[QUOTE=katarine;7108212]
Hello, my name is Inigo Montoya…[/QUOTE]
Yeah, well I’m Spartacus!!
I’m Spartacus!
Well I’m admiral ackbar RGS.
I don’t spend money with Catherine because…
I’m Slim Shady…
[QUOTE=Ghazzu;7107906]
I gather that the post that she or one of her handlers deleted wasn’t.
And I’m still puzzled that she thinks my name isn’t classy.
Maybe I should hyphenate it.[/QUOTE]
Now this is funny, maybe you should call your Ghad-Zooks to make it classier you know.
Carolina, I read everything she wrote, and in fact was willing to let it be when she first “apologized”, but quickly saw from her comment replies that it was no apology at all. Rabid Garden Snail rubbed me particularly raw because it showed so much contempt for so many amateurs’ struggles.
The point you are all missing, can be summed up here by “amateurs’ struggles”. CH is saying that there should NOT be that much struggle, be it 6 years or whatever. CH is pointing out to Americans that the system is broken by trainers that cannot teach the basics or because clients don’t want to hear criticism. There are good FEI level trainers that take on beginners and make progress with them. But there are more “trainers” at shows, following someone around the warm up with comments like “more inside leg…rounder…etc…” that sound perfectly reasonable until you see who they are talking to. Many times, it is a rider that is appallingly lacking in the basics that CH mentions, like steering. Or even barely remaining in the saddle. Hands are flying all over the place, etc…I even had one adult amateur rider proudly tell me all about her new trainer that was getting great walk/canter transitions on her horse. She then proceeded to show a video where the horse threw his head in the air for 10 steps of completely disorganized jog-trot between the actual walk steps and the canter depart. Delusional.
Get over yourselves America. Most amateurs suck and it’s not because they don’t want to “sweat”. Therein lies the American problem. A work ethic so screwed around that they think they should just keep trying “harder” and will somehow get better. CH appreciates effort like no other, she just doesn’t want to see it so routinely wasted.
It’s laughable that you want an apology from someone finally telling the truth. And if you think you’re so noble–how would a few months of training on the longe line make you feel? I bet you’d have a big problem with that. Now ask yourself why. Because you think you are better than that. Because you have the right to “struggle and sweat”, and by the way, pull your horses mouth around like a ski rope while you try to find some balance.
And before the comments start. I am a rider that thought I was pretty good second level shit. Until I took a bio mechanics lesson, on the lunge line, and learned what it was supposed to feel like. I’ll be on that lunge line happily and proudly and will call CH for a lesson when I deserve one.
All that being said…CH is coming from the German system, with many riding clubs and schools with decent lesson horses. The better question to ask, from this editorial is, how can we get a better training system like that? And that is what she is saying…let her train trainers who can then go out and train basics better. That’s a better system. But until Americans want to learn that way, good luck. Until then, keep telling yourself that that was a good canter depart–at least you’ll believe it if no one else does.
[QUOTE=Ghazzu;7108225]
Point of information:
Snails are molluscs.
Invertebrates.
They don’t get rabies, a disease of mammals.[/QUOTE]
Sounds to me like the princess needs more training herself when making these little comparisons that she uses as props for her arguments. Thanks for that, Ghazzu. 
Perhaps our speech giving classes are better in America than our riding trainers? Perhaps she could avail herself of one…that is, if she can find the time in her oh-so-crammed schedule.
[QUOTE=RubyTuesday;7108265]
Sounds to me like the princess needs more training herself when making these little comparisons that she uses as props for her arguments. Thanks for that, Ghazzu.
Perhaps our speech giving classes are better in America than our riding trainers? Perhaps she could avail herself of one…that is, if she can find the time in her oh-so-crammed schedule.[/QUOTE]
I’m sorry, but are you serious? Princess? Are you honestly calling her out on minutia such as mollusks and rabies? Do you guys have nothing actually intelligent to contribute to the thread?
[QUOTE=Ghazzu;7108225]
Point of information:
Snails are molluscs.
Invertebrates.
They don’t get rabies, a disease of mammals.[/QUOTE]
Friend of mine who is a vet for a wildlife sanctuary was berated by Someone Official for not vaccinating an owl for rabies. She also had to write up a health certificate for a giant millipede. She was hoping that same someone would ask her about vaccinating the millipede for rabies. :lol:
- I love longe lessons. Curiously, I’ve found it difficult to find trainers who want to give them. I am lucky, actually, in my backwater, to live 5 minutes from a trainer who enjoys giving them and a horse she especially likes to use for them.
(In the hunters, when I grew up, we didn’t have longe lessons. We just had to ride without our reins period. Sometimes… but not always… they were still on the bridle, just knotted into the mane.)
-
Fewer trainers every year - in any discipline - have any school horses at all, let alone schoolmaster horses that are useful for developing dressage riders. The economics of the situation suck and only will get worse as our older trainers retire and younger trainers without the benefit of inexpensive real estate struggle to make their businesses pay.
-
The real reason people are using RGS is because Rabid Garden Snail is just so gosh darn fun to say and contemplate. It is a fine piece of writing and imagery doomed to become a COTH meme, like ‘Where’s the Fruitbat’ and ‘Smurfs’.
I have little to add, other than I so enjoy the intellectual banter of the dressage forum. Seriously. Love having my morning coffee and sauntering over from eventing land to read with interest what others have to say.
Here are my minor points:
- Go to a local show in Germany. There are a lot of rabid snails competing who struggle to sit the trot, steer vaguely, and have horses saluting the clouds with their noses. Bad riding is everywhere.
- There will always be some people who, no matter how much training they receive, never can ride adequately. They are simply physiologically and perhaps psychologically limited. We know who they (we) are. They can sit down with a cup of coffee and talk endlessly about dressage and so so intelligently. They spend much $$ on good horses (if they can). They have good and patient trainers, who work on the same basics week after week. They attend clinics and thoroughly enjoy them. They never get it. But they are often our best friends, if not actually us.
I hate the idea of excluding these people. They pay their $$ and they work and God bless them, they don’t give up.
Call me a softie, but I think trainers should understand that sharing their knowledge, even with those who have no promise of shining, is a good thing to do. If heir clinics don’t fill with top riders, then why not?
Maybe Ms CH takes herself a tad too seriously.
I am biased because I had her students in my barn many many years ago, and was troubled by the way they rode (double bridles at all times; callouses from the curb on the inside of their jaws; always cranked in and running off their feet). But I am certain that she doesn’t train or ride this way now that she has had good training.
Irony.
I am not a rabid garden snail. I am a human being!
- the elephant man
[QUOTE=pony418;7108261]
Or even barely remaining in the saddle. Hands are flying all over the place, etc…I even had one adult amateur rider proudly tell me all about her new trainer that was getting great walk/canter transitions on her horse. She then proceeded to show a video where the horse threw his head in the air for 10 steps of completely disorganized jog-trot between the actual walk steps and the canter depart. Delusional.
Get over yourselves America. Most amateurs suck and it’s not because they don’t want to “sweat”. Therein lies the American problem. [/QUOTE]
You must have attended the same clinic on class and tact as CH. any good point you try to make is lost in your hostility.
^^^ indeed!
Geeze oh Pete, for Cripes sake!
If CH is continuing to see students struggling over the years (and how can that be, since she’s been in Europe for 20 years? Did she come back to teach?) she needs to look at her own teaching. A really good lesson will stick.
Suzy, so hypocritical of you to criticize others for not putting out their real names while not putting out your own. I don’t care what anyone’s name is on here, unless someone starts harping about mine.
[QUOTE=paulaedwina;7108221]
You killed my father, prepare to die!
Carolina, I read everything she wrote, and in fact was willing to let it be when she first “apologized”, but quickly saw from her comment replies that it was no apology at all. Rabid Garden Snail rubbed me particularly raw because it showed so much contempt for so many amateurs’ struggles.
In fact I may add RGS as an honorific (is that the word?) I mean instead of PhD, MSPH or any thing like that I think I shall heretofore be named PaulaEdwina RGS. It sounds vaguely noble doesn’t it? Like an Order of the Garter or something :lol:.
BTW this RGS effectively communicated leg yield to her draft cross today. I was so thrilled I burst into song. I rather felt like Celine Dion (It’s all coming back to me).
PaulaEdwina RGS[/QUOTE]
Evidently I’m missing something. What apologies are you talking about?
I have watched a significant number of rider over the last 8 years taking dressage lessons once a week even though they have no particular goals or aspirations. They like the lessons, don’t want to work in the interim - or have schedule issues, family issues or want to trail ride… These people may show locally now and then, a few may ride in clinics, but basically they are “tinkering”. This is not the FAULT of the instructor, nor is it a reflection on said trainer’s ability to actually teach. Should trainers stop teaching these people? I don’t think so unless they are in such demand that there is no time. In my hunter days I knew people who took weekly lessons because they wanted to ride and do little jumps; had no horse, probably never would. Same issue, not ALWAYS a reflection on trainer quality.
- There will always be some people who, no matter how much training they receive, never can ride adequately. They are simply physiologically and perhaps psychologically limited. We know who they (we) are. They can sit down with a cup of coffee and talk endlessly about dressage and so so intelligently. They spend much $$ on good horses (if they can). They have good and patient trainers, who work on the same basics week after week. They attend clinics and thoroughly enjoy them. They never get it. But they are often our best friends, if not actually us.
I hate the idea of excluding these people. They pay their $$ and they work and God bless them, they don’t give up.
Call me a softie, but I think trainers should understand that sharing their knowledge, even with those who have no promise of shining, is a good thing to do. If heir clinics don’t fill with top riders, then why not?
Maybe Ms CH takes herself a tad too seriously.
Your second point really resonates with me as I used to board horses and teach. I understand CHS’s comment about the rabid garden snails because I had a couple in my barn and witnessed numerous others in other barns. These people love their horses, love being around like-minded people, and like riding. But they don’t have an all-consuming passion or drive and, outside of lessons, they don’t push themselves. So, they never really advance in their riding. I think this is something CHS is going to have to come to terms with; not everyone is as motivated as she is, and that’s not a criticism of the RGSes or CHS, it is just what it is. They recognize and are content to putter about, talk dressage, and lavish love on their horses. None of these are bad things by any stretch. And, those who can afford it like to ride in clinics with BNTs. The others like to audit—they truly enjoy watching good riders on talented horses, but it’s as much a social venue for them as anything else. Again, nothing at all wrong with this as they help defray the clinic costs. So, yes, God bless them!
OTOH, there are the students who just never seem to get it no matter how many lessons they take. You can devote endless hours into teaching the basics, and they still can’t sit the trot or put the horse on the aids. After a few years of grinding away at training level, the student gets frustrated and goes to a different trainer. In three years, she is still barely a training level rider, but she is competing at 2nd or 3rd level and riding the “tricks.” She is receiving embarrassingly low scores but at least she’s moving up the levels. Her new trainer has to make a living and realizes the only way to retain this student is to teach the horse the tricks and send her out at 2nd/3rd or whatever level. I personally don’t think this is ethical, but I totally understand having to make a living. Also, what I’ve come to learn is that a number of riders are perfectly content with this scenario.
Then we have the super motivated AAs who may not have stellar horses (most likely don’t) but are extraordinarily motivated, ride every day rain or shine, and soak up every learning opportunity available to them. However, heaven help them if they live in areas of the US dubbed dressage wastelands because, in many cases, they cannot move to a “richer” dressage climate because of family and/or job commitments. So, there has to be a way to get the trainers to them (see yesterday’s new thread on that topic).
Finally, we have the AAs who think they are super motivated but only ride 2-3 times per week, have limitless excuses for not riding, rarely ever take a lesson even if instruction is available (see a couple of meup’s posts regarding that), and then whine endlessly. I’m sure in their own minds they think they are working hard, but they’ve never been immersed in a topnotch training regimen, so they actually have no clue just how hard the work really is and the commitment involved. And, it’s not about having enough money as proved by people like Michelle Gibson, CHS, Shelly Francis, etc. etc. It’s about how hard you are willing to work and how much you are willing to sacrifice. These people are willing to give ALL in pursuit of their passion. The rest of us are able/willing to give at varying yet lower levels. I think people have to be honest about just how much they are willing to sacrifice for their sport, or they end up disgruntled and frustrated. I’d love to have more horses to ride, take more lessons, go to clinics, etc., but I’ve made some life choices that prohibit that. For me, the trade-offs are worth it, so I’m going to enjoy what I have and can do and not whine about what I don’t have and can’t do.
As to your last comment, I don’t think it’s a case of CHS taking herself too seriously but rather that she hasn’t come to terms with the fact that very few people have her motivation. I’ve read enough about her history to know that she was not born with a silver spoon in her mouth and has pursued dressage passionately and relentlessly. She has obviously made a lot of huge sacrifices along the way, including moving to Europe for 10+ years to pursue her passion—really, how many of us would be willing to do that! And, while in Germany, she was surrounded by people with her same mindset. Returning to the US is probably something of a culture shock for her.
[QUOTE=grayarabpony;7108419]
Suzy, so hypocritical of you to criticize others for not putting out their real names while not putting out your own. I don’t care what anyone’s name is on here, unless someone starts harping about mine.[/QUOTE]
My name IS Suzy. I have said nothing that could negatively impact CHS’s reputation. That’s the difference.
