Can someone tell me about the Oldenburg NA?

greystonefarm, just who is calling the kettle black here?

Two hundred and fifty-nine posts! Wow. This sure proves that there’s still a long, long way to go before these registries can “be all they can be”! Real lack of clarity here: the more I read, the more confused (and a little repulsed) I get.

I thought this might be helpful so that this thread doesn’t get closed.

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Graystone - you made a personal slap at me - read your remark.
And the post really is going no where - it’s one of the regularly scheduled reviews of the ISR/OLDNA. If it isn’t then let’s see one for EVERY warmblood registry - just to keep it fair.

As an aside, it may be good to remember that sometimes mares and stallions may be accepted for breeding with one registry but not with another not necessarily due to differences in perceived quality, but due to differences in each of the registries’ breeding goals, long-term vision and current mare base. Breeding animals (and their genetic contributions) may be more appropriate for one registry than another.

I have seen imported keur mares I would give my right kidney for refused at another registry’s inspections because they were of older type with perhaps a more gelderlander way of going and thus not in alignment with that registry’s breeding goals and desired phenotype. It does not mean they could not produce excellent sport progeny (in fact some of them already had!), but just that they were not generally suited to the other registry’s needs.

Similarly, we stand a stallion who was approved by the Hanoverian Verband based on his testing at Adelheidsdorf and the needs at the time (refining element for older-style mares). He is approved by several registries in North America, but not by AHS because his scores are not high enough to meet their foreign stallion requirements, given the type of stallion they consider appropriate for the modern American Hanoverian breeder. That is well within their right and I applaud them for having a clear breeding vision, knowing their current mare population and understanding what is needed to improve it, and assisting their member breeders in this way!

I’ve held back until now but I’ve decided to say this because I think newbys should hear it.

I have never been to an Old NA/IRS inspection but I’ve heard time and time again that Old NA is much too generous with their scoring system. I’ve heard of fellow breeders taking their “premium” mares to AHS and not being accepted. I’ve also heard of too many foal premiums being awarded. Most buyers rely on and make their purchases based upon those “premium” awards, especially those who buy off of videos. When I purchase an AHS or GOV mare or foal, I know that they were judged and scored honestly and modestly.

In 2005 ISR/ONA inspected 493 foals of which 207 were awarded Prem.
42% Premium.
In 2006 ISR/ONA insepcted 513 foals of which 226 were awarded Prem.
44% Premium.

I loaned out my 2007 breeders guide so I can’t tally those.

I went to a GOV inspection a couple months ago at Fairwind Farm in Santa Rosa. There was approx. 10 foals presented where only 2 were not premium. That’s 80% Premium.

I know you can’t compare 2 years of ISR/ONA with 1 GOV inspection. Maybe someone else can do the math for them. I don’t have the books.

My point is we hear everywhere how our foals now are equal in quality to those in Europe. We ARE producing more and more premium foals in all the registries.

At the 100 day test, everyone says ‘it’s the best group of stallions they’ve ever had.’ Because we’re breeding Better quality horses.

At a recent ISR/ONA inspection, Lightacres insp. in Modesto, Ca. 7 of the 10 foals presented were awarded premium. Christianne, the breeding director said that “If the foals get any better, he’ll have to start scoring them downward because there is no where left to go up!”

Now that our babies are so great, in all our registries, we need to start putting our energy into training our Great young horses so they’re scoring as well in their disciplines as they are at their foal inspetions.

As far as a mare making premium at ISR/ONA one year, and then down the road, sometime, not getting premium in another registry, who knows what has happened? Maybe she’s had a few foals. Maybe she’s gone lame. That works both ways no matter which registry she’s been approved with and now she’s older, and seeking approval with a different registry.

www.hiddenvalleyfarms.net

All the posters who say “I heard this”, “I heard that”, but do not give actual facts. Prejudicial charges come from both sides, so it is impossible to judge on a bb what the actual truth is. It would make more sense to give names, facts, figures and registry.

I don’t have the 2007 stats yet, but in 2006, Oldenburg (GOV) registered 460+ foals in North America. Somewhere around 175 of those foals earned premium awards - that’s 38%. The inspectors told me that the foals just keep getting better and better each year, primarily because breeders are using better mares. Some specific farms always have a high percentage of premium foals because the breeders there are quite savvy and have invested in good mares and make very good stallion selections for those mares. I suspect this is true for all registries operating in N.A. - as we all know, better mares make better foals, so as breeders become more educated, they cull the lesser quality mares in favor of better mares.

You’re right. As I have no first hand knowledge, it was not a fair statement.

I don’t think that this has anything to do with “feeling insecure”. It is obvious to any normal person what you meant to infer from your post even though you did not state it directly.

Well that explains it. First of all, everyone knows that “horse people” are not “normal”. :lol: Second, it is not “obvious” that you knew what I “meant” unless you are psychic. And if so, then you are a terrible psychic since I promise you that it is NOT what I meant. For anyone who took offense, then I apologize.

Look, I have absolutely nothing against Old NA/ISR breeders. I have many friends who are members and breed for that registry. I don’t dislike or judge anyone for that reason. It is your choice. You have your choice and I have mine. My only disappointment has to do with the one who currently owns the “O” with the crown here in the USA. I think it is wrong and he should give it back. The Old NA has their own brand. Why do they need hold the German brand hostage?

Foxtrot had a good point. I got to thinking about when and who told me about the inspections. It was so long ago that I can’t even remember. It made me think that perhaps it’s time to forget the past.

Why won’t this thread die?

It made me think that perhaps it’s time to forget the past.
Best thing I’ve heard in a long time. Let’s let this die.

oldenburgh N.A. inspection

i just took my mare and foal to the isr old. na inspection at south farm in ohio. it was only 20 mins from me. this was my first inspection. my mare is a reg. hanoverian elite mare. the foal is holstien. o/o corcavado. my problem was not so much with the inspector. but with the host and some of the other people presenting foals. for one i asked the host one week before the inspection when it was? and she told me it was on the 21st.
which was not true, it was the 16th. thank goodness i checked the old.na. website!!! i also turned in a request for a braider and someone to run my mare and foal. when i got there the host was doing the braiding. she never came to do mine. lucky for me i brought my own braiding stuff and a friend who happened to be there helped me!! there was only 2 fillys there mine and another from pennsylvania. he went before me. and i was next. when me and my husband went to the arena with mare and foal, he came out as we were going in . i went to hand my horses to the runners and he told the runners to go with him and not to run mine. the runners looked at the host and she told them to go with him leaving us standing there!!! two kids i knew said they would do it.
just then a woman came up and said she would do it that she knew what she was doing. well she sure did, she didnt run my horses at all just kind of led them around!! every time the foal wanted to move out she shanked her. needless to say we didnt make premium!! mare did make main mare. foal got branded, i got screwed. the same guy sat with the host at lunch afterward. there is a web site you can see this inspection at. i have never been treated so bad by total strangers. is this behavior common at inspections??
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I have a mare who was approved this year with both AHS and ISR/OLD. Inspections were one month apart…she got just about the same score with each.

People need to not take themselves so seriously. To a great extent…ALL registries are just a money making scheme to a certain extent. Yes…I will continue to buy into it and take my few foals and get them inspected and do get some value from it.

But I don’t consider any registry better than the next. I’ve had very good experience with both inspections/registries and other registries that I’ve explored.

In the end they are primarily just proof my my horse’s pedigree for a potential buyer. I don’t put a lot of weight in the inspection other than its an educated opinion of my horse on that day…just like any other show…I ultimately have to follow my instincts and know my own horses and what I’m trying to produce.

And honestly…if a buyer cares so much what shape the brand is on my horse’s butt…they are really probably NOT the kind of horseperson I want owning my horses. I prefer a horse to be judged as an individual and performance…not based on its “registry.”

This past weekend, I took my Hanoverian mare to our local ISR/Old inspection, and Wendy Stearns did a great job of organization, as usual. A runner and braider were provided, and they had no problems accommodating everyone who needed their services. I have been to this particular inspection several times now and have always had a positive experience.

I don’t understand your comment about the foal being “shanked”, since the trot is judged at liberty.

I’m sorry you had such a bad experience, but it definitely isn’t the norm.

[QUOTE=FAIRMEADOW;5867119]
i just took my mare and foal to the isr old. na inspection at south farm in ohio. it was only 20 mins from me. this was my first inspection. my mare is a reg. hanoverian elite mare. the foal is holstien. o/o corcavado. my problem was not so much with the inspector. but with the host and some of the other people presenting foals. for one i asked the host one week before the inspection when it was? and she told me it was on the 21st.
which was not true, it was the 16th. thank goodness i checked the old.na. website!!! i also turned in a request for a braider and someone to run my mare and foal. when i got there the host was doing the braiding. she never came to do mine. lucky for me i brought my own braiding stuff and a friend who happened to be there helped me!! there was only 2 fillys there mine and another from pennsylvania. he went before me. and i was next. when me and my husband went to the arena with mare and foal, he came out as we were going in . i went to hand my horses to the runners and he told the runners to go with him and not to run mine. the runners looked at the host and she told them to go with him leaving us standing there!!! two kids i knew said they would do it.
just then a woman came up and said she would do it that she knew what she was doing. well she sure did, she didnt run my horses at all just kind of led them around!! every time the foal wanted to move out she shanked her. needless to say we didnt make premium!! mare did make main mare. foal got branded, i got screwed. the same guy sat with the host at lunch afterward. there is a web site you can see this inspection at. i have never been treated so bad by total strangers. is this behavior common at inspections??
the[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=akrogirl;5867189]This past weekend, I took my Hanoverian mare to our local ISR/Old inspection, and Wendy Stearns did a great job of organization, as usual. A runner and braider were provided, and they had no problems accommodating everyone who needed their services. I have been to this particular inspection several times now and have always had a positive experience.

I don’t understand your comment about the foal being “shanked”, since the trot is judged at liberty.

I’m sorry you had such a bad experience, but it definitely isn’t the norm.[/QUOTE]

im glad to hear this behavior isnt the norm, by shanked i mean when she was walked on the triangle she was made to make babby steps or half steps not a normal walk. i would go again but with my OWN HANDLERS.

old.na inspect.

i wonder what the inspector would say if he knew that new comers were being treated that way?? not good for business

Fairmeadow- I am very sorry to hear of your bad experience.

I have attended 4 different ISR/Oldenburg inspection sites recently. They ranged quite a bit, other than having the same knowledgeable, friendly German inspector. Some have written programs, an order of go, professional videographer & photographer, music playing in the background, free food, and an abundance of helpers. Others have a dark arena, no PA system, a little confusion, etc. There are so many things left up to the discretion of the host that you are bound to have the occasional first-time site or overwhelmed organizer that really spoils it for people. I imagine this happens in all the registries, unfortunately.

BTW, the inspector likely was not judging your foal when she was led at the walk- this is the time he looks at your MARE’S walk. He evalautes “swing & elasticity of gaits” when the foals move loose in the arena.

Your foal was scored on Conformation, Gaits (just trot, really), and Overall Impression. One of these scores must have been below 8.0 and this is why you foal was not Premium. This judge has seen thousands, probably tens of thousands of foals and is able to see a lot in a little window of time. Maybe your foal was in an awkward growth phase, maybe it is more of a hunter mover, maybe there is something in his conformation you didn’t see, who knows? If the inspector didn’t explain his results to you, I would be very surprised.

I hope you will give the registry another chance. If you choose not to, that’s fine but I hope you will not bash the registry based on 1 bad experience, especially since it sounds like your real issue was the host.

I hope resurrecting this vicious thread does not stir up more nasty and immature behavior.

Honestly I know nothing about the registry aside from the fact that it was formed by ripping off the German brand and riding on the reputation and name of a registry it is not actually associated with. If it is a great registry to be a part of then that is great, but the brand and name should be returned. Aside from the ethics of the above, I think the name/brand issue creates alot of unnecissary confusion. GOV is the registry that registers Oldenburg horses. If you want to breed Oldenburg horses then why not register/work with GOV?