[QUOTE=oneequestrienne;8308857]
After reading this entire thread, I have been reading through the USEF transcripts. I can’t seem to find a transcript of Betsee’s testimony. Did she have to give testimony? If so, which of the documents is it?[/QUOTE]I think it’s because she’s not contesting it. The documents that were made public are those relevant to BC claiming that she’s not the responsible party.
[QUOTE=Carolinadreamin’;8308849]
What’s amazing is that even after Brigid Colvin’s civil suit, blowing the cover off the doping, Tori was still out there showing, the horse was out there showing, Brigid was still out there being a stage mom/trainer/whatever, the trainers were still out there doing their thing, Betsee Parker was still out there posing for photos and pretending to be a doctor…where is the shame, the accountability, the sense of something has gone terribly wrong, the concern for the horse??[/QUOTE]
If they had all that, there would have been no positive test, no sanctions, no lawsuit, no transcript … and no thread.
Does any of it matter, in the long run? Does everyone ELSE go on as if none of this ever happened?
It’s not about them, folks. It’s about us. The ones who dope will not be waking up tomorrow with a conscience. If there is to be change, it has to come from the grassroots people who vote on their showing discipline with their presence, their support and their wallets.
I’m not holding my breath that all this outrage is anything more than another interlude before things go on as they were.
Someone said this will have no effect on Tori’s career because everyone will “forget”, just as they have done with other scandals. No, they won’t forget, any more than they have forgotten the other incidents with other big names. They just don’t care, or not enough. THAT’S the problem that keeps the problem going. Dirty players will always be there … it’s the level of tolerance that determines how much they win.’
It’s not that BP, TC & BC will all carry on at horse shows as if it never happened. It’s that the other showers will also carry on around them as if it never happened.
This isn’t the first time there was a need for a major protest in a community that needed a clean-up. Take a look at some history for examples and choices of how some major dissatisfaction can be expressed so that it is heard, and maybe even matters.
Just a thought.
[QUOTE=OverandOnward;8309384]
Does any of it matter, in the long run? Does everyone ELSE go on as if none of this ever happened?
It’s not about them, folks. It’s about us. The ones who dope will not be waking up tomorrow with a conscience. If there is to be change, it has to come from the grassroots people who vote on their showing discipline with their presence, their support and their wallets.
I’m not holding my breath that all this outrage is anything more than another interlude before things go on as they were.
Someone said this will have no effect on Tori’s career because everyone will “forget”, just as they have done with other scandals. No, they won’t forget, any more than they have forgotten the other incidents with other big names. They just don’t care, or not enough. THAT’S the problem that keeps the problem going. Dirty players will always be there … it’s the level of tolerance that determines how much they win.’
It’s not that BP, TC & BC will all carry on at horse shows as if it never happened. It’s that the other showers will also carry on around them as if it never happened.
This isn’t the first time there was a need for a major protest in a community that needed a clean-up. Take a look at some history for examples and choices of how some major dissatisfaction can be expressed so that it is heard, and maybe even matters.
Just a thought.
:)[/QUOTE]
Bravo…:applause: Well said.
I’m not sure why anyone expects the USEF to be any sort of leadert in animal welfare. Once they reinstated horse killers, they lost all credibility.
They are not about exhibitors or horses. They are about horse shows.
[QUOTE=Midge;8309443]
I’m not sure why anyone expects the USEF to be any sort of leadert in animal welfare. Once they reinstated horse killers, they lost all credibility.
They are not about exhibitors or horses. They are about horse shows.[/QUOTE]
With plenty of trainers around, why would anyone still be working with scum like Paul Valliere?
Midge, Not to sidetrack this important thread, but which horse killers were reinstated? I believe that Paul Valiere, Barney Ward and George Lindeman were never reinstated.
How many other horse killers are out there that I have forgotten about? (What a pathetic question to have to even ask. 
)
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;8309455]
Midge, Not to sidetrack this important thread, but which horse killers were reinstated? I believe that Paul Valiere, Barney Ward and George Lindeman were never reinstated.
How many other horse killers are out there that I have forgotten about? (What a pathetic question to have to even ask. )[/QUOTE]
Mandarino
A few hidden cameras by the SHARPS containers at indoors could be fun.
Who drops the most syringes in each night (or morning)? Of course any smart trainer goes to the next aisle anyhow, or takes home the syringes 
Interesting that Gamboa sells Carolina Gold as an “oral supplement”:
http://drgamboavetsupplies.com/epages/d8fe64b7-5223-4afc-aaf8-3e0354482917.sf/en_US/?ObjectID=885423
I suppose those that use it don’t need to be told how to use it. Also interesting that the description fails to mention that it contains GABA, despite the fact that it is listed on the bottle. What’s the difference between Carolina Gold, Easy Gold, and Easy Hunter?
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;8309455]
Midge, Not to sidetrack this important thread, but which horse killers were reinstated? I believe that Paul Valiere, Barney Ward and George Lindeman were never reinstated.
How many other horse killers are out there that I have forgotten about? (What a pathetic question to have to even ask. )[/QUOTE]
Not a convicted killer but certainly an accessory: Dana Tripp Waters was in the big ring at Saugerties helping her child collect a giant check in the AO Jumpers. They announced her presence without batting an eyelash. They must think that everyone who showed in the 80’s is deaf, dead or senile.
[QUOTE=OverandOnward;8309384]
Does any of it matter, in the long run? Does everyone ELSE go on as if none of this ever happened?
It’s not about them, folks. It’s about us. The ones who dope will not be waking up tomorrow with a conscience. If there is to be change, it has to come from the grassroots people who vote on their showing discipline with their presence, their support and their wallets.
I’m not holding my breath that all this outrage is anything more than another interlude before things go on as they were.
Someone said this will have no effect on Tori’s career because everyone will “forget”, just as they have done with other scandals. No, they won’t forget, any more than they have forgotten the other incidents with other big names. They just don’t care, or not enough. THAT’S the problem that keeps the problem going. Dirty players will always be there … it’s the level of tolerance that determines how much they win.’
It’s not that BP, TC & BC will all carry on at horse shows as if it never happened. It’s that the other showers will also carry on around them as if it never happened.
This isn’t the first time there was a need for a major protest in a community that needed a clean-up. Take a look at some history for examples and choices of how some major dissatisfaction can be expressed so that it is heard, and maybe even matters.
Just a thought.
:)[/QUOTE]
It DOES matter – and it is about us. Making sure that people remember and making sure that change occurs is about us. It is only when the collective membership decides that it is important enough to insist on change. And, if we don’t then yes things will go on just as it has and it will be all of our faults. However, because it does matter, perhaps for once it won’t be just a thread here but letters, emails, and voices demanding change.
Correct me if I am wrong, but is it true that in Canada the horse WOULD have been suspended along with the person responsible? Are the Canadian penalties stiffer than the US?
The horse seems to be suspended under the Canadian listings in almost every case: http://equinecanada.ca/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=7695&Itemid=88&lang=en
[QUOTE=SomedaySoon;8308451]
Sadly, I think this is a little naive. IMHO, those parents want their kids to WIN. They are buying them a WIN. I doubt they really care how the trainer achieves that result for them. Maybe I’m too cynical…[/QUOTE]
I didn’t mean that the parents would care about the drugging in itself. I meant that if there is significant risk of the KID getting disqualified (and the pony/horse), then parent$ will help police drugging as well. Not because they think it is wrong, but because they don’t want their kid to miss a year of showing when they have invested so much already. You certainly can’t win if you can’t show… I think that’d get through to the parents real fast, and consequently to the trainers.
Tori Colvin is a lovely rider. And you’ll never be able to taker her equitation wins away from her. I believe she will go on to win many things and wish her the best.
However, you now have to put an asterisk by every hunter class she’s won in her junior career, much like the MLB players and steroids. You knew there was hanky panky going on with Scott Stewart, but some question on her horses and how widespread. Now, thanks to her Mother and this controversy, we now know it was the program. Period. Widespread and systematic. A shame really. She’s a talented young lady and completely ill served by the supposed adults in her camp.
[QUOTE=jr;8309759]
Tori Colvin is a lovely rider. And you’ll never be able to taker her equitation wins away from her. I believe she will go on to win many things and wish her the best.
However, you now have to put an asterisk by every hunter class she’s won in her junior career, much like the MLB players and steroids. You knew there was hanky panky going on with Scott Stewart, but some question on her horses and how widespread. Now, thanks to her Mother and this controversy, we now know it was the program. Period. Widespread and systematic. A shame really. She’s a talented young lady and completely ill served by the supposed adults in her camp.[/QUOTE]
Tori is a lovely rider. However, IMHO it’s naive to think that EQ horses are not prepped.
[QUOTE=justathought;8309784]
Tori is a lovely rider. However, IMHO it’s naive to think that EQ horses are not prepped.[/QUOTE]
I never said eq horses weren’t prepped. Equitation is supposed to be judged on the rider. while a drugged horse might or might not help, I’ll give her the benefit of the doubt since they should be judging HER riding and I’ve seen nice eq riders place with rails, a spook and a shy.
[QUOTE=jr;8309785]
I never said eq horses weren’t prepped. Equitation is supposed to be judged on the rider. while a drugged horse might or might not help, I’ll give her the benefit of the doubt since they should be judging HER riding and I’ve seen nice eq riders place with rails, a spook and a shy.[/QUOTE]
Agreed - but all things being equal a quiet, smooth round on a horse without a spook or a shy will pin better. JMHO - if addressing calming/drugging horses it might be most obvious in the Hunter realm but it certainly does not stop there.
Dana Tripp Waters at a horse show- that is nauseating.
I just today put together a bunch of pieces and realized that Cambridge’s death was never researched. Probably/possibly was as it appeared on the surface -but how easy would it be to just require a simple blood test on a dead horse - even if it doesn’t “qualify” for the automatic necropsy rule.
My heart breaks, over and over, and over…
