Colonial Classic

[Crystalponies]

Attended this show for the first time over the weekend with our barn. We usually attend Ludwig’s but my daughter was excited to qualify for a “big horse show”, so we and some other people in our barn decided to try this one.

Is it usually very disorganized? Pinned classes, then announced that they made “a mistake”, made everyone turn in ribbons for the “correct” ones. It wouldn’t be an issue if it happened once, but it happened 3 or 4 times. Disappointing and confusing for the kids and embarassing for management. It even happened in their fancy Eq class after the kid who pinned last and was also the oldest, was sobbing like a baby about pinning last while she was still in the ring. They did a little switch-a-roo with the placings and magically she got a better ribbon. She is from our show series but it doesn’t make it right.

Judge in the pony ring on Saturday was awful. Too many kids to judge fairly and they did not split the hack classes into 2 groups for safety. Watched some disasters, watched some really sloppy “Eq” get pinned. It could be the most political local show we have ever attended, sloppiness didn’t seem to matter whatsoever. And my kid wasn’t even riding in the classes in question.

We qualified through AHS, but it seemed like the show manager favored riders from her own horse show series, Freedom, and gave weak answers when trainers questioned the questionable judging and lack of class splits with unsafe numbers. Looked like the Preakness in some of the canter classes.

Looks like Ludwig’s Corner was the place to be. Better prizes, more reasonable class sizes, still political but seemingly less. And sloppiness doesn’t get rewarded there. We will be sticking to tradition next year and going back to the LCHS country fair.

[ReturnCall90]

I was a first timer there this weekend too but thought it was pretty well-run for the amount of horses they had. Maybe I’m biased because I did well but here are my thoughts:

I showed in the Large Arena that Sandra Brown judged on Sunday and thought she was very fair. There was a dotted line that a few riders crossed and were eliminated right away. It seemed like she judged each division well and consistently, even some divisions where she had to pin the best of the worst. She did split the under saddle classes to canter that had 15+ horses in them.

As for the management, again I had a smooth check in and stable/stall check in. The in-gate girls for the Large Arena ran a tight ship Saturday night and Sunday morning. There were almost 25 horses in the first 3 divisions Sunday so efficiency was key the morning of.

I think for what you’re paying for its a good deal. Compare this to the money you spend qualifying and competing at Zone Finals and it is significantly less expensive. I haven’t heard of anywhere else that you have a finals at Harrisburg for an unrated show series unless you’re going to 4-H states. I also like how you are competing against people you haven’t showed with before.

I can see why Ludwigs is another good option for Labor Day weekend as you still get all braided, it may be closer for you, and they offer good prizes, but I wouldn’t write this show off if a majority of your concern is with the judging. Brooke Brown who runs the show posts often about wanting feedback, so maybe you could contact her. If other people saw the same things you did at the pony ring I bet you would see some improvements for next year.

[lmlacross]

Evaluation form is your friend

Fill out an evaluation form via the USEF website if you genuinely feel like show management and judging was poor enough to warrant it. It’s free and anonymous. If your objective is to let the show know what it must do to improve and remain a viable option for competitors in your area, that’s the only logical course of action.

[Highflyer]

[QUOTE=lmlacross;8831915]
Fill out an evaluation form via the USEF website if you genuinely feel like show management and judging was poor enough to warrant it. It’s free and anonymous. If your objective is to let the show know what it must do to improve and remain a viable option for competitors in your area, that’s the only logical course of action.[/QUOTE]

It’s an unrated local championship show, so USEF isn’t involved.

[lmlacross]

Sorry-- the braiding led me to the wrong assumption.

I’d contact the management and diplomatically let them know what you observed if you hope for it to improve. I’d gauge whether to attend in the future on their receptiveness toward your objective, firsthand observations.

[Crystalponies]

several trainers did speak to management, as I stated in my original post. They were basically given a shoulder shrug and a smile. Our trainer even asked fellow trainers what answers they received when sharing an issue, and looks like everyone got the same lack of answers.

Show secretary and ingate girls were really nice, and tried to answer questions about pinning, but you could sense their frustrations with the mispinnings of classes and trainers getting irritated.

Maybe if they utilized Monday to do some classes, and didn’t try to pack it all into 2 days it would go better.

[vxf111]

Not splitting giant hacks/flats=a major pet peeve of mine and I wouldn’t go back over that alone.

[lmlacross]

Fair enough. I should have recognized from your first post that you were just looking to vent. Nothing wrong with that.

[luvdogz72]

Ahhhh, makes me glad i’m riding at such a low level, i’m oblivious to this stuff.

[Calling_Duck]

For the money, time, and effort spent by the riders, families, and trainers to qualify and attend the Colonial Classic, they deserve to have a show that runs like a well-oiled machine.
Ludwigs Corner was packed this year, three days, three rings, all which ran from sun up to sun down. The weather was great, volunteers were awesome, and they had great judges, too, including Jeff Ayers, Jerre Frankouser, steve Rivetts, and Creigh Duncan.
Riders have to qualify for the Colonial Classic…so judges got to judge “the best of the worst”? Ludwigs Corner is open to all, and there are divisions for all, from beginners to professionals.
Too bad the two shows just happen to be on the same weekend. Weird coincidence, or deliberate attempt by the Freedom folks to poach clients. Who knows. The two teams of show managers are literally fighting for the same pool of riders and trainers. So either go all the way to Harrisburg and make your clients get hotel rooms, stabling, etc…or stay local and have fun over Labor Day weekend, outdoors.

[wishfulthinking711]

Our barn went in its inaugural year. Sounds like it has not changed in the 2 years since we went. My barn went to Ludwigs last year and I just got back from going with them to Ludwigs this year. LCHSA much preferred!

[comingback]

So you have to qualify for this show, yet there are huge numbers? I don’t get it. Can’t they cap it? You can only do so much in so much time.

I’d much prefer LCHS than schleping up to something that sounds that disorganized.

[WendellsGirl]

[QUOTE=wishfulthinking711;8832768]
Our barn went in its inaugural year. Sounds like it has not changed in the 2 years since we went. My barn went to Ludwigs last year and I just got back from going with them to Ludwigs this year. LCHSA much preferred![/QUOTE]

We had the same experience as wishful…went the inaugural year and were very stressed out by the general chaos and disorganization. It’s a cool idea, but it seems no one is improving it year to year, except for the show merchandise being sold!

[Pennywell_Bay]

[QUOTE=comingback;8832839]
So you have to qualify for this show, yet there are huge numbers? I don’t get it. Can’t they cap it? You can only do so much in so much time.

I’d much prefer LCHS than schleping up to something that sounds that disorganized.[/QUOTE]

It is the top 3 riders in every division, from every horse show series. http://www.colonialclassichorseshow.com/participating-series. If you know any of those series, you may be able to guess why it is so disorganized (not every series is a mess, but a lot are. Some are great.). Some of the riders are downright scary- so I don’t know if it is just an organization nightmare or it is hard to herd a bunch of cats.

I agree the principle is good. Being run at Harrisburg, it allows riders who would never be able to participate in a “big show” have that opportunity. It is a young show so going through some growing pains.

[findeight]

Sometimes there are reasons an apparently good trip is not pinned because the rider DQed themselves that may or may not be announced or obvious-like crossing that “dotted line” on a courtesty circle, jumping the wrong last fence or deemed off course in an Eq pattern or test. Earlier poster observed some of those, maybe they weren’t the only ones

Maybe there were honest mistakes sorting out who got what ribbon in which class…especially with open cards and big hack classes full of bay horses and blue jackets with none of them clearly the best getting 90 and a whole bunch about the same between 67-72. Those best of the worst classes are wicked hard to keep track of and keep anybody happy.

Having worked a good number of shows, can assure you when anybody challenges the judges opinions, you are going to get shrugged shoulders and a smile. Nobody can explain the judges decisions except the judge, certainly not the show staff hat didn’t even see the class. You have to ask to see the cards or speak to the judge AFTER they are done and they can say no. Just because trainers are openly complaining about placings to management doesn’t mean they are right, they could be blowing hot air to try to impress clients they know were judged properly, it’s easier then risking future income by telling client the truth. And that happens at rateds too and why you can’t aporoach a judge directly.

Anyway, not saying this was a sterling example of a well operated show, maybe it was a cluster. But some things OP has cited that did not effect her kid may have involved mire then what she observed or nit exactly as related to her by somebody else whose kid was not pinned as that kids parent/trainer thought they should be.

I usually give a show a couple of chances before deciding to not ever go back and base that on bad conditions like not controlling the in gates, holds for no reason, poor course design, unsafe situations, no parking etc. etc. Disagreeing with the judges decisions just means I avoid that judge in the future, not never show at that venue again because they hired an iffy judge, IMO.

[lcw579]

[QUOTE=Pennywell Bay;8833136]

I agree the principle is good. Being run at Harrisburg, it allows riders who would never be able to participate in a “big show” have that opportunity. It is a young show so going through some growing pains.[/QUOTE]

BUT if you are looking for local prestige a ribbon from Ludwigs means a lot more than a ribbon from the Colonial Classic. I also find it suspect that this new organization chose the same weekend that Ludwigs has been held for 75 years (I think). There is a fight going on for the local dollar but that move seemed beyond the pale to me.

I’ve taken my daughter to show at the PA National. IMHO it is not a “Wow! Can’t wait to show there” venue. Going to the big show is one thing (and I’d be inclined to skip it even if she qualifies again) but for a local yokel series final? No way. Why anyone thinks that is a fabulous place to go to a show is beyond me.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=lcw579;8833272]
BUT if you are looking for local prestige a ribbon from Ludwigs means a lot more than a ribbon from the Colonial Classic. I also find it suspect that this new organization chose the same weekend that Ludwigs has been held for 75 years (I think). There is a fight going on for the local dollar but that move seemed beyond the pale to me.

I’ve taken my daughter to show at the PA National. IMHO it is not a “Wow! Can’t wait to show there” venue. Going to the big show is one thing (and I’d be inclined to skip it even if she qualifies again) but for a local yokel series final? No way. Why anyone thinks that is a fabulous place to go to a show is beyond me.[/QUOTE]

Especially because Ludwigs always has run a terrific show. I mean, it’s fun and organized and feels important-- they know how to do things right. I would be hard pressed to want to go almost anywhere else if I was close to LC and the dates conflicted. It’s just a consistently GREAT SHOW.

[findeight]

Eh, I’ve shown at a few crap shows just because I wanted to show at a particular venue I would never ride in the gate at otherwise. Not defending CC here, just trying to be fair to those choosing to show there, who don’t sound like the most experienced troopers out there and maybe dependent on where second string trainers thought they would do better at. Sounds like both options had good turnouts, only time will tell if competion on the same weekend is a good or a bad thing for these or CC will continue to serve a different market then Ludwigs.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=findeight;8833336]
Eh, I’ve shown at a few crap shows just because I wanted to show at a particular venue I would never ride in the gate at otherwise. Not defending CC here, just trying to be fair to those choosing to show there, who don’t sound like the most experienced troopers out there and maybe dependent on where second string trainers thought they would do better at. Sounds like both options had good turnouts, only time will tell if competion on the same weekend is a good or a bad thing for these or CC will continue to serve a different market then Ludwigs.[/QUOTE]

There are other fairly-easy ways to get to Hburg if that’s your bag. Stirrup Cup isn’t particularly hard to qualify for and is an exceptionally well-run show. The week prior to SC is an open show that anyone can attend, also in Hburg. I’ve heard it’s a nice show too.

[Tenmover21]

[QUOTE=Calling Duck;8832764]
For the money, time, and effort spent by the riders, families, and trainers to qualify and attend the Colonial Classic, they deserve to have a show that runs like a well-oiled machine.
Ludwigs Corner was packed this year, three days, three rings, all which ran from sun up to sun down. The weather was great, volunteers were awesome, and they had great judges, too, including Jeff Ayers, Jerre Frankouser, steve Rivetts, and Creigh Duncan.
Riders have to qualify for the Colonial Classic…so judges got to judge “the best of the worst”? Ludwigs Corner is open to all, and there are divisions for all, from beginners to professionals.
Too bad the two shows just happen to be on the same weekend. Weird coincidence, or deliberate attempt by the Freedom folks to poach clients. Who knows. The two teams of show managers are literally fighting for the same pool of riders and trainers. So either go all the way to Harrisburg and make your clients get hotel rooms, stabling, etc…or stay local and have fun over Labor Day weekend, outdoors.[/QUOTE]

Of course they are poaching clients! I laughed when I heard CC was scheduled the same weekend as LCHS. Brooke Brown had a spat with CCHSA and made her own “Freedom Series” for her kids so they would have somewhere they could win at. I’ve literally watched her pack up her kids in a huff and leave halfway through a division when her kids weren’t winning. Doesn’t surprise me the pinning was a cluster, and there were some questionable calls. What I find funny is that even though it is a “qualifying” show, they basically go down the list and if those who actually qualified don’t want to pay the ridiculous class fees, they just move down the list to fill it. I think the idea is great, but wouldn’t have my students pay to go to a rigged show.

Spent the weekend at Ludwig’s Corner, and the weather was amazing. There were a few issues, but for the most part it was enjoyable. Seemed to be A LOT of confusion calculating Champion & RC, and there were several that were apparently announced incorrectly but then showed up as announced online. Interesting how it can be announced one way, but when you go to pick up a ribbon after another trainer/parent has been up there the results magically changed and the points were added incorrectly. Oh well, there will be politics no matter what show you go to… just disappointing for those involved.