[QUOTE=huntersgonewild;8301976]
Has anyone looked at the owner history on Don Juan going back the last few years of results? Curiouser and curiouser.[/QUOTE]
No USEF results before 2013, owned by River’s Edge for a few months of that year before being sold to KLD (not KDL - sorry to rain on the parade) and ridden by Tori ever since (according to USEF website). No USEF record before that time. Why does this horse make you curious?
[QUOTE=supernatural;8301889]
You can bet that I will never bring any clients horses or support any horse show that hires this reject to judge their horse shows after he serves out his suspension. I’m not putting money in his pocket or any show that supports him. What a LOSER. Is that the best BP can do with all her money…How to go from the top to laughingstock in 10 seconds. What a cluster.[/QUOTE]
Wouldn’t you think that an “R” rated judge, or any judge in the industry, would know the rule book, and what drugs do what and are allowed, better than anyone?
Also, Brigid and Betsee have always stressed that Tori is so involved in the horsemanship aspect of the sport. That being said wouldn’t she know (or want to know) what was being done to her mounts (injections, schooling methods, etc)?
[QUOTE=huntersgonewild;8300344]
No I am not kidding. She is unscathed in that she was not punished other than a small fine. [/QUOTE]
BP submitted an affidavit to the hearing. If she had been present for direct questioning, then we’d really have another side to the story, and a whole lotta hollerin’ goin’ on.
BTW, I would have paid to see George Williams question her. He doesn’t put up with any ____.
[QUOTE=busylady;8300341]
Wow, I just read through everything and, wow. The light that has been shown on the Colvin/Parker/Stewart relationship is very sad indeed. … This story is much bigger than the Derby finals infraction.[/QUOTE]
It’s not only sad, it’s SICK. We’re talking horse welfare here.
And that a junior rider knows, and condones, that the horses she rides are drugged.
After reading the transcript (which made me LOL quite a few times), Scott Stewart is looking like a genius for getting rid of Brigid and Tori when he did. I wonder what the Heritage crew is thinking about all of this…
[QUOTE=busylady;8300515]
I am shocked Tori is still riding Parker’s horses; why would Brigid allow kit, and why would Betsee???[/QUOTE]
Hellloooo…why would Tori want to, knowing how drugged they are ?
[QUOTE=vxf111;8300620]
I take it to mean being his gopher, but it’s not a term I’ve heard before.[/QUOTE]
Although it was written in the transcript as “gopher”, the term is actually “go-fer” as in “go for”. e.g “Send Sheila to go for coffee”, or “I’ll have Brian go for more copy paper.” 
[QUOTE=dp1092;8302012]
Also, Brigid and Betsee have always stressed that Tori is so involved in the horsemanship aspect of the sport. That being said wouldn’t she know (or want to know) what was being done to her mounts (injections, schooling methods, etc)?[/QUOTE]
See my previous post on the role of juniors in this type of mess, but I have another thought. Tori could have been hugely involved in the horses’ programs outside of the horse show scene - I think I remember reading an article that spoke to her being completely in charge of bringing Inclusive back to work after an injury? - but that does not necessarily mean she is included in any decisions regarding care at horse shows. Most of Betsee’s horses that Tori shows spend more time outside of the show ring than in it lately. So Tori could honestly be the one who is mostly in control outside of the show schedule, but when it comes to the part that counts, everyone else jumps in and takes control. Just a thought; again, I have no idea what’s going on here, other than the fact that it’s horrendously wrong.
The BP affidavit isn’t public yet and I imagine there is going to be a lot more evidence coming in this case. The exhibits attached were for USEF’s opposition to the motion for a TRO, and the question is abuse of discretion on the part of USEF. So, I can see why they may not wanted to have included the statement here as BP is not a party to the case. I’m sure it will become relevant at some point, but we are very, very early in the proceedings.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;8301829]
USEF ought to yank the judges’ licenses as well if they are involved in drugging as trainers or competitors.[/QUOTE]
^^^^ THIS
Oh, come on. Tori is basically an adult. One can assume she’s not a dumb girl. If she doesn’t know what’s happening to her horses, then that’s not very horseman like. A true horseman knows everything that’s going on with their horses, from diet to their riding schedule.
In the transcript it said she objected to something Ken wanted to do, so one can assume she knows what’s going on with the horses. Especially if they’re receiving up to 9 tubes of PP and other things 3 hours before it shows - after she has already ridden it 2 times and it’s morning lunge.
[QUOTE=bjd2013;8302066]
Oh, come on. Tori is basically an adult. One can assume she’s not a dumb girl. If she doesn’t know what’s happening to her horses, then that’s not very horseman like. A true horseman knows everything that’s going on with their horses, from diet to their riding schedule.
In the transcript it said she objected to something Ken wanted to do, so one can assume she knows what’s going on with the horses. Especially if they’re receiving up to 9 tubes of PP and other things 3 hours before it shows - after she has already ridden it 2 times and it’s morning lunge.[/QUOTE]
It was clear from the transcript that whatever Ken wanted to do did not involve drugs. And I stand by my previous post: show me any teenager who has EVER stood up to ANY trainer and insisted she will not ride a horse that is drugged.
This isn’t anything new, and anyone who thinks it is has her head buried in the sand. The only difference between now and the “good old days” is that there are more drugs available today.
That there are people here who expect teenagers who have to spend time in school plus make the time necessary to ride at this level, and then on top of that be at the barn every second to monitor every second of the lives of every horse they ride in the show ring is ridiculous.
There’s no excuse for riders not to know what’s going on with their horses! Our teens, and adults know exactly what their horses are fed, (we all help at feeding time and don’t have grooms) and actually handle their horses! I will take my more forward, shows expression horse over these dead no expression horses any day! Poor things 
a few weeks ago at a show, one Pro put in a lovely round and then had me shaking my head with my trainer when he came out and said “he’s too fresh”… What the fruitbat? He didnt put a step wrong but apparently he was too “forward”!!! At that moment I lost respect for this rider, and sadly my mind immediately went to the “hmmmmmmm” mode!
[QUOTE=ynl063w;8302079]
It was clear from the transcript that whatever Ken wanted to do did not involve drugs. .[/QUOTE]
I didn’t find it to be that clear. There was mention of some sort of training technique that VC was not okay with but not what that training technique involved. I can pretty easily imagine training technique is non-speak for drugs.
[QUOTE=RugBug;8302082]
I didn’t find it to be that clear. There was mention of some sort of training technique that VC was not okay with but not what that training technique involved. I can pretty easily imagine training technique is non-speak for drugs.[/QUOTE]
Since it was at Young Riders I’d be more inclined to think it was something to make the horse more careful. I don’t remember what Tori placed but I don’t think she medaled so I could see after the first day wanting to make the horse a bit more careful or something.
Dear Dr. Parker: I have a junior who will happily ride whatever you put her on, all day every day. However neither she nor I will condone drugging to win. She routinely shows up to shows hours before the start time to make sure she knows what she is sitting on each day (ie…did her horse stay in last night due to rain and now is fresh and needs a morning hack) and will work until her fingers fall off or she falls over from exhaustion.
If you want a rider who is willing to win or lose based on her riding skill and the skill of the UN drugged animal she is sitting on that day, I have the kid for you.
If you are just going to go back to slipping them a little something, well, that speaks volumes. I wish you the best of luck. But please think about using your position at the top of the pile for good this time.
Um… I think there are plenty of “moms” who are would be more than happy to pimp their kids out (so to speak) to Betsee Parker with no strings attached.
Go to the end of the line if you have conditions…
[QUOTE=skydy;8302091]
Um… I think there are plenty of “moms” who are would be more than happy to pimp their kids out (so to speak) to Betsee Parker with no strings attached.
Go to the end of the line if you have conditions…;)[/QUOTE]
Oh I am sure there are…obviously my post was a bit sarcastic as I’m sure BP isn’t reading this thread nor looking for a new rider. It is sad though that she probably could easily find a replacement who’s family or legal guardians would not care one whit if the animals their child is riding are drugged into dead quiet. It goes on all over anyway, as we can all acknowledge.
You are right, I’m sure, that my insistence on a level playing field free of drugs would probably push DD to the back of the line, lol.
I just hope that somewhere, somehow there is some positive fallout or change from this high profile mess.
[QUOTE=ynl063w;8301990]
No USEF results before 2013, owned by River’s Edge for a few months of that year before being sold to KLD (not KDL - sorry to rain on the parade) and ridden by Tori ever since (according to USEF website). No USEF record before that time. Why does this horse make you curious?[/QUOTE]
Because after Rivers Edge, the horse is alternately owned by Brigid and Karen, back and forth several times, then is eventually put in an LLC early this year. At Washington last year, Brigid and Karen were both listed as owners of the horse. I wonder who the owners of the LLC are. We know Karen is one based on the USEF website but I do not believe that all owners have to be listed on there. I think the suspension calls for any horses that Brigid has an ownership interest in to be suspended. Maybe nothing but if you look carefully, the ownership changes are frequent and there are are many shows where Brigid is listed as the owner and then shortly after the Inclusive test comes back positive (it looks like they knew by the end of last year), the ownership changes to an LLC. That is curious to me. It is also interesting to me that based on the lawyer’s email in December 2014, Rivetts was represented by the same lawyer who is now representing Brigid in the New York case.
[QUOTE=RugBug;8302082]
I didn’t find it to be that clear. There was mention of some sort of training technique that VC was not okay with but not what that training technique involved. I can pretty easily imagine training technique is non-speak for drugs.[/QUOTE]
I understood there was a not very pleasant thing that Ken wanted done at a certain jump. Tori did not want this because “she is empathetic” according to Brigid. Not drugs…something else that would hurt.
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