is saying through all of this.

I should hope that, if your trainer encouraged you to buy this horse with issues that they might be willing to help you out of the situation.

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A month by month timeline would still be helpful.

Five weeks in she started acting up. How long ago was that? Like what month was she purchased, what month did behaviors appear, and a list of what you’ve done in chronological order in a single post so people aren’t trying to piecemeal things together.

Purchased August 2024
September 15 - was hacking on a loose rein and then went vertical and rodeo bucked me off followed by blind panic around the arena
September - December - X steps taken
January - X diagnostic with y result
Etc

What are you willing to do? Are you looking for support cutting ties and giving to a trainer, euthanizing, retiring for life, putting in up to $xxxx more in diagnostics or Y months of training.

This has been a long thread of people sharing ideas and then mostly being told it’s already been tried because none of us really even understand the situation.

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Has EDM been considered? She’s a WB right, where was she foaled and raised?

Your vet is working through this very logically imho but keep in min that injections can make inflammation worse initially so I’d I’d call and talk to them again and ask about pain control or moving up the regumate trial. And if possible leave her outside for a few weeks so no-one has to handle her.

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Dude she’s REALLY green, and the hay has been free for a good long time.

I wouldn’t be throwing any towels in on her yet, personally.

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Meanwhile, I’d also look at external things like trying a saddle pad with a different texture, or trying a different saddle.

Even if your saddle is expertly fitted for her, something could be rubbing too close to an angry nerve bundle. Or the way that tree and panel distribute pressure could be directing your weight onto sensitive muscles.

Just try different materials and shapes. Keep a list of what you’ve tried and how she reacts. Do the same with bit/bridle pinch points and girth design.

One of my horses is a flawless creature until you put a ticklish fuzzy fleece pad on him or if his saddle pad shifts back a couple inches and tickles his lumbar area. He’s -communicative- about his displeasure of certain textures. This is a horse who raced successfully with a grab bag of fractured body parts. Being tickled by fleece is where he draws the line.

You could also get a good body worker to meticulously palpate every millimeter of her body and tell you if she’s especially reactive anywhere. That might help narrow down your vet’s investigation. Worst case scenario, she enjoys a nice massage.

*I wrote the above before reading your timeline. Yeah, she just sounds green. I applaud you for investing in finding a medical cause. Failing that, I’d try to look at her as, essentially, a baby being backed for the first time. Keep things so boring and easy for her.

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I would also look at how her life is different.

Was the barn where they had no problems with her a busy place where she was always stimulated by what was going on versus your place being more quiet?

How does her current feeding and turn out program compare to what she had when she was not a fire breathing dragon?
For some animals, some feeds really can make them a totally different beast.

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Is this your anxiety or her anxiety?

If hers–this was your opportunity to pause, back up, figure out why she was anxious, and address those things. It could be holes in her training or pain or lack of confidence or lack of trust or or or or…

Anxious horse -> rider pushing them through that without figuring out/addressing the why -> horse saying no louder is not an unusual story.

Was this mare in work at all when you purchased her? What was she doing related to what you’re doing? Or was she out of work when you purchased her, and you put her into work?

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Amberley already said it upthread but explosive behavior on the ground, for no apparent reason when nothing much is being asked of them, starts to suggest EDM to me.

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She’s also still quite young. Even if her saddle fit her 6 months ago, her body may have changed that it is no longer as comfortable for her.

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If she was started at 4 and had a foal by her side at 5, she’s never really been ridden much if she’s only 6 now. She probably hasn’t had a consistent amount of training and riding in her young life. You’ve basically got an unbroke horse who I assume lived as a “baby” until she was started at 4, then was bred shortly after and lived as a broodmare until the foal was weaned in (I’m assuming) summer of her 5yo year. Then she was sold just a month or two later, and that owner had issues with her (because she’s a VERY lightly “started” green baby horse). Then you buy her…when? April? May? and she gives you around 30-35 good days before she starts showing just how green she really is.

You’ve started that you’re getting scared of her (rightly so) and you have a young daughter at home. This horse needs to go. I wouldn’t euthanize her. I had a mare once that I didn’t trust at all and thought she’d kill me. I gave her away. Her new folks loved her and rode her and kept her until she died. Sometimes we’re just not the person for that horse.

If nothing else, sell her as a broodmare with full disclosure that anyone who wants to try to ride her will need to start her from the ground up as if she’s never been ridden before.

Your gamble with this one didn’t pay off. It’s a tough pill to swallow, but you’re right. Your safety and your daughter are your priorities. Let Velvet go be a baby maker or someone else’s project. Just be very honest about your experience with her when finding her a new home.

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I’ve been around two very aggressive horses-- human created aggression-- that were “malicious.” I use malicious here to mean that if a person came into the pasture, they would lunge full-speed at a person with teeth and feet. They didn’t think logically; they reacted because a lot of their mental and physical pain came from humans.
The first horse was euthanized and it was a kindness to him. He was very, very dangerous and couldn’t even be handled for hoof and vet care. He was also smart, which made the entire situation worse. I can talk more about him, but it’s been a while since I knew and handled him.
I don’t know what happened to the second horse, but he would come flying out of nowhere and “attack” people with mouth open and hooves flying. The owner blamed everyone else and not her poor handling. He reared and struck her when he was quite young. She became scared, so she kept letting him get away from these behaviors that were normal young horse behaviors which should be appropriately corrected. He kept rearing, biting, and striking her. He nailed her really hard in the leg, and she walked it off. That’s how a green, ignorant owner gradually creates an aggressive horse: the horse acts up and the owner reinforces the behaviors.
He knocked me down in the pasture once and came flying at me when I was on the ground. I managed to get up and I chased him off before he could pin me to the ground. I never let him cross an invisible line, although he tried his damned hardest.
That’s what an aggressive, “malicious” horse looks like. They’re just reacting due to never being taught anything and having their inappropriate behavior reinforced. With the euthanized horse, he was probably oxygen deprived at birth. That doesn’t mean he couldn’t have become a polite citizen in the right hands, though.

As far as bucking. A horse that broncs is way more complex than just a neat and tidy “one size, fits all.” Yes, this could 10000% be pain and pain is probably a contributing factor. Other things to take into consideration: what is the environment like when the mare bucks? Is it a rowdy environment? Is it an anxious environment? Is it inside an arena? Is the arena closed? Is it outside? Are you nervous? Is the horse’s heart racing (can you feel her heart beating between your legs)? What is your saddle like?

Horses are far more mentally, emotionally, and physically sensitive than we are, so they will pick up on an environment a lot of quicker than us. Some horses can become stoic while other horses will turn more outward and react. Horses also have a big amygdala, hence their emotional responses to things and “triggers.”

There are certainly ulcers and kissing spine, but there are other back problems that can contribute such as SI pain (this is very, very common, and often why horses become so “moody”), hoof problems including a bad trim (sounds simple because it is but a bad trim can cause a whole host of problems), and other physiological problems.

MOST IMPORTANT: it sounds like you are doing everything you can. Sometimes people online are helpful, and sometimes they aren’t. Horses that buck are hard to work with so take it one day at a time. :smiley:

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Yeah she is very green absolutely. I went into this knowing that.
Fine with thet

Or alive, if you want the definitive test.

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Just throwing this out there-

How much info have you researched about this mare’s lineage?
There’s good reasons WHY
Rideability/Work Ethic is a
Special category in many Warmblood Inspections/Approvals
Could this be a family trait?
How far in the performance world did her sire, dam and full siblings go?
Could she be an anomaly? Sure.
In other words, I’d try finding out as much about her breeding/family history as I could.

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Exactly with this timeline you have a green, spirited baby horse I wouldn’t go to pain quite yet. Her timeline is sus as she was bred so early (possibly difficult to back) then sold to another inexperienced AA. Time to find a competent trainer to break her and treat like she was never backed. For some reason I thought she was competing and developed this behavior which would be completely different.

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Hey, just for what it’s worth - I have a green horse that is giving me a run for my money, also. Green is basically all I’ve ever dealt with my entire riding career, but the way my horse feels is just - different. It is similar to how you describe, in the “danger zone” feeling.

So, after a thorough vet check, she’s going for 90 days training to see if a pro can get her over the hump. My horse has a TON of redeeming qualities elsewhere, so I think the “good girl” is somewhere in there. Just have to find a way to the other side.

You’re not alone in getting out-classed by a horse. It’s super humbling, but it is what it is. I know my limitations.

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