What did you have to say about the riders at Cesar’s? I remember being soundly thumped on here for suggesting those riders, working students, etc. had any responsibility.
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The other people in the arena are not public figures, Olympic athletes, and role models in the sport we all share. Simple as that. They are flawed, but not under public scrutiny.
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And just to give another perspective to this use of a long whip….
Several years ago I rode in a clinic given by a good dressage rider.
One of the participants had a big mare who used to be a jumper and the rider was extremely disappointed…. Her horse was a headshaker and it was nearly impossible for her to get her moving in an arena… as far as I remember she avoided contact to other riders in her barn because everybody told her to get rid of this horrible horse. When the mare was asked to canter she bucked.
So the clinician watched her a little and then he got a long whip and told the rider that it was necessary to get the mare to move forward no matter what. So basically he drove her forward no matter what with this long whip… I am sure most people without knowing the story would have classified him as a horse abuser…. In the next lesson he grabbed the whip again ready to repeat the procedure… the mare was obviously smart and was a lot more forward going already… and during the clinic you could watch the improvement . As far as I remember the lady was able to canter in the last lesson of the clinic…and…. The mare stopped with the head shaking (I guess she was busy to focus on her rider)…. I regularly meet her in clinics and it’s amazing how much progress they made. The rider is now focusing on dressage movements and she loves her mare and nobody would guess that there were ever any problems… I believe this trainer made the horse and the rider happy by showing them the right way……
So there are always more things to consider then simply rejecting something….
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Are you an international competitor?
What on earth qualifies you to watch this video and instantly assess that this training method is wrong?
Every single adult amateur who has been struggling to put their horse on the bit for two decades can look at this video on their phone and INSTANTLY figure out that this is completely indefensible, but these poor inncocents who have somehow accumulated a private stable and a horse that is worth more than my house and have called a multiple time Olympian in for private lessons could not POSSIBLY be expected to know any better.
Ok.
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The now 19 year old according to all the articles that mentioned their age.
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So, did you have lessons with one of the best riders in the world when you were 15?
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I was on that William thread loudly wondering why anyone would send their horse to Cesar in the first place when there are like 6 other Olympians who aren’t widely known to be tough on the horses within a 20 minute driving radius of that barn.
I repeatedly stated that his reputation for being tough on the horses absolutely preceded the William situation.
Feel free to find the posts of me singing this exact same song ten years ago or whenever that was.
I also, by the way, repeatedly shat on George Morris for being abusive to riders and not worth the hype for years before he got set down, and had zero sympathy for that adult amateur who beat the bahoohoo out of her horse at Del Mar or her trainer.
I challenge anyone to dig through my decades long post history and find a single example of my position on this being inconsistent.
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Yes, I was a working student for Lendon Gray when I was in highschool.
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That ad hominem attack on a 16 year old is all that people can grasp at to avoid reality about their fallen hero. I feel for those people too. It’s incredibly disappointing to learn this about Dujardin and especially disappointing to see what she did.
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I agree with you 100%!!! And that’s exactly why dressage has developed the way it has…
Anja Beran opened my eyes (and it’s telling how she gets ignored in Germany) Uta Gräf rides with her once in a while and they get along well.
It’s very very sad…
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Anja Beran isn’t ignored at all. She’s a giant.
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If that’s the case, (and I believe you) as a teacher trying to teach effective methods of change it would be nice to teach methods that might have prevented the 737 MAX. Because we all know that people who see systemic failure in progress (dressage, engineering) are not going to vote with their feet and immediately leave en masse to save X from inevitable failure. That’s Hollywood. We’ve all met “people”. They are subject to inertia, mortgages, peer pressure, student loans, self doubt and so on. Most of the time the person I see screaming from the mountain top (or this bulletin board) about something is also free from any repercussions for their point of view. They’re not wrong, but they aren’t exactly a profile in courage either. Ultimately there are very few Karen Silkwoods in society.
To be honest, I have NO idea what the solution is, but if what I heard in your class aligns with what you’ve written here, I believe I would be left with a feeling of “that’s all a little too pat and unlikely to effect change in the real world”. That said, I recognize that a few posts is not an entire course…
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Sorry Lendon Grey is for sure a great rider and was probably a better teacher for you then some of the bigger names but I am not sure whether she is in the same Liga as CD or some of the other European riders…
And I dont want to sound snobbish
I rode in the barn of pro dressage rider who was German Champion at that time… of course there was the clear understanding that I would never tell anybody anything I saw. Otherwise he would have kicked me out immediately. And IMO everything he did he communicated in a fair way to the horses… and he was still trained in the classical way before Rollkur started. So for me it was an amazing time (which I should have valued even more then I did because he moved away shortly after). But believe me I did see some rough things…
Are you a public figure or international role model?
No?
But you can watch this session on your phone and INSTANTLY determine that this training method is indefensible?
But these folks whose horse is worth more than your house and who have the connections to have a multiple time Olympian come to their private barn for lessons, they could not possibly be expected to make the same assessment as every other adult amateur posting on COTH today?
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With dressage riders who show??
I would disagree…. I rode with her and the clinic was certified as CE for all the horse trainers in our area…. guess how many attended 
Don’t get me wrong there were a lot of spectators (I never rode in front of such a big crowd 
) and they drove for hours to watch….
But hardly anybody of them is going to horseshows…
Holy shit… that video is rough, but all three should be suspended/consequences. Kid be dammed, she let her horse get beat and camera person was giggling!!! Even my 13 y/o knows that’s wrong and to escalate to an adult.
Horse wasn’t forward and I get using a lunge whip to help from the ground, but the timing made little sense to my uneducated eye. Looks like CD just got frustrated by riders lack of riding. Not improving jump.
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I’m asking about the thread a couple months ago. I have no idea what thread you’re talking about.
You’ve brought this up twice now. Do you really believe that wealth equals wisdom? You must live on a different planet.
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It’s tough losing a role model. It’s a loss, and everyone processes disappointments their own way. One impulse is to come here today and discuss… and hear one another.
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She literally went to the Olympics on a connemara and scored an 80% in a Grand Prix once back in like 1987 or whatever in those years where the scoreboard pretty much never went above 73.
Somebody who HAS RIDDEN ON AN OLYMPIC TEAM is by definition one of the best riders in the world, Manni.
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